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Author Topic: An optical sound loss idea ...
Osi Osgood
Film God

Posts: 10091
From: #399R K.O.A. Mountian Home, ID. 83647
Registered: Jul 2005


 - posted October 24, 2016 11:59 AM      Profile for Osi Osgood   Author's Homepage   Email Osi Osgood   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Ok, this may sound silly, and it may be even harder to actually implement, but I'll continue ...

I have noticed on some of my optical sound super 8 films, that the optical track actually fades quicker than the color of the film (a good example of that is my print of "Hot Millions" 1968).

Now, when viewing some faded printed, (ol eastman prints), you can use a cyan filter and that restores some of the color that's left (well, it doesn't restore it, technically, just gets the reds out of the picture so you can see what color is actually left).

This makes the reds more of a brownish black ...

Now ...

I have noticed, when viewing a print with color loss, that both the image and the optical track are helped, that is, a purplish or pinky optical track is darkened ...

Since the lighter the optical track, the more weak the sound, if a person could actually place a cyna filter inbetween the lamp and the film, thereby "projecting" back to the optical sound unit, would this actually allow the optical track to play louder?

Inquiring minds wish to know .... [Smile]

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"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "

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Paul Browning
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 999
From: West Midlands United Kingdom
Registered: Aug 2011


 - posted October 24, 2016 01:42 PM      Profile for Paul Browning   Email Paul Browning   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Surely the dark zig zag part Osi is what is producing the sharp loud sound output. If you place any kind of filter no matter what the colour it will darken the lighter centre part of the exposed optical sound track, and will then just muffle the sound completely. The side to side modulations are what produce this sound, you would have to sharpen up the black zig zag effect either side to restore the sound, near an impossible task, unless you have unlimited time on your hands. The alternative would be to black out completely the optical sound track and magnetic stripe it.

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Fabrizio Mosca
Master Film Handler

Posts: 344
From: Milano, Italy
Registered: Jan 2004


 - posted October 25, 2016 01:51 AM      Profile for Fabrizio Mosca   Email Fabrizio Mosca   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Osi, the thing you proposed seems to me the same thing (with reversed colors) that happens with the cyan track on 35mm, where a red light (LED or laser) is used to create the right contrast in the film. With the normal white lamp, the sound is low with background noise, but with the red light it's cristal clear.

It's true, as Paul says, that the center part of the track is also darkened, but what is important is how much it is darkened in respect to the dark side of the track. Brighter lamp? Use of a coloured LED?

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

Posts: 6876
From: Long Island, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted October 25, 2016 06:13 AM      Profile for Steve Klare   Email Steve Klare   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
If you were running through an external amp and speakers you could probably do the same thing by adding a preamp. At the end of the day what you are looking for is a stronger electronic signal anyway.

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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Brian Fretwell
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1723
From: London, UK
Registered: Jun 2014


 - posted October 26, 2016 02:17 AM      Profile for Brian Fretwell   Email Brian Fretwell   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Also, I would suspect, a better signal to noise ratio. Getting better contract off the track would get that a ppre-amp might just increase hiss as well.

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

Posts: 6876
From: Long Island, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted October 26, 2016 04:18 AM      Profile for Steve Klare   Email Steve Klare   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Then you'd need some kind of an equalizer.

For better or worse, there's always some other piece to add!

My mixer does preamplification and it also has a three band equalizer per channel which does a pretty decent job with hiss.

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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Osi Osgood
Film God

Posts: 10091
From: #399R K.O.A. Mountian Home, ID. 83647
Registered: Jul 2005


 - posted October 26, 2016 11:30 AM      Profile for Osi Osgood   Author's Homepage   Email Osi Osgood   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
AHHHHH! That's where the Archer Dolby Surround unit comes into play! [Smile]

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"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "

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