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» 8mm Forum   » 8mm Forum   » Best lamp for Elmo GS1200 anno 2017. Also for my Elmo ST1200 and Bauer T610. (Page 1)

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Author Topic: Best lamp for Elmo GS1200 anno 2017. Also for my Elmo ST1200 and Bauer T610.
Matthieu van der Sluis
Master Film Handler

Posts: 373
From: Barendrecht, The Netherlands
Registered: Aug 2017

- posted August 22, 2017 01:03 PM      Profile for Matthieu van der Sluis   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Most topics about lamps are from 2013, so I was wondering if there was some change now.

I just bought a brand new looking and serviced Elmo GS1200 in mint condition and I'm as happy as a child.

The lamp that is in this beauty is a Fuji 24V/200W EJL (I believe Cold Mirrored), but to my knowledge this is not the right lamp to go with, since it is also used for 16mm projectors, I believe.
I found a website where I can buy the Fuji ESC lamps, but are this lamps still for the narrow 8mm gate?
Is this still the brightest lamp for a Elmo GS1200?

For my Elmo ST1200 and Bauer T610 I still have a spare Osram Xenophot HLX lamp.
Are those still the brightest for 8mm projectors with 15V/150W?
Philips is also making them now.
Also is Narva making them and that version works for 500 hour.
Does anyone have experience with this?

Are there Xenophot kinda solutions for the Elmo GS1200 too now?
I like the light to be somewhat whiter if possible.

I also did read about a conversion to a HID by someone living in the UK, but I do not dare to send this beautyfull projector away by post.
Some of those guy's are throwing with the boxes.
Is there anyone who can do a conversion like this nearby the Netherlands, like Belgium or Germany, so I could bring the projector myself?

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Maurice Leakey
Film God

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From: Bristol. United Kingdom
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- posted August 22, 2017 02:38 PM      Profile for Maurice Leakey   Email Maurice Leakey   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The ESC lamp is the one recommended for the GS-1200.

--------------------
Maurice

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Paul Browning
Phenomenal Film Handler

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From: West Midlands United Kingdom
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- posted August 22, 2017 05:14 PM      Profile for Paul Browning   Email Paul Browning   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Maurice is right, the ESC lamp is the correct lamp for the GS, but getting hard to find now this side of the pond, because of the configuration 24V 200W, most common lamp is 24v 250w in this style of projector lamp. You say you have found a website Matthieu that sells these lamps, please let us have the web address....

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Matthieu van der Sluis
Master Film Handler

Posts: 373
From: Barendrecht, The Netherlands
Registered: Aug 2017

- posted August 23, 2017 01:04 AM      Profile for Matthieu van der Sluis   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I just ordered 4 of them.
It's in the US:
https://www.replacementlightbulbs.com/lampesc.html

If I add power in my GS1200 is the light of this lamp narrow enough to use it for my GS1200?
Osram HLX 64653 GX5.3 24V 250W ELC A1/259
EAN: 4050300006826

To do it real simple, can I add an extra powersource paralel to the lamp, or do I first cut off the origenal wires.

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Paul Browning
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From: West Midlands United Kingdom
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- posted August 23, 2017 01:27 AM      Profile for Paul Browning   Email Paul Browning   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
be careful when using alternative lamp wattages for the elmo, it will over run the transformer, and may cause premature failure, not an easy thing to come by if at all. I have seen these lamps before, but the reflector is not the same as the Fuji lamp, you may have an incorrect focus through the gate with this lamp, plus these are low lamp hours. Steve osbourne did have some these lamps, the Fuji one's, I thought this might be the site you were referring to....

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Matthieu van der Sluis
Master Film Handler

Posts: 373
From: Barendrecht, The Netherlands
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- posted August 23, 2017 01:47 AM      Profile for Matthieu van der Sluis   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Are the ones I ordered on this site not good?

I'm new here and don't know the names yet, but I'll learn.

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

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From: Manchester Uk
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- posted August 23, 2017 01:48 AM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
In answer to some other questions you asked there Mattieu, the Osram Xenophot A1 232 lamps are still the brightest and the whitest lamps to be found in the 15v 150w halogen variety.

Other options, including some made by Philips can offer 500 hour run time, but the trade off is that these are nowhere near as bright or white as the Osram Xenophot.

Finally HID lamps like the Xenpow 150w, can I believe, offer near Xenon proportions of lamp power and on screen brilliance for a relatively low cost now, but again they need a Ballast unit to power them which are bulky and cannot be fitted easily inside any Super 8mm machine that I can instantly think of and they also require even further additional modifications such as extra cooling fan(s) and a dowser to avoid burning film frames while the film is motionless inside the powered projector.

Only certain machines therefore lend themselves to this kind of retrofitting and I certainly doubt the Bauer T610 would be among them due to limited space and plastic bodywork throughout.

--------------------
"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Paul Browning
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From: West Midlands United Kingdom
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- posted August 23, 2017 06:46 AM      Profile for Paul Browning   Email Paul Browning   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I would buy just one, try it out. The reflector on this type of projector lamp is designed to capture as much light as possible and throw it forward, even on xenon projectors, the separate reflector is designed this way, it reflects from the behind and fold back the light from the sides to do the same again, but this would all be wasted if its not focused in the right position at the gate, or somewhere close to the back of the lens....

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Matthieu van der Sluis
Master Film Handler

Posts: 373
From: Barendrecht, The Netherlands
Registered: Aug 2017

- posted August 23, 2017 04:24 PM      Profile for Matthieu van der Sluis   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hmmm, I order 4 already, but I'll compare them to the EJL that's in it now.

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Thomas Knappstein
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 124
From: Erwitte, Germany
Registered: Oct 2017

- posted November 22, 2017 09:51 AM      Profile for Thomas Knappstein   Email Thomas Knappstein   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hello at all!
I am using the Osram 24V 250W HLX over 25 Years in my GS machines. But only with an external Transformer that can give 400W and 0-21,5-24-25V. Very important is setting the Lampholder in the Lamphouse 10mm back. Last Time I diddent use the Osram. I Prefer the 50h Philips Focusline which is much brighter because of a different Mirror. It looks like the old ESC Mirror of the 200W Elmo Lamp only with a 250W Bulb in it. Here are some Pictures of my modification i did many Years ago. Today the Transformer has an Ampere Meter and a Dimer to regulate the Voltage without any steps. Sorry for the dark PicturesI have made with my old Handy. The last Picture shows the actually Transformer switches and the Ampere Meter.

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Matthieu van der Sluis
Master Film Handler

Posts: 373
From: Barendrecht, The Netherlands
Registered: Aug 2017

- posted November 22, 2017 11:30 AM      Profile for Matthieu van der Sluis   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
A very nice addition to this Topic.
The details of the Philips lamp comes in handy too.

What types and numbers are written on your lamp?

I've been searching on the Philips lamps but I get many differend kinds. The numbering on the websites all differ from eachoter with the specs..
Is it the: Philips Focusline Optical 250W 24V GX5.3 ELC or ICT with number 13631 or 13136?
I saw them with 1500Lm 50h and around 900Lm 500h.

Are this lamps as white as the Xenophot? It sais 3400K on all.

I also found this lamp:
https://www.lampdirect.nl/philips-13631-250w-gx5-3-24v

 -

There are more kinds here:
https://www.lampdirect.nl/philips-focusline-fibre-optics

PS. I'm still very jealous of that very nice conversion. ;

[ November 22, 2017, 01:26 PM: Message edited by: Matthieu van der Sluis ]

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Thomas Knappstein
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From: Erwitte, Germany
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- posted November 22, 2017 10:25 PM      Profile for Thomas Knappstein   Email Thomas Knappstein   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I´m using the Philips Type 13163 ELCA!/259 wich has no facetted Mirror. Drive this Lamp with 25-25,5 Volt and its very bright Light.

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Matthieu van der Sluis
Master Film Handler

Posts: 373
From: Barendrecht, The Netherlands
Registered: Aug 2017

- posted November 23, 2017 12:35 PM      Profile for Matthieu van der Sluis   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Websites are still not consistend with this.
Is this the EAN Code maybe?
871150040975160
With 850 Lumen.

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Thomas Knappstein
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 124
From: Erwitte, Germany
Registered: Oct 2017

- posted November 24, 2017 09:06 AM      Profile for Thomas Knappstein   Email Thomas Knappstein   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
-

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Maurice Leakey
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From: Bristol. United Kingdom
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- posted November 24, 2017 09:33 AM      Profile for Maurice Leakey   Email Maurice Leakey   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The correct lamp for a GS-1200 is the ESC which is 24volt 200watt.
The ELC lamp is 24volt 250watt. I would suggest that using this lamp could burn out its transformer.

--------------------
Maurice

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Matthieu van der Sluis
Master Film Handler

Posts: 373
From: Barendrecht, The Netherlands
Registered: Aug 2017

- posted November 24, 2017 10:16 AM      Profile for Matthieu van der Sluis   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I think if you don't project too long at a time, it will survive.
There is a complete converting topic for the GS1200 to add an extra Transformer to it to overcome burning, with good results as on the photo's you see above from Thomas Knappstein.

Thanks Thoms.
I'm going to order to see the difference with the ESC from Donar I have.
Is the lightcolor as white as the Osram Xenophot?

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Thomas Knappstein
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From: Erwitte, Germany
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- posted November 25, 2017 12:51 AM      Profile for Thomas Knappstein   Email Thomas Knappstein   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The Lightcolor is different. Some of them are very white, others are more yellow. I think that is the Focus Tollerance of the Bulb in the Mirror because this Lamps are made for the 16mm Frame. And setting them 10mm back in the Lamphouse gives more concentrate Light to the Super 8 Frame.

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Terry Sills
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From: Weymouth,Dorset,England
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- posted November 25, 2017 02:11 AM      Profile for Terry Sills     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Andrew
I was told by the moderators that you had left this forum! Was there a reason?
Anyway good to see you back.

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Matthieu van der Sluis
Master Film Handler

Posts: 373
From: Barendrecht, The Netherlands
Registered: Aug 2017

- posted November 25, 2017 03:19 AM      Profile for Matthieu van der Sluis   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
You really add something to the forum, so I'm glad you are here.

Just to complete the knowledge.
If you use a 16mm projector lamp, you always have to put the lamp back 10mm?
Isn't this also the case for using an EJL lamp, which is often sold for and found in a GS1200? At least that was the lamp I found both times in my GS1200 projectors.
Or does that not work on a EJL?

If so, I find it strange that in the last 15 years or so most GS1200 projectors aren't converted already.
Seems to me, that all projector services should have advertize for this in the past 15 years, when you bring in your Elmo GS1200 for some servicejob.
The origenal ESC lamp is hard to get or very expensive for a long time now.
A missed opportunity I'd say.

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Paul Browning
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From: West Midlands United Kingdom
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- posted November 25, 2017 09:10 AM      Profile for Paul Browning   Email Paul Browning   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
You can use the reflector when they expire to good use and replace it with a much brighter cheaper lamp, HID.....

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Matthieu van der Sluis
Master Film Handler

Posts: 373
From: Barendrecht, The Netherlands
Registered: Aug 2017

- posted November 25, 2017 10:45 AM      Profile for Matthieu van der Sluis   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I have 4 Donar lamps, that I dont mind to take away the inside lamp and drill it for a new inside.
Are the reflectors of the Donar ESC the as good as the origenal Fuji's? I was not impressed by the lightoutput of those, since my Bauer T610 has a brighter and whiter lichtoutput with a xenophot of 150W.

Do I Drill out the bottom so I can stick this inside instead?
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Paul Browning
Phenomenal Film Handler

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From: West Midlands United Kingdom
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- posted November 25, 2017 11:08 AM      Profile for Paul Browning   Email Paul Browning   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
You can do that, but why replace it with a filament lamp, they are not as bright as an HID lamp and the kelvin range is more like 6000,and lower voltage too. You can carefully cut the back out with a diamond wheel, remove the old lamp and replace with anything that will fit. If you are going to do this, the replacement lamp will need to be in the exact same place as the original lamp, to get as much light out as possible. Unfortunately after several attempts to upload photo's to here I gave up trying, seems like too much messing around for me .....

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Graham Ritchie
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From: New Zealand
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- posted November 25, 2017 11:32 AM      Profile for Graham Ritchie   Email Graham Ritchie   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
When I took Thomas advise and moved the lamp back 10mm, it made a huge difference...brighter and whiter [Cool] highly recommend it [Smile]

Paul
Regarding a HID conversion I had already bought a conversion kit with doing just that a while ago. However where I stopped, was finding a good mirror, although Paul your idea is brilliant, would those ELC, ESC, EJL lamp mirrors discolour as they do with present use?, as there reflective coating did not seem up to the job for long use.....

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Paul Browning
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1006
From: West Midlands United Kingdom
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- posted November 25, 2017 11:47 AM      Profile for Paul Browning   Email Paul Browning   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
A good point Graham, I have not used this long enough to answer that, but if this happens with the normal lamp, I guess the answer must be yes, you can convert any of this type of lamp reflector to hid, not just the facet type as per the ESC. On a like for like test, this conversion was almost as bright as the two blade beaulieu, with the GS at three blade, at the screen measured, the conversion cost about 30.00 pounds sterling in bits. With the brilliant white light, its a no brainer really. I asked on here if anyone had got a blown ESC lamp and offered to pay the postage so I could do some tests, I had one person respond, and he was in Australia !!!!!!!.

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Graham Ritchie
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- posted November 25, 2017 12:14 PM      Profile for Graham Ritchie   Email Graham Ritchie   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Thanks Paul...I have not given up with the idea of a HID conversion and still on the lookout for a mirror At one point I was thinking that what they used on old Std8 projectors using a condenser lens etc set up from one of those machines might be the way to go, but I think using a condenser lens would defeat the purpose of the conversion in the first place.

The idea you have of cutting a hole and placing the HID lamp through it, is still the best way to go. I just need to come across a quality mirror with the right angle to concentrate the light onto the gate. [Smile]

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