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Author Topic: Kodak's new super 8 camera
Daniel Macarone
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 218
From: Summit NJ, USA
Registered: Nov 2015


 - posted February 07, 2017 08:48 PM      Profile for Daniel Macarone   Author's Homepage   Email Daniel Macarone   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I don't mind that there is no sound for my Super 8 home movies. I love the look too much. Movies are first and foremost about picture. As long as there is reversal film and a working vintage camera, I'm happy. The new Kodak camera has things I don't need and lacks things I want. Great Super 8 cameras were made in the 70's-80's and they are not obsolete.
As far as cost of film for home movies, I can concur you have to conserve film, be selective. You find you don't need to buy alot of film stock because scenes or events without sound have to be brief to hold the viewer's attention anyway. If you are good at editing in camera, you can film an event that is a very entertaining 3 1/2 minutes, maybe even shorter. I think professionals will learn quickly as well, how to be selective.

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

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From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012


 - posted February 07, 2017 08:52 PM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
keep on scratchin' then Daniel!

I'm done with it personally, years ago now.

I ended it around about the Fat Boy slim era..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oF5cBoAV5Ys

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Tom Spielman
Master Film Handler

Posts: 339
From: Minneapolis, MN, USA
Registered: Apr 2016


 - posted February 07, 2017 09:01 PM      Profile for Tom Spielman   Email Tom Spielman   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Andrew, in terms of offering choices, what is it that you would like Kodak to do?

When I look at ways that they could both support traditional sound and new features like SD Card audio capture and MAX 8, I don't see how it could be done without a great deal of expense on their part, further delaying product releases, and creating a confusing product line.

And all for how many potential customers?

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012


 - posted February 07, 2017 09:04 PM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
Simples..

Max 8 - Traditional 8

SD card sound - Magnetic Sound Cartridge

Simples.. even for a Meerkat!

Couldnt give a flying f@%k about their profit margin given all the false pretences they have ragged me out of over the years.

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Bill Phelps
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1454
From: USA
Registered: Jan 2009


 - posted February 07, 2017 09:11 PM      Profile for Bill Phelps     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Well based on your last post it is no wonder your on a non stop rant

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Adrian Winchester
Film God

Posts: 2870
From: Croydon, London, UK
Registered: Aug 2004


 - posted February 07, 2017 10:12 PM      Profile for Adrian Winchester   Email Adrian Winchester   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The debate here would probably now be more constructive if split into two different threads: Forum members who feel it's relevant for the camera to be profit-making and those who don't.

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Adrian Winchester

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Tom Spielman
Master Film Handler

Posts: 339
From: Minneapolis, MN, USA
Registered: Apr 2016


 - posted February 07, 2017 10:22 PM      Profile for Tom Spielman   Email Tom Spielman   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Is that Max 8 and Traditional 8 + SD Card and Traditional Sound all on the same camera? Not so simple. [Smile] I'm not sure I'd trust such a camera delivered next Spring to work much beyond a short warranty period.

Two different cameras? They seem to be having a hard time delivering one.

I work in software for a living and there is this constant tension between features, budget, timely delivery, usability, and reliability. To get something useful and reliable out the door in a reasonable amount of time, you have to make hard choices on features. You simply can't and shouldn't do it all. You can build on what you started further down the road.

Adrian: I did get a chuckle out of your response. FWIW, I don't think they necessarily need to profit on the camera itself, but it does have to lead to more film sales or otherwise contribute to their bottom line. Otherwise there is no reason for them to do it. Kodak needs a sustainable business model or the future of Super 8 won't be very bright for anyone.

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Graham Ritchie
Film God

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From: New Zealand
Registered: Feb 2006


 - posted February 07, 2017 10:46 PM      Profile for Graham Ritchie   Email Graham Ritchie   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Going of topic just slightly fellows, but dont you think this chap sporting a Italian Super 8 T shirt looks neat?... [Cool] [Smile]
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Tom Spielman
Master Film Handler

Posts: 339
From: Minneapolis, MN, USA
Registered: Apr 2016


 - posted February 07, 2017 11:13 PM      Profile for Tom Spielman   Email Tom Spielman   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Do you know the story behind that picture Graham?

Last I heard, the former president was kite sailing with Richard Branson in the Virgin Islands. Anyone who's spent 8 years in that job deserves some time off.

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Graham Ritchie
Film God

Posts: 3936
From: New Zealand
Registered: Feb 2006


 - posted February 07, 2017 11:40 PM      Profile for Graham Ritchie   Email Graham Ritchie   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Tom....to check it out I came across it on "Super 8mm Facebook" its a public group. [Smile]

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Rob Young.
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1585
From: Cheshire, U.K.
Registered: Dec 2003


 - posted February 08, 2017 01:42 AM      Profile for Rob Young.     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I think one thing we could all agree on is that Kodak need to produce a really good demo video using super 8 stock.

This one is just embarrassing;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vXzv_F07BNo

As I have said previously, I would like to see this venture work, so it would be a nice start if they had some dazzling footage out there.

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John Clancy
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1954
From: Cornwall
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted February 08, 2017 04:08 AM      Profile for John Clancy   Author's Homepage   Email John Clancy   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Rob, I too was surprised by the poor standard of that transfer. the actual film is interesting but if that is the standard Kodak will be providing for download once they have done a cine transfer it's not a very good advert.

Andrew perhaps you have misunderstood the possible importance of the new camera and you need to go back to read the entire thread yourself. But also, the history behind the new camera which saw leading big screen directors sign up to help promote it because they all feel that nothing trains new talent like learning the nuances of real film from an early age - and only Super 8 can really do that. The likelihood is that thousands of new camera owners [and mainly people new to Super 8 entirely] will be shooting multiple thousands of Kodak Super 8 cartridges. That should be good news for all of us who want to use our classic Super 8 cameras again because the film stocks will be available. If things take off as it looks like they will then we could find more variety offered in terms of post striping and other services that used to be more readily available for amateur film makers. Having just a balance stripe added has always been an option and by no means a problem. I even had just the balance stripe added to a full feature of The Empire Strikes Back when the first prints available only came with the main stripe.

Now when it comes to using the new film stocks from Kodak in my Canon 814 I will not be filing out the gate in order to shoot the same aspect ratio as the new Kodak camera. I know it's obvious but it seems it needs to be pointed out that this means there will not be a picture on the edge of the film to scratch when I project it through any of my projectors. I've said it before but this venture by Kodak (now in their rather smaller company size) means more Super 8 film cartridges being produced, available for sale and processed. This should fuel the market and hopefully mean costs become more affordable and we can all dabble in Super 8 film making once again. I know some have carried on through more recent years despite the excessive cost but most of us haven't. I for one am hopeful and looking forward to using my favourite shooting format once more despite earning my living through documentaries shot almost entirely on digital video over the past ten years.

Whilst I doubt anyone from Kodak ever looks at this site I wish them every success. I fully understand their attempt to resurrect Super 8 as a viable part of their business and I suggest that it wouldn't stand any chance at all without the introduction of the new camera, the modified 16x9 image and the synchronized digital sound. Produce a new projector to screen the wide format films too and you may even find I'm on the customer list!

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British Film Collectors Convention home page www.bfcc.biz. The site is for the whole of the film collecting hobby and not just the BFCC.

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012


 - posted February 08, 2017 05:02 AM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
New Stock, Old Camera, silent shooting for now.
That's the only way it will be of any use at all to us for the foreseeable then John.

I will give it a go of course, but would love to see more diversity of equipment from whoever inc Kodak, to make this enjoyable for us also.

Maybe it will arrive by others who join the resurgence of Super 8mm again if it takes off as a film product, who knows?
Here's hoping.

I AM also hoping their camera is a success for them, but I seriously have my doubts about that aspect. Another point
where we will just have to wait and see.

I, like you John, will be using a Canon camera or possibly a Beaulieu camera by the time film arrives, but i just hope Kodak equally begin to understand what people want from a Super 8mm camera and what one should look like! [Big Grin] [Wink]

 -

 -

This is not it Kodak. [Big Grin] [Big Grin]

[ February 08, 2017, 06:45 AM: Message edited by: Andrew Woodcock ]

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Graham Ritchie
Film God

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From: New Zealand
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 - posted February 09, 2017 01:32 AM      Profile for Graham Ritchie   Email Graham Ritchie   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Well folks I really do like this camera. Its going to be interesting times ahead, when some serious 8mm film makers use it "and there are a few" will hopefully show the results on you-tube or vimeo. Also with Ektachrome Super 8 reversal film due out at the end of the year, plus Ektachrome slide film, which is something I also want to get back into and support. Anyway not sure you have seen this video but here it is to drool over [Big Grin]

https://youtu.be/Bq1vP0viRO8

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012


 - posted February 09, 2017 01:48 AM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
So I take it you are going to buy one then Graham?

--------------------
"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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John Clancy
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1954
From: Cornwall
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted February 09, 2017 03:37 AM      Profile for John Clancy   Author's Homepage   Email John Clancy   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I'm glad you understand where I'm coming from Andrew.

I forgot to mention that Kodak haven't ruled out reintroducing Kodachrome. That probably seems unbelievable but given the resurgence of film and Kodak entrenching back into their own rather dominant niche market of film I can see them trying to produced a Kodachrome III which would offer similar vibrant results but a less costly processing methodology. This new camera could just be the start. A lot depends on it for most of us on here.

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British Film Collectors Convention home page www.bfcc.biz. The site is for the whole of the film collecting hobby and not just the BFCC.

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Terrance Kott
Junior
Posts: 15
From: Kalamazoo, MI, USA
Registered: Jan 2017


 - posted February 09, 2017 03:56 AM      Profile for Terrance Kott   Email Terrance Kott   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
As of this date what is the projected price range?

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Graham Ritchie
Film God

Posts: 3936
From: New Zealand
Registered: Feb 2006


 - posted February 09, 2017 09:43 PM      Profile for Graham Ritchie   Email Graham Ritchie   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Andrew I would say that in a year or so when the Standard edition comes out, and if its around the $400 mark I would certainly be interested in buying one.

Terrance the Limited Edition wont be far off, but will cost around the $2000 mark, its best to wait for a while and see what price range the Standard one comes out at.

I bet that one will be a lot cheaper, although to date no price has so far been mentioned.

As far as sound being recorded, it will be on your SD card which I guess you can simply import into your computer. Once you download your image, say into something like Movie Maker which is fairly basic stuff, you can edit your picture and sound together, plus a hole lot of extra features you can play around with.

Its going to take time for all this to happen, so what I would suggest is to wait and see what those serious film makers out there do with it, and hopefully share the results, that way we will get a better idea as to what can be achieved with this camera.

Its amazing to think this this new camera is being made at all in this day and age is fantastic news for film making, which was considered by many to be a dead duck years ago.

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Terrance Kott
Junior
Posts: 15
From: Kalamazoo, MI, USA
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 - posted February 09, 2017 11:51 PM      Profile for Terrance Kott   Email Terrance Kott   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Thanks Graham. Each time I watch the preview I want one more and more. But I agree that the first run should be solely for those who were born with "the gift". Some people are just naturals at what they do. I'm not one of those.

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Michael De Angelis
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Posts: 1257
From: USA
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 - posted January 19, 2018 09:47 PM      Profile for Michael De Angelis   Email Michael De Angelis   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Watch the first footage from Kodak’s reborn Super 8 film camera

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Isn't it great that we can all communicate about this great
hobby that we love!

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Mathew James
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 701
From: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada
Registered: Dec 2014


 - posted January 19, 2018 10:26 PM      Profile for Mathew James   Email Mathew James   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I don't know...
To me, that footage just does not remind me one bit of any of my nostalgia films. Maybe it is too processed. I don't get the right vibes from this at all. I just don't see the value. The processing will kill this i am afraid.
I am not sure this will go anywhere outside of some classrooms or small projects. I hope I am wrong.

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Cheers,
Matt 📽

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Michael De Angelis
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From: USA
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 - posted January 19, 2018 10:32 PM      Profile for Michael De Angelis   Email Michael De Angelis   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I was not impressed with the footage.

--------------------
Isn't it great that we can all communicate about this great
hobby that we love!

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Graham Ritchie
Film God

Posts: 3936
From: New Zealand
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 - posted January 19, 2018 10:58 PM      Profile for Graham Ritchie   Email Graham Ritchie   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
It was interesting to hear, as to what is involved in getting this film into production and the fact that some of the chemicals are no longer avaliable made it a difficult process.

https://youtu.be/2jBYtHwvRaw

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Adrian Winchester
Film God

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From: Croydon, London, UK
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 - posted January 20, 2018 03:14 AM      Profile for Adrian Winchester   Email Adrian Winchester   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Some parts of the footage look a lot better than others, so the 74 seconds doesn't do a great job of 'selling' the merits of film. But it's still good to see that Kodak has faith in Super 8!

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Adrian Winchester

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Paul Adsett
Film God

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From: USA
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 - posted January 20, 2018 12:13 PM      Profile for Paul Adsett     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Here's another 2018 CES video about the Kodak S8 camera and Ektachrome

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CUq1agR6pzM

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