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Topic: Eumig 807D Question

Steve Carter
Master Film Handler

Posts: 282
From: Bristol, UK
Registered: Apr 2015

posted September 30, 2015 04:24 AM

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Can any-one tell me if the first load sprocket should be tight on the drive shaft as mine is slipping, there appears to be a small allen grub screw in the side of the sprocket but I can't be sure.I think this is causing the film to stutter in the gate, as the sprocket drive slips on the shaft. I just got this projector as I wanted a standard 8 sound projector.

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Lee Mannering
Film God

Posts: 3216
From: The Projection Box
Registered: Nov 2006

posted September 30, 2015 07:14 AM

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Hi Steve. Captain Eumig to the rescue! [Eek!]

[Eek!]

A few things to check out.

1/ With the mains disconnected remove the black back cover and check the toothed drive wheel attached to its shaft behind the front drive is not loose. If so just re tighten it.

2/ From the front release the super 8 top drive attachment and check the little black mount has not cracked. Over the years I have repaired or replaced a few of these as with age/heat they do split sometimes due to the little allen bolt having been over tightened. If it is that and you cant get a spare I have glued them back together and left clamped over night to stick firm. Glue it back on the metal shaft and gently tighten the bolt.

Hope this is of help.

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Steve Carter
Master Film Handler

Posts: 282
From: Bristol, UK
Registered: Apr 2015

posted September 30, 2015 07:17 AM

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Yes Lee the plastic is broken, what size allen key is it to remove the cog?...

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Lee Mannering
Film God

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From: The Projection Box
Registered: Nov 2006

posted September 30, 2015 07:23 AM

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I'll just check my file back in 5.

Back. History book says 0.050... Very small.

Take it out and use good quality super glue to stick the black parts together.

Tomorrow stick it back in carefully with Bostik and gently tighten the allen bolt.

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Steve Carter
Master Film Handler

Posts: 282
From: Bristol, UK
Registered: Apr 2015

posted September 30, 2015 08:20 AM

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Thanks Lee, I've used an abs glue not sure it will be any use. When you say bostick do you mean actually glue the plastic to the drive shaft as well as using the grub screw? I was thinking of glueing the tiny nut to the plastic in the slot with epoxy then it would not rely on the plastic slot for purchase and give it more strength what do you think?.

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Lee Mannering
Film God

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From: The Projection Box
Registered: Nov 2006

posted September 30, 2015 09:22 AM

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Yes its what I have done in the past quite a few times. The smaller top sprocket does not have to deal with a great deal of torque but its worth putting a bit of Bostik between the metal and thin plastic mount. If you over tighten that little bolt it will split again.

One thing with the Eumig 800 range they are easy to get around.

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Steve Carter
Master Film Handler

Posts: 282
From: Bristol, UK
Registered: Apr 2015

posted September 30, 2015 09:48 AM

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Lee is gorilla super glue any good for this sort of plastic...

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Steve Carter
Master Film Handler

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From: Bristol, UK
Registered: Apr 2015

posted September 30, 2015 09:49 AM

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Lee is gorilla super glue any good for this sort of plastic...

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Paul Adsett
Film God

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posted September 30, 2015 09:54 AM

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My Eumig 810 kept on losing it's top loop during projection, and it puzzled me for a long time until I discovered the crack in the plastic sprocket holder emanating from the tapped hole at the tiny set screw- just as Lee describes. I used a two part epoxy to glue the plastic back together, but when I tightened the set screw the plastic holder still opened up and I had to resort to gluing the black plastic part of the sprocket holder directly to the drive shaft, which has worked fine.
Another example of Eumig overstressing their plastic components.

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Steve Carter
Master Film Handler

Posts: 282
From: Bristol, UK
Registered: Apr 2015

posted September 30, 2015 10:22 AM

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What sort of glue did you use to fix to the drive shaft Paul...

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Paul Adsett
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From: USA
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posted September 30, 2015 10:36 AM

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The stuff I used is called JB KWIKWELD. It is a 2-part epoxy, one part black and the hardener is white.
Equally good would be Scotchweld 2216 adhesive, again a 2 part epoxy.

--------------------
The best of all worlds- 8mm, super 8mm, 9.5mm, and HD Digital Projection,
Elmo GS1200 f1.0 2-blade
Eumig S938 Stereo f1.0 Ektar
Panasonic PT-AE4000U digital pj

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Steve Carter
Master Film Handler

Posts: 282
From: Bristol, UK
Registered: Apr 2015

posted September 30, 2015 11:55 AM

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Thanks Paul...

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Lee Mannering
Film God

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From: The Projection Box
Registered: Nov 2006

posted October 01, 2015 04:07 AM

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Not familiar with Gorilla but it is a good brand so should be OK, I see Screwfix stock it.

If ever you see one of the old 800 range models sold for spares Steve its work keeping one to hand as we are now turning the clock back over 40 years since the 807 was introduced. You'll all know the 800 range got a makeover with a slightly different sprocket change method, improvement to some internal components and these upgraded machines can be spotted by a larger black lamphouse front.

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Steve Carter
Master Film Handler

Posts: 282
From: Bristol, UK
Registered: Apr 2015

posted October 01, 2015 05:00 AM

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Well I didn't pay much for it Lee, so if I can get it fixed it's a bonus, as I have some standard 8 sound films and I needed it for those. Plus my love of silent films which mostly come in standard 8. Some standard 8 prints are really good and sharp, have you noticed this?...

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James Wilson
Expert Film Handler

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From: Norwich, UK
Registered: Jan 2015

posted October 01, 2015 06:19 AM

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Hi Steve,

I do a lot of film transfers and I`ve noticed that Standard 8 most of the time knocks the socks of of super 8.

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James Wilson

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Edwin van Eck
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From: Tilburg, Netherlands
Registered: Feb 2015

posted October 01, 2015 08:04 AM

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Indead! We notice the same. In many cases regular8 films have more bright colors then the modern super8 films! We also do a lot of film transfers.

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Edwin van Eck
Van Eck Video Services

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Steve Carter
Master Film Handler

Posts: 282
From: Bristol, UK
Registered: Apr 2015

posted October 01, 2015 08:06 AM

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Yes James & Edwin I've noticed a lot of my standard 8's are really sharp and of good contrast, excepting the smaller frame size so smaller projected picture I prefer some of my Standard 8 prints, maybe more care was taken back in the day who knows?, which only goes to prove size ain't everything, now where have I heard that before...
Edwin are you going to make a 3d print of this part in the future, as it seems to be a weak point on the Eumig 800 series...

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Paul Adsett
Film God

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From: USA
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posted October 01, 2015 09:34 AM

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quote:
which only goes to prove size ain't everything

Try telling that to a nine-fiver! [Wink]

[Wink]

But there are many people who think that super 8 was unnecessary as standard 8mm had the huge advantage of roll film and precision metal camera gates, instead of that horrible Kodak cartridge. My standard 8mm home movies have a crispness and contrast which I think is superior to my S8 home movies.
No reason that standard 8mm would not have progressed to stereo sound tracks, and all the other innovations that were applied to super 8mm cameras and projectors.

--------------------
The best of all worlds- 8mm, super 8mm, 9.5mm, and HD Digital Projection,
Elmo GS1200 f1.0 2-blade
Eumig S938 Stereo f1.0 Ektar
Panasonic PT-AE4000U digital pj

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

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From: Manchester Uk
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posted October 01, 2015 09:39 AM

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Super 8 did give us a considerably larger frame size though Paul.

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Lee Mannering
Film God

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From: The Projection Box
Registered: Nov 2006

posted October 01, 2015 09:48 AM

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Um... We've been transferring film here for a few decades now and so seen a bit, probably to much. Standard 8 colour home movies are oft mistaken for being better than Super 8 which I put down to the old Kodak stock rather than Std vs Super 8mm frame size. Certainly the 60's footage I have seen over the years looks smashing.

The prospect of Std 8 optical sound was sorry to say short lived but was a goer for a very short period.

9.5 now you are talking Paul! [Big Grin]

[Big Grin]

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

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From: Manchester Uk
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posted October 01, 2015 10:19 AM

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So you think the old Kodak Standard 8mm camera stock is better than the later K40 Super 8mm stock? Is that what you're saying here Lee or have I misunderstood what you're saying Lee?

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Paul Adsett
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posted October 01, 2015 12:33 PM

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quote:
Super 8 did give us a considerably larger frame size though Paul.

Absolutely true Andrew, and all things being equal Super 8mm should be about 50% better in all respects than standard 8mm. I think super 8mm could have been awesome if Kodak had stuck with the tried and proved concept of double 8mm roll film, that is by selling super 8mm as double super 8mm roll film and not in a plastic cartridge. At about the same time that super 8mm arrived, zoom lenses were taking over from prime lenses. and as convenient as these zoom lenses are, they cannot equal the sharpness and contrast of the best prime lenses such as the Kern Switar lenses on Bolex 8mm cameras. I see this every time I use my Ektar f1.0 prime lens for projection.
One place where the larger frame area of super 8mm really shines is in projector screen brightness, where it pays off handsomely, and of course the faster linear speed of super 8mm has to give better mag and optical sound quality,

--------------------
The best of all worlds- 8mm, super 8mm, 9.5mm, and HD Digital Projection,
Elmo GS1200 f1.0 2-blade
Eumig S938 Stereo f1.0 Ektar
Panasonic PT-AE4000U digital pj

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Dominique De Bast
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From: Brussels, Belgium
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posted October 01, 2015 01:55 PM

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Paul, the difference of the picture size between standard 8 and super 8 is far from the difference between 9.5 :-)

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Dominique

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John Hermes
Expert Film Handler

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From: La Mesa, CA, USA
Registered: Nov 2008

posted October 01, 2015 02:14 PM

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I have been doing transfers for about thirty years and shot home movies from about 1970. One thing I've noticed is a difference between the original Kodachrome (up to 1961) and Kodachrome II. Although the latter version was sharper with less contrast, it is alone prone to varying black levels at times. Especially the early-to-mid-1960s stuff had a tendency to have too high of a black level in bright sunlight with halations around white objects such as someone's shirt. The original Kodachome never had this issue. When everything is right with KII, regular 8 can look excellent, comparable to super 8. Under the right lighting conditions, the original Kodachrome can look awesome, where its high contrast is to its benefit. I've had some 1950s 16mm Kodachrome that is just fantastic, with a "look" that KII just didn't have. I still lament that Kodachrome (in all its versions) is gone as it was one of the greatest developments ever in photography.

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John Hermes

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Lee Mannering
Film God

Posts: 3216
From: The Projection Box
Registered: Nov 2006

posted October 02, 2015 06:15 AM

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The old chaps always used to mute at our Cine Society it was a backward step going to K40 Andrew. Yes I've seen some astounding images over the years for Std 8 Kodak more recently a guy who filmed a 1 hour Scope holiday, it was interesting getting that on Blu-Ray for them.

Lets get back to the wonderful Eumig 807D. [Smile]

[Smile]

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