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Author Topic: Kindest projector to Film?
Alan Rik
Film God

Posts: 2211
From: New York City, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted June 02, 2015 07:36 AM      Profile for Alan Rik   Email Alan Rik   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I know that everyone here has an opinion on the best Super 8 projectors ever made, Elmo, Fumeo, Beaulieu, Eumig, Bauer, etc.
But which projector would you put any film through knowing it will always come out the other side in the same condition it went in?
My vote would have to be the Bauer T510/610. I have never had a film eaten up or scratched by them. It is also very forgiving of various film types, curls, and conditions.
I love my Elmo and Beaulieu but sometimes if the film isn't perfect in certain spots they can "act" up and cause a racket!
Which projector do you think is the kindest on film?

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Paul Adsett
Film God

Posts: 5003
From: USA
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted June 02, 2015 08:02 AM      Profile for Paul Adsett     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I would unhesitatingly put my most precious film through my Eumig 938, it threads flawlessly every time and never scratches my films. I love my GS too. but there is always that nagging doubt about whether it will mark up the film this time around.

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The best of all worlds- 8mm, super 8mm, 9.5mm, and HD Digital Projection,
Elmo GS1200 f1.0 2-blade
Eumig S938 Stereo f1.0 Ektar
Panasonic PT-AE4000U digital pj

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012


 - posted June 02, 2015 08:11 AM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
The Bauer T610 has by far the most delicate handling system of any projector i have ever used. They will only ever scratch the extreme edges of the film even when the cam and follower are completely knackered, Something you don't even notice until the same film is projected on another model with a wider gate aperture.

When all is A1 They simply Never scratch film.They also handle old shrunken acetate stock better than any other projector I have ever used.
The Beaulieu is also trustworthy when all is set up correctly on them.
The S938 is also very kind on film.

I have also had it from good authority the Fumeo 9119 is also good with film handling.

[ June 05, 2015, 06:28 PM: Message edited by: Andrew Woodcock ]

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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James Wilson
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 230
From: Norwich, UK
Registered: Jan 2015


 - posted June 02, 2015 08:22 AM      Profile for James Wilson   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
My B&H DCM filmosonic although made by Sankyo & badged B&H
Never ever given any trouble,or scratched film, a great projector. I`ve used it to transfer film to DVD for the manager of our local cinema.He was very pleased with the results.
I think as long as it has a long leader & you clean the film first you will know if something is wrong before it hits the film.

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James Wilson

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Lee Mannering
Film God

Posts: 3216
From: The Projection Box
Registered: Nov 2006


 - posted June 02, 2015 08:30 AM      Profile for Lee Mannering     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Eumig 938 or a late Elmo GS1200 both of which have given sterling service here over the years.
The Eumig 810D or 824 Sonomatic are also good if working on limited funds.

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Maurice Leakey
Film God

Posts: 5895
From: Bristol. United Kingdom
Registered: Oct 2007


 - posted June 02, 2015 08:33 AM      Profile for Maurice Leakey   Email Maurice Leakey   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The Fumeo 9119 can scratch film as it passes under the lamp-house assembly if the take-up tension is not adjusted correctly.

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Maurice

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Maurizio Di Cintio
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 977
From: Ortona, Italy
Registered: Jan 2004


 - posted June 02, 2015 08:42 AM      Profile for Maurizio Di Cintio     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Eumig 938 on par with Sankyo Stereo 800 and Bell&Howell DCT. The Eumig Series 800 can slightly mark film when used in reverse, because the emulsion side rubs against the pinch roller arm.

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Maurizio

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Edwin van Eck
Master Film Handler

Posts: 312
From: Tilburg, Netherlands
Registered: Feb 2015


 - posted June 02, 2015 11:22 AM      Profile for Edwin van Eck   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I have very good experiences with the Bauer studioline projectors (T502, T610, etc). We use these daily for over 10 years now and never eaten film.

Important is to check film for broken/damaged splices before projecting. When a splice breaks during projection, and you do not stop the projector, the film can get damaged.

Cleaning the film and checking splicer is quite simple, see:
http://www.van-eck.net/videos.php?lang=nl&size=0#

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Edwin van Eck
Van Eck Video Services

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012


 - posted June 02, 2015 11:31 AM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
They are the kindest by a country mile Edwin.

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Gerald Santana
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1060
From: Cottage Grove OR
Registered: Dec 2010


 - posted June 02, 2015 01:02 PM      Profile for Gerald Santana   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The Kodak M100 was the best Super 8 projector made in the USA. Hands down, it's the best I've ever used. I've never, ever seen a problem with that machine when kept clean so, it's my go-to machine for any length films. If you can get one, you may never want to use another. [Smile]

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http://lostandoutofprintfilms.blogspot.com/

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012


 - posted June 02, 2015 02:12 PM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
Great lens, nice powerful lamp just a pity it doesn't have a larger reel capacity. Looks a good machine though.

Never seen one in the flesh though here in the UK.

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Osi Osgood
Film God

Posts: 10204
From: Mountian Home, ID.
Registered: Jul 2005


 - posted June 02, 2015 02:12 PM      Profile for Osi Osgood   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Definitely the Eumig for me! I have the 926 (and would love to lay my hands on a 938 stereo ... thanks to Paul's great praise for the model)!

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"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012


 - posted June 02, 2015 02:17 PM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
The 938 is a really decent stylish machine that runs quietly and IS very good in its handling of film. Slightly better build quality, two step high lamp setting, better (more durable) magnetic head and lens plus an electronic DC drive system, then it would be right up there alongside the "Studioline" T610.

Never had a Visacoustic 2000 but I bet they are a lovely machine to own also.
Edwin has one for sale I believe, but they are not cheap by any stretch of the imagination.

[ June 02, 2015, 03:19 PM: Message edited by: Andrew Woodcock ]

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Maurice Leakey
Film God

Posts: 5895
From: Bristol. United Kingdom
Registered: Oct 2007


 - posted June 02, 2015 02:57 PM      Profile for Maurice Leakey   Email Maurice Leakey   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I have a Braun Visacustic 1000 Stereo which is a good projector. However, it's a pity that it doesn't have an internal speaker (the speaker is separate) and it only takes 600ft spools.

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Maurice

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Paul Adsett
Film God

Posts: 5003
From: USA
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted June 02, 2015 03:05 PM      Profile for Paul Adsett     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
The Kodak M100 was the best Super 8 projector made in the USA. Hands down, it's the best I've ever used. I've never, ever seen a problem with that machine when kept clean so, it's my go-to machine for any length films. If you can get one, you may never want to use another. [Smile]
I once had an M100, and Gerald is right, it is undoubtedly the best built American made S8 sound projector. It looks and feels like the 16mm Kodak Pageant upon which its design is based. It has 1200ft spool capacity, and comes with the superb Ektar f1.0 prime lens. Unfortunately mine had poor sound quality, but if you can find one with good sound then I agree, it's a keeper for sure.

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The best of all worlds- 8mm, super 8mm, 9.5mm, and HD Digital Projection,
Elmo GS1200 f1.0 2-blade
Eumig S938 Stereo f1.0 Ektar
Panasonic PT-AE4000U digital pj

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012


 - posted June 02, 2015 03:06 PM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
I thought it only has 400ft capacity Paul? Are there a few different models?

Yes Maurice, it's the Digital 2000 model that most whets my appetite.800ft spool capacity and even has sync pulse facility. [Smile]

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Paul Adsett
Film God

Posts: 5003
From: USA
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted June 02, 2015 03:09 PM      Profile for Paul Adsett     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Here it is Andrew!:

 -

--------------------
The best of all worlds- 8mm, super 8mm, 9.5mm, and HD Digital Projection,
Elmo GS1200 f1.0 2-blade
Eumig S938 Stereo f1.0 Ektar
Panasonic PT-AE4000U digital pj

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012


 - posted June 02, 2015 03:11 PM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
Very nice Paul, the base looks similar to lab equipment I have used before now, very impresive!

So no model that has a smaller reel capacity Paul?

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Paul Adsett
Film God

Posts: 5003
From: USA
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted June 02, 2015 03:39 PM      Profile for Paul Adsett     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Here is the 400ft Kodak Sound 8, which is very similar design, but this was for standard 8:

 -

Both machines are built like tanks!

--------------------
The best of all worlds- 8mm, super 8mm, 9.5mm, and HD Digital Projection,
Elmo GS1200 f1.0 2-blade
Eumig S938 Stereo f1.0 Ektar
Panasonic PT-AE4000U digital pj

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012


 - posted June 02, 2015 03:44 PM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
Thank you Paul, that clears things up for me. My mistake then sorry, I always had it in my head that they had a small spool capacity. Much more like a luxury Super 8 projector then the M100.

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Paul Adsett
Film God

Posts: 5003
From: USA
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted June 02, 2015 03:47 PM      Profile for Paul Adsett     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Those were the glory days in Rochester NY!

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--------------------
The best of all worlds- 8mm, super 8mm, 9.5mm, and HD Digital Projection,
Elmo GS1200 f1.0 2-blade
Eumig S938 Stereo f1.0 Ektar
Panasonic PT-AE4000U digital pj

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Gerald Santana
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1060
From: Cottage Grove OR
Registered: Dec 2010


 - posted June 02, 2015 07:16 PM      Profile for Gerald Santana   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
In the long run, I think you will see some picture blemishes from most projectors once the print gets to 50+ screenings. Lines and scratches are obviously from badly calibrated or dirty projectors that should really be serviced before use. Always clean the projector parts before you run the show and the likelihood of a scratch or a line resulting is decreased. That's just common sense to the projectionist so, cleanliness in this hobby and business is essential to help preserve prints.

The Kodak Analyst for 8mm is high quality, occasionally fussy with it's remote control if the model is older and left unserviced. There is one with sound as well but, most often produce a very poor tone and low quality volume. No film scratching issues on those models but, bad splices my jam the gate and tear perforations. I know Eumig does a better job for these 8mm sound films-- I'll admit it but, it lacks the Kodak charm and scratch less film path! There is something about those automatic film paths that I don't like.

The old sound models that have been neglected over time may need the boards serviced Paul. I had mine serviced by Pete Richards out here in the Bay Area and he did a fine job of converting it to halogen, improving the sound output and quality, switching the speaker output to 1/4" in., and he put in a new power cord. It was like getting a new machine! For his work and improved results, I gave him a ST-1200 in trade for the modifications and repair -- that's how much I trust this machine to keep my prints running scratch-less while I own them.

Bottom line, Kodak M100's handle up large and small spools, no belts, gear driven, automatic (and manual loading if necessary), 1.0 lens, convertible to halogen, very quiet motor, booming sound, high quality recording capabilities, simple to use and to clean... this projector is very kind to film.

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http://lostandoutofprintfilms.blogspot.com/

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Paul Adsett
Film God

Posts: 5003
From: USA
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted June 02, 2015 08:55 PM      Profile for Paul Adsett     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Sounds like you have a superb machine there Gerald. I really like the design of these Kodak's, which hands down were vastly superior to the plastic junk they made in later years. These are real professional quality working machines, obviously built to last, with nothing flimsy or fragile about them, and the optical design was about the best that anyone else had then or had since.

--------------------
The best of all worlds- 8mm, super 8mm, 9.5mm, and HD Digital Projection,
Elmo GS1200 f1.0 2-blade
Eumig S938 Stereo f1.0 Ektar
Panasonic PT-AE4000U digital pj

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David Roberts
Master Film Handler

Posts: 405
From: Suffolk. England
Registered: Apr 2004


 - posted June 03, 2015 07:57 AM      Profile for David Roberts     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Bauer 500/600 everytime. have lost all trust in elmo since scratching issues with 2 st 1200"s. about half my films damaged by these.

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012


 - posted June 03, 2015 08:02 AM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
Same here David with 5 of em! Never again.

Beaulieu & Bauer T610 all day long now for me these days, though the 938 is also a very nice and kind projector.

Geralds particular machine with its updated modifications, sounds like a superb machine also. If anyone would like to modify another M100 in exchange for another ST1200, I will be happy to oblige anytime!
[Big Grin] [Big Grin] [Wink]

[ June 03, 2015, 10:27 AM: Message edited by: Andrew Woodcock ]

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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