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Author Topic: New Carbon Brushes for GS1200 Take up Motor
Thomas Knappstein
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 124
From: Erwitte, Germany
Registered: Oct 2017


 - posted July 23, 2018 10:38 AM      Profile for Thomas Knappstein   Email Thomas Knappstein   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hello at all!

Does anyone here change the Brushes in the Take up and Rewinding Motors of an Elmo GS 1200? Where can I get them?

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Phil Murat
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 671
From: Villeneuve St Georges, France
Registered: Dec 2015


 - posted July 23, 2018 02:17 PM      Profile for Phil Murat   Email Phil Murat   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hi,

Sure you ll find what you need there :

CARBON BRUSHES

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Paul Adsett
Film God

Posts: 5003
From: USA
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted July 23, 2018 06:36 PM      Profile for Paul Adsett     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Which one fits the GS1200 reel motors?

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The best of all worlds- 8mm, super 8mm, 9.5mm, and HD Digital Projection,
Elmo GS1200 f1.0 2-blade
Eumig S938 Stereo f1.0 Ektar
Panasonic PT-AE4000U digital pj

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Phil Murat
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 671
From: Villeneuve St Georges, France
Registered: Dec 2015


 - posted July 24, 2018 12:48 AM      Profile for Phil Murat   Email Phil Murat   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hello Paul,

Depending on size of original brushes (recorded with a good caliper) , choose the more approaching one and adjust (with a file/Sandpaper) as necessary.
Generic ones are only supplied with copper mesh alone (springs and contacts have to be picked up on former brushes)
2 kind of copper mesh : straight fitted and angular fitted.

However, I assume the more important is :
- hardness of brushes (avoid hard ones to prevent from premature rotor contacts wear)
- Spring load (avoid strong spring load to prevent from premature brushes and/or rotor wear)

I've already done that with some electric motors and it worked....

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Paul Browning
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1006
From: West Midlands United Kingdom
Registered: Aug 2011


 - posted July 24, 2018 06:54 AM      Profile for Paul Browning   Email Paul Browning   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
If needed we would make these brushes out of graphite, drill the hole and super glue the wires in, make sure its conducts, and there you go. When cars had dynamo's the brushes would arc a lot or burn down, better to try and get a diameter on the inside and make sure its not too hard. We used old electrodes from the spark erosion section, its the same material.....

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Winbert Hutahaean
Film God

Posts: 5468
From: Nouméa, New Caledonia
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted July 24, 2018 10:05 AM      Profile for Winbert Hutahaean     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I have zero knowledge on electronic stuffs... so what is the function of these brushes?

Will they wear after years? Do we really need to change it regularly?

Thanks

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Winbert

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

Posts: 7016
From: Long Island, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted July 24, 2018 10:37 AM      Profile for Steve Klare   Email Steve Klare   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
A DC electric motor is a set of electromagnets on a shaft inside a permanent magnet held in place. When current flows in the coils of the rotor, a magnetic field is established that the permanent magnets attract (and/or repel). This turns the rotor until the magnetic fields align.

Here it could stop, so to keep going, the next set of coils at the right spot need to be energized and the first set turned off: this is good for another fraction of a turn.

This means somehow you need to keep applying power to the rotor and turning it on and off to the right coils at exactly the correct angle of rotation. (-kind of like all those cylinders in a car engine firing at the right time to keep it turning.)

So you have a set of copper contacts on the rotor wired to the coils and two stationary brushes sliding on them. The operating voltage is applied to the brushes Everything is set up at the correct angles to make it work correctly. This acts like a very sophisticated synchronized switching system, but it's just angles and wiring.

-These days they'd be writing and debugging code for weeks!

Being that the brushes slide, there is friction, so there is wear. They are softer than the copper, so they wear to the right shape to make good contact (less arcing). They are much easier to replace than the copper commutator, so they have their service life and then get replaced by the next set (-for the greater good!).

It's a wonderful, simple idea that changed the World.

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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Winbert Hutahaean
Film God

Posts: 5468
From: Nouméa, New Caledonia
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted July 24, 2018 07:34 PM      Profile for Winbert Hutahaean     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Thanks Steve for an excellent explanation. I just knew it.

So what is the impact of bad brushes to the motor? become slower?

--------------------
Winbert

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Thomas Knappstein
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 124
From: Erwitte, Germany
Registered: Oct 2017


 - posted July 24, 2018 11:51 PM      Profile for Thomas Knappstein   Email Thomas Knappstein   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Thank you for this great statemants.
I have changed the complete Motor. I have one of them bought for replacing many Years ago.

But I will try to change the Brushes in the other one next time.

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Adrian Winchester
Film God

Posts: 2941
From: Croydon, London, UK
Registered: Aug 2004


 - posted July 25, 2018 08:16 PM      Profile for Adrian Winchester     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I'll offer one comment on this:

I have two GSs; one has had considerable use over many years; the other is virtually like new, and has probably been used for no more than 20 hours. I have only ever had a problem with the brushes on one of the four motors on these projectors. Guess the projector?

Answer: the 'like new' one!

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Adrian Winchester

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Bill Brandenstein
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1632
From: California
Registered: Aug 2007


 - posted July 27, 2018 01:14 AM      Profile for Bill Brandenstein   Email Bill Brandenstein   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
A description of the symptoms would be greatly appreciated!

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