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Author Topic: Wanted: Long Play system.
Alan Gouger
Master Film Handler

Posts: 451
From: Florida
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted August 14, 2015 01:40 PM      Profile for Alan Gouger     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
There were a few different models I will consider all. Thank you [Smile]

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012


 - posted August 14, 2015 02:30 PM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
They are fantastic Alan. By giving the reels plenty of free space, they run so much smoother and quieter than a projector with the big reel arms built in.

I hope you find one soon pal!
I shall keep a look out at my end for you Alan, should I find one, you will be the first to know. [Wink]

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2200ft and still room for even bigger!

[ August 14, 2015, 05:12 PM: Message edited by: Andrew Woodcock ]

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Dominique De Bast
Film God

Posts: 4486
From: Brussels, Belgium
Registered: Jun 2013


 - posted August 14, 2015 02:37 PM      Profile for Dominique De Bast   Email Dominique De Bast   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
There is one model of long play unit still being manufactured in Spain but that will sadly be soon no longer so as the manufacturer is moving in another (not film related) business. The same source still provides large spools but I don't know until when.

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Dominique

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Tom Photiou
Film God

Posts: 4837
From: Plymouth U.K
Registered: Dec 2003


 - posted August 14, 2015 04:42 PM      Profile for Tom Photiou     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
what sort of price would one expect to pay for one of these?
Are there different ones for different model projectors or are they pretty much universal?

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012


 - posted August 14, 2015 05:00 PM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
The Spondon type shown here was designed to be used for both 16mm and 8mm machines. It uses adaptors like those sold by Edwin for Super 8mm machines.

I have to say, if you were designing one of these purpose built to work perfectly for either a Eumig S938 or a Bauer Studio Line machine, then you could not do it any better!

The Price now Tom, is purely down to what one person is prepared to pay for one of these over and above the next man as Paul Browning will testify who purchased one of these in recent times.

They fit perfectly for both machines sat on it's base board and as said, no real screach, no motor noise once film is on it.
They run totally silently as a reel to reel tape deck does.

Just perfect for these already quiet smooth operators.

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Dominique De Bast
Film God

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From: Brussels, Belgium
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 - posted August 15, 2015 03:00 AM      Profile for Dominique De Bast   Email Dominique De Bast   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The super 8 Spanish system (which is different from the one Andrew shows on his picture) is sold 210 €, if that can help giving you an idea of price.

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Dominique

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012


 - posted August 15, 2015 03:53 AM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
That's a decent price Dominique for one of these brand spanking new IMHO.

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Paul Browning
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1006
From: West Midlands United Kingdom
Registered: Aug 2011


 - posted August 15, 2015 04:35 AM      Profile for Paul Browning   Email Paul Browning   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
One of those Spanish units sold on ebay quite recently and went for very little money, I think 50.00 euro's. It looked well made too, slightly different design to the spondon unit with the reels one above the other. My unit is an earlier version to Andrews, top half has the control box and motor combined. I don't think it would be that difficult to make one, motor chip is still available and a small amount of components inside on a bread board, I think the company who made the motor are still around too, you would just have to work out which motor spondon used, all the other bits could be sourced from old projector bits if you had a couple of scrap ones, or from the shows maybe. You would expect to pay at least £250.00 for a stand alone unit, although I payed more because it came with two features and some spare reels.

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

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From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012


 - posted August 15, 2015 04:43 AM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
I would be interested to find out who the motor company is Paul that supplied Spondon with their grey motor/ gearbox combo.

I purchased an as near as possible power/ratio spare from China but come the day I would need to get a faceplate adaptor manufactured to allow it to be bolted to the frame in the manner my existing one does.

It would be far easier for me if I could find an identical spare motor/ gearbox for if ever required.

The control circuit board on mine is inside the aluminium square box section. the only component on the outside of the frame is the motor/gearbox itself and 1 inch of wiring stuck down with silicone rubber as per manufacture.

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Kevin Clark
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 978
From: Bapchild, Kent, UK
Registered: May 2004


 - posted August 15, 2015 04:50 AM      Profile for Kevin Clark     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The motors were supplied to Spondon from RS Radio Spares. I have a new boxed one here somewhere although you will find Spondon used a few different versions over the years. I'm sure I saw them still for sale in a Maplins catalogue not long ago.

I'll have a look for it today then post a picture.

Kevin

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

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From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012


 - posted August 15, 2015 04:54 AM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
As ever Kevin, that would be fantastic thanks! [Wink]

Any that look like this Kevin?
http://8mmforum.film-tech.com/cgi-bin/showpic.cgi?dir=uploads0503&file=SAM_2597.JPG

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Paul Browning
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From: West Midlands United Kingdom
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 - posted August 15, 2015 05:17 AM      Profile for Paul Browning   Email Paul Browning   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
sales@premotec.com, hello Andrew, here's the company that make those motors. As you know all the details on the motor were removed, so a little work is needed to get the technical stuff, but they will know if you supply detail to them, perhaps Kevin's motor complete and in the box would help.

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012


 - posted August 15, 2015 06:04 AM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
Brilliant! Thanks a million Paul!! [Smile]

Yep, if Kevin's is one of these, and he doesn't want to keep it for his own needs, then I'm his customer on this one.

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Kevin Clark
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 978
From: Bapchild, Kent, UK
Registered: May 2004


 - posted August 15, 2015 07:12 AM      Profile for Kevin Clark     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hello Andrew & Paul

My motor is different to the one you have but I will still post a picture later - probably best to start a new thread in the 8mm section titled something like 'DIY Longplay Unit components' as Alan may not be happy with us turning his post into a DIY techy zone rather than its original purpose!

Your motor looks exactly like this one from RS Components UK:

http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/dc-geared-motors/0440082/

Kevin

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012


 - posted August 15, 2015 08:01 AM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
That's the one Kevin! Thanks for that.

Now we have an original motor source, Paul's comments of copying the design of my spondon appear quite feasible if anyone can replicate the circuit boards.

Probably would cost around £100 to £150 to make including plastic end caps, motor couplings and machined spindles etc.

Wow, just noticed the controller for these for £11.71 on the same RS page! Even better!!

Have to see how much Edwin could 3D print us some hubs for?

As you say,best we start a new post and keep this for Alan.

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Alan Gouger
Master Film Handler

Posts: 451
From: Florida
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted August 15, 2015 06:41 PM      Profile for Alan Gouger     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Kevin no need to start a new thread we can keep this one going there is good info here. Does anyone have a link or contact to the company in Spain selling the new model maybe I can catch them before going out of business.
Andrew thanks for posting that picture, what a sweet setup:)

Thanks All!!

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Dominique De Bast
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 - posted August 15, 2015 11:25 PM      Profile for Dominique De Bast   Email Dominique De Bast   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Alan, you can try in English : taller@juliocastells.com Postal address : Julio Castelles calle Ferlandina, 20 • 08001 - BARCELONA. Tel. 933 02 56 92 •

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Dominique

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Mike Newell
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 826
From: United Kingdom
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted August 16, 2015 08:55 AM      Profile for Mike Newell   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Tom

Spondon long play units turn from time to time. Your best bet is to ask Ian O 'Reilly, Barry Attwood or Paul Foster. They would buy in collections and the units could come as part of the equipment pile.I bought mine for £70 but tended to find it troublesome to set up for one feature when the rest of the collection was on smaller reels. It does tend to put a fair amount of pressure on one projector for a two hour continuous play. If a bulb or mechanical issue is going to occur it will be when you are using the sponson.

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Kevin Clark
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 978
From: Bapchild, Kent, UK
Registered: May 2004


 - posted August 16, 2015 09:12 AM      Profile for Kevin Clark     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
OK Alan I'll keep the techy stuff in this thread as requested.

I don't own a Spondon now as I use my Elf / Eiki 16mm Long Play Unit for all my 16mm and Super 8 feature shows.

I've never experienced any issues with the projectors I've used with the Spondon due to long running times - models I've used them with include Braun Visacustic 1000 & 2000, Elmo ST600 ST1200HD and GS1200. One thing I would recommend is using a film cleaner such as Roy Neil's superb Film-O-Clean system especially for runs over 2400ft as this will prevent any shedding building up in the gate.

The spare motor I have is pictured below - usable with a 12vdc supply to produce 40 rpm or a lower voltage via a vr pot to produce lower rpm. Other electronics will be required as per the Spondon circuit board to allow for torque adjustment etc.

Kevin

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Alan Gouger
Master Film Handler

Posts: 451
From: Florida
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted August 16, 2015 10:47 AM      Profile for Alan Gouger     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Dominique email fired off, thank you!!!

Mike thanks for pointing out the mechanical alerts:)

Kevin do you use adapters to convert to S8 reels? Good idea!

Thx

Edit:

I have a technical question for everyone thanks to Kevins post regarding speed control. Odds are greater I might find a unit sourced from over seas that operates on 220v/50hz
Most of my projectors are from the UK I run a voltage converter and set the projector to 18fps which equals perfect 24fps speed.

Seeing as there is no easy way to convert HZ would a 220v full play system work in the US if using just a voltage converter. Running at 60hz will speed up the unit but maybe not enough to hurt anything. Can the clutch on the take up be adjusted on these or is there a speed control or maybe it will fine without one the speed difference will not be enough to hurt anything. Thoughts?

Thank you.

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Paul Browning
Phenomenal Film Handler

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From: West Midlands United Kingdom
Registered: Aug 2011


 - posted August 16, 2015 11:49 AM      Profile for Paul Browning   Email Paul Browning   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hello Alan, the spondon unit, runs a motor control circuit, with a variable speed control, like a volume control, to turn up or down on the speed. Very simple circuit with a few components inside, If you did manage to find one it would be a matter of getting a step down transformer from your voltage to that of the motor, speed is then a bit of trial and error really, but not that difficult to overcome.

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012


 - posted August 16, 2015 12:43 PM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
Alan, just to assure you with the speed /potential torque issues on these, they need to be set correctly at the beginning of whatever reel you load.

Obviously 1200ft reels need a lot less turn of the potentiometer than the 2200ft ones, but it really is easy to find the correct speed / torque for each reel loaded on one of these.

It's a great tool to have for alternative long play projector besides the obvious three.

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Alessandro Pavoni
Master Film Handler

Posts: 255
From: Zürich/Switzerland
Registered: Sep 2009


 - posted August 16, 2015 01:04 PM      Profile for Alessandro Pavoni   Email Alessandro Pavoni   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hi all, I had one like Andrew, It was very good but I sold it. I regred having sold.
There is one on ebay but I don't know the seller.
http://www.ebay.de/itm/MOTOR-FILMUMSPULER-SPULTURM-FILMUMROLLER-FUR-RIESEN-SUPER-8-FILMSPULEN-/121726216611?hash=item1c5772a9a3

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Kevin Clark
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 978
From: Bapchild, Kent, UK
Registered: May 2004


 - posted August 16, 2015 01:32 PM      Profile for Kevin Clark     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Alan, yes I use adapters to fit Super 8 hubs to the Elf 16mm Long Play unit - probably the only weak point in my set up as the adapters are the usual small plastic super 8 to regular 8mm adapters found on any dual 8 reel or projector. Roy sells super 8 metal converters for use with 16mm shaft rewinders so I should invest in a pair of those really.

When I had a Spondon I used to set the torque pot by fitting my full showreel on the driven arm first and adjust the pot so the reel just about started to turn - then I put the full spool on the feed arm and an identical empty take up spool on the take up arm and off you go.

Kevin

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Alan Gouger
Master Film Handler

Posts: 451
From: Florida
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted August 16, 2015 03:00 PM      Profile for Alan Gouger     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Alessandro thanks for the link, sadly his sale says no US shipping other wise I would secure it I have seen this model in previous posts and like that design.
Wow looks like someone bought it while I was posting, it is no longer avail.

Andrew & Kevin thanks for letting me know these have an adjustment to fine tune the speed. I should be all set with a Eropean model using a voltage converter.

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