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Author Topic: Building 8mm film Cleaning System - Are you interested?
Dennis Bennett
Junior
Posts: 15
From: Milton-Freewater, OR, USA
Registered: Feb 2017


 - posted February 11, 2017 12:10 AM      Profile for Dennis Bennett   Email Dennis Bennett   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Wow, I appreciate all of the discussion. Intelligent discussion leads to improved product design.
We are looking into interchangeable rollers, however, I don't have experience with the original ECCO machine, so I do appreciate comments from experience users. In other words, no need to fix a design if it isn't broken. I've also encouraged the engineer who designed the "First Step - Film Prep" to join this forum and the 16mm forum. This should help us in making design improvements.

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Ali Hipperson
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 106
From: London, England
Registered: Oct 2016


 - posted February 21, 2017 05:42 AM      Profile for Ali Hipperson   Email Ali Hipperson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hi Dennis.

I am very impressed with what I have seen and read in this thread already - and, depending on the cost, would certainly be interested in purchasing a unit.

Well done on bringing a very welcome and useful piece of 'kit' back into the hobby/past-time! [Smile]

Ali.

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We're going to need a bigger shelf!

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David Ollerearnshaw
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1373
From: Penistone Sheffield UK
Registered: Oct 2012


 - posted February 22, 2017 03:34 AM      Profile for David Ollerearnshaw   Author's Homepage   Email David Ollerearnshaw   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I use the ECCO that I bought on holiday in LA. It works great, I used the Spondon long play unit with it. The only problem I have is the plastic pipe that takes the fluid from bottle to pads became brittle and had to be changed a number of times.

The rollers have never been a problem. Your version does look more professional.

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I love the smell of film in the morning.

http://www.thereelimage.co.uk/

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Dennis Bennett
Junior
Posts: 15
From: Milton-Freewater, OR, USA
Registered: Feb 2017


 - posted February 23, 2017 09:59 AM      Profile for Dennis Bennett   Email Dennis Bennett   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Thank you for the latest information especially concerning the rollers. Just to let you know that we are going forward with this project. We are currently researching a source for v-shaped rollers. If you have any sources, please share.
It is also possible that cad views showing improvements will be posted in the future seeking your input.

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Sean Calvert
Junior
Posts: 6
From: Walla Walla, WA, USA
Registered: Feb 2017


 - posted February 27, 2017 08:37 AM      Profile for Sean Calvert   Email Sean Calvert   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hello all,
I am the designer working with Dennis on this system. Thanks for the great suggestions. I've found a tapered roller supplier so I'll make that change to the design. This will allow 8mm up to 35mm width film. I am still looking into a ratcheting advancement mechanism for the cleaning cloth, but I think I'll build the simple version first to get it into peoples' hands and will work on an upgrade for advancing the cloth afterward. If you think of other items you would like to see improved or added, please let me know! Thanks!

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Sean Calvert
Junior
Posts: 6
From: Walla Walla, WA, USA
Registered: Feb 2017


 - posted March 05, 2017 06:46 PM      Profile for Sean Calvert   Email Sean Calvert   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I've added tapered rollers to the design and as they are sized for 35mm film, it looks like all three sizes should work with a common set of rollers. In the attached pictures you'll see 8mm, 16mm, and 35mm film. Each is in contact on the edges of the film with a gap in the center. It is difficult to see with the 8mm, but there is a gap between the contact points.

I'm using 1/8" thick felt so there is 1/4" (about 6mm) of padding between the metal structure. The most the film would need to flex between the roller and the center of the two felt pads is about 1/32" (just under 1mm).

I'd love some feedback. It sounds like we have some interest so I'd like to move ahead with my manufacturing drawings to get some of these built and into your hands. Thanks!

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Paul Adsett
Film God

Posts: 5003
From: USA
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted March 05, 2017 08:30 PM      Profile for Paul Adsett     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Sean, nice 3D model. What CAD program are you using?

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Sean Calvert
Junior
Posts: 6
From: Walla Walla, WA, USA
Registered: Feb 2017


 - posted March 24, 2017 06:41 PM      Profile for Sean Calvert   Email Sean Calvert   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Thanks, Paul!
I use SolidWorks 2017. It's a great design package.

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Sean Calvert
Junior
Posts: 6
From: Walla Walla, WA, USA
Registered: Feb 2017


 - posted March 28, 2017 10:20 PM      Profile for Sean Calvert   Email Sean Calvert   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hello, all!

Thank you for your interest in this machine! I've received quotes for the parts and will be able to sell these for $380. Please let me know, either here or via private message, if you are interested and I'll work on getting an ordering method set up so we can get parts moving.

Thanks!

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Dennis Bennett
Junior
Posts: 15
From: Milton-Freewater, OR, USA
Registered: Feb 2017


 - posted July 07, 2017 05:17 PM      Profile for Dennis Bennett   Email Dennis Bennett   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The day has arrived!
The "First Step Film Prep machine is now available for purchase.
The first machines will be built when 7 orders have been submitted.
Here is the link for ordering.
https://dbennettech.wixsite.com/first-step-film-prep

Thank you for your patience and spread the word.

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Dennis Bennett
Junior
Posts: 15
From: Milton-Freewater, OR, USA
Registered: Feb 2017


 - posted December 07, 2017 09:29 AM      Profile for Dennis Bennett   Email Dennis Bennett   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I know it has been awhile, but Sean is willing to build some machines.
Initially, he was waiting for a minimum number to get starter.
However, he is now willing to start production.

Would you please send a message to Sean or myself to update your interest in purchasing one of these machines.

Dennis Bennett - dbennettech@gmail.com

Sean Calvert - seangcalvert@gmail.com

Here is the link to a website for ordering.
https://dbennettech.wixsite.com/first-step-film-prep

Thank you for your patience and spread the word.

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Chip Gelmini
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1733
From: Brooksville, FL
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted December 07, 2017 07:07 PM      Profile for Chip Gelmini     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SozepDnuSSw

My cleaner in operation cotton rolls are soaked with lubricant upon motion everything moves nothing gets scratched.

(This post amended Dec 8th. Please watch the entire video. The camera starts in the theater, then goes in the booth. A light comes on, and the cleaner is above the scope lens.)

The machine under construction is a very good idea. Kudos to those of you who are interested in making it a reality!

[ December 08, 2017, 02:02 PM: Message edited by: Chip Gelmini ]

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Brian Fretwell
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1785
From: London, UK
Registered: Jun 2014


 - posted December 08, 2017 06:51 AM      Profile for Brian Fretwell   Email Brian Fretwell   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
That link goes to an extract from Star Wars Super8 and shots of the projector when I try it - not your film cleaner.

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Chip Gelmini
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1733
From: Brooksville, FL
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted December 08, 2017 10:12 AM      Profile for Chip Gelmini     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Please visit that link again watch the part of the extract the camera will go into the booth a light will come on and the cleaner will be shown I am sorry I did not make that clear the first post

(Dec 8th original comment now edited)

[ December 08, 2017, 02:03 PM: Message edited by: Chip Gelmini ]

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Sean Calvert
Junior
Posts: 6
From: Walla Walla, WA, USA
Registered: Feb 2017


 - posted December 08, 2017 02:55 PM      Profile for Sean Calvert   Email Sean Calvert   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Thank you again for your interest. I’d like to collect orders until next Friday, December 15th. At that point, I’ll compile the list of materials to purchase for those machines and will start building.

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Sean Calvert
Junior
Posts: 6
From: Walla Walla, WA, USA
Registered: Feb 2017


 - posted December 26, 2017 09:52 AM      Profile for Sean Calvert   Email Sean Calvert   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
It looks like we have 5 people interested. I will be sending emails directly to them this morning. If you are interested and do not receive a message from me, please email me at seangcalvert@gmail.com. I'll try to remember to post a few pictures of production when I get rolling.

Merry Christmas, everyone!

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Brad Miller
Administrator

Posts: 525
From: Dallas, TX, USA
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted December 27, 2017 12:46 AM      Profile for Brad Miller   Author's Homepage   Email Brad Miller       Edit/Delete Post 
Not trying to hijack this thread, but Chip's use of the defacto cinema-standard film cleaner made by Kelmar (older versions were branded Christie) is a much better way to go. I've used the Ecco before and it doesn't do anywhere near as good of a job as the Kelmar.

The Ecco's design uses stationary cleaning pads that must be manually moved to prevent scratching. The Kelmar design advances on its own as the film spins the main drive wheel. You just design some sort of method of mounting like Chip did, thread your film through it and go enjoy the show! No need to stand there and obsess over it on the rewinds.

The Kelmar cleaners are available used on ebay and near-effortlessly converted to run 16mm or 8mm gauge with a couple of bolts and some washers. This is the very machine FilmGuard is recommended to be applied with and it works fine with other solutions as well. The only thing it doesn't have is the constant drip onto the pads, but that just isn't needed with a slow-drying solution.

Talk to Chip and others who have used the Kelmar OR the miniaturized version of the Kelmar that Roy Neil produces called the Film-O-Clean. Its really no comparison.

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