8mm Forum


Post New Topic  Post A Reply
my profile | my password | register | search | faq | register | forum home
  next oldest topic   next newest topic
» 8mm Forum   » General Yak   » They Shall Not Grow Old

 - UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!    
Author Topic: They Shall Not Grow Old
Bill Brandenstein
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1627
From: California
Registered: Aug 2007


 - posted December 12, 2018 10:55 PM      Profile for Bill Brandenstein   Email Bill Brandenstein   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hundred-year-old WWI film footage: what's an "authentic" presentation? Is a film more authentic when viewed just precisely in the manner in which it was shot, with all its limitations and imperfections, using a projector and a screen? Or is it more authentic when digitally transformed into a more realistic window-in-time, as though it were shot with newer technology?

You decide.

Peter Jackson, who redefined the world of special effects with his Lord of the Rings trilogy, has reinvented the concept of archival footage with his documentary "They Shall Not Be Forgotten." He's taken hundred-year-old film footage and digitally created more resolution, a wider aspect ratio, smoothly added frames to increase the frame rate, added color, added synchronized sound, and even pulled it into 3D. I'm not sure what to think of this "inauthentic authenticity," but please take a look at the trailer:

Trailer for "They Shall Not Grow Old"

(Why isn't this a full theatrical release? The timing is awful for me, so if anyone sees this, please give us your review!)

There are a lot of ways Jackson could've done this and made it look. Whether or not we agree with his aesthetics, this is morally and artistically meritorious. Truly fascinating and profoundly worthy.

[ December 13, 2018, 07:35 PM: Message edited by: Bill Brandenstein ]

 |  IP: Logged

Burton Sundquist
Master Film Handler

Posts: 290
From: Burnaby, B.C. Canada
Registered: Feb 2017


 - posted December 13, 2018 12:41 AM      Profile for Burton Sundquist   Email Burton Sundquist   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
...HERE HERE!

 |  IP: Logged

Janice Glesser
Film Goddess

Posts: 3372
From: Sunnyvale, CA USA
Registered: Sep 2011


 - posted December 13, 2018 02:24 AM      Profile for Janice Glesser   Email Janice Glesser   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
This looks wonderful. I hope it will be at a theater near me.

--------------------
Janice

"I'm having a very good day!"
Richard Dreyfuss - Let It Ride (1989).

 |  IP: Logged

Brian Fretwell
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1718
From: London, UK
Registered: Jun 2014


 - posted December 13, 2018 02:42 AM      Profile for Brian Fretwell   Email Brian Fretwell   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
What he mainly did was remove the damage accumulated over the years and increase the frame rate to allow it to be shown at TV frame rates. It would have looked more like this when originally shown than modern TV showings. It was the colourisation that changed it most and that's what I thought was least successful when I watched the whole programme on the on 11th November this year. The recollections of the veterans read over the pictures made it for me. (My grandfather lost an eye in that war)

 |  IP: Logged

Graham Ritchie
Film God

Posts: 3944
From: New Zealand
Registered: Feb 2006


 - posted December 13, 2018 12:48 PM      Profile for Graham Ritchie   Email Graham Ritchie   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Bill

It did the cinema run here but I missed it, however I have ordered the Blu-ray so hopefully I will catch up on viewing it soon.

Another interesting point, was that the cameras used were hand cranked and as such the speed varied. What Peter Jackson and his team has worked on was also a way to obtain the right speed.

Its great that the technology is such, that much can be done to improve those early films. Hopefully we will see further historical film be given this treatment.

 |  IP: Logged

Melvin England
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 672
From: Hull, East Yorkshire, UK
Registered: Feb 2016


 - posted December 14, 2018 01:09 PM      Profile for Melvin England   Email Melvin England   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I never knew about this film before this thread was started. I watched the trailer,thinking it was a new release, but apparently, as Graham points out, it is already available on Dvd/Blu Ray. Not only that, it has also been given a BBC2 airing in the UK in November of this year.

As to whether we should digitize such footage or not remains for debate.

In my opinion..... absolutely.

As a supporter of celluloid, as we all are on this forum (or should be)I think it is extremely important to preserve the original black and white scratchy fast moving images as they were because, after all, this film is history in itself as a demonstration of the up to date technology available in that era.
What Peter Jackson and his team have done is a minor miracle. It has brought this low quality imagery into the 21st Century and turned it into footage that, for the sake of this example, could have been taken yesterday.
Surely the children of today and certainly generations yet to be born would not relate to these strange, scratchy, black and white images, yet, brought up to a standard they are used to everyday (notwithstanding future technological advances and improvements on even Jackson's work) they can be shown history in a way that can be understood in a way that they have come to expect.

Basically, keep the old stuff, but embrace the new.

I cannot wait for someone to get hold of Charlie Chaplin's material !!

--------------------
"My name is for my friends!"

 |  IP: Logged

Mark Todd
Film God

Posts: 3764
From: UK
Registered: Aug 2003


 - posted December 14, 2018 03:00 PM      Profile for Mark Todd   Email Mark Todd   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
For me this really brings the footage and people to life and puts an amazing warmth in to it.

And creates a sort of feeling of more connection to the people in the film.

Must get this, wonderful, thank you for mentioning it.

Best Mark.

[ December 15, 2018, 06:32 PM: Message edited by: Mark Todd ]

 |  IP: Logged

David Michael Leugers
Master Film Handler

Posts: 250
From: Fairfield, OH, USA
Registered: Feb 2004


 - posted December 15, 2018 06:30 PM      Profile for David Michael Leugers   Email David Michael Leugers   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Thanks for posting! I had no idea about this film. A must see for me if I can find it showing near me. As a kid I knew WWI veterans and always felt that their story did not get the same attention as the WWII vets did. Maybe this will help correct that. With these new technological advancements, it makes me eager to see silent films get the full restoration treatment. I do not wish to see colorized versions though... Talk about film being a time machine, I am a few weeks away from my annual family time machine where my wife and I get to visit our boys as they grew up. They both are approaching 40 years old so each year it seems more incredible to see them up on the 6 ft screen as if the footage was shot yesterday. It's why I love film.

--------------------
Live Free or Die

 |  IP: Logged

Joe Caruso
Film God

Posts: 4057
From: USA
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted December 17, 2018 01:40 PM      Profile for Joe Caruso   Email Joe Caruso   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Yes, he has made it all the more profound, yet I will still take the original concept with all it's crinkles and wrinkles, because that was shown originally to audiences and perhaps the vividness (if invented then), might have been too much - Old-fashioned Shorty

 |  IP: Logged

Ken Finch
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 532
From: Herne Bay, Kent. U.K.
Registered: Oct 2011


 - posted December 22, 2018 04:14 PM      Profile for Ken Finch   Email Ken Finch   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I also saw this on Television and Peter Jackson has really shown the reality and horrendous conditions, and futility of war. Much of the footage was never shown to the public at the time and what they did see were often re enactments or behind the front lines scenes. No wonder the returning soldiers would never talk about their experiences."When will they ever learn. When will they evverr
learn! Ken Finch. [Frown]

 |  IP: Logged

Graham Ritchie
Film God

Posts: 3944
From: New Zealand
Registered: Feb 2006


 - posted December 22, 2018 09:56 PM      Profile for Graham Ritchie   Email Graham Ritchie   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Ken

Your words "when will they ever learn" reminded of this song by Marlene Dietrich. I first heard it on the radio back in the 1960s, and its one you never forget.

https://youtu.be/-9t7LbNpQcE

 |  IP: Logged

Burton Sundquist
Master Film Handler

Posts: 290
From: Burnaby, B.C. Canada
Registered: Feb 2017


 - posted December 29, 2018 12:56 AM      Profile for Burton Sundquist   Email Burton Sundquist   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
This presentation available on 2 dates local to where I live. Of course I saw it in the Cinema. Overall I would say that this is a worthy effort, and masterly crafted. It is indeed a wonder to see this
Breathtaking achievement. Apocalypse : The First World War achieved it's message without this new technology. This new effort continues to try to capture the attention of a new generation. To Never Forget.

 |  IP: Logged

Bill Brandenstein
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1627
From: California
Registered: Aug 2007


 - posted January 03, 2019 06:10 PM      Profile for Bill Brandenstein   Email Bill Brandenstein   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Grateful to everyone for their musings. I've yet to have an opportunity to see this.

 |  IP: Logged

Graham Ritchie
Film God

Posts: 3944
From: New Zealand
Registered: Feb 2006


 - posted January 08, 2019 02:27 AM      Profile for Graham Ritchie   Email Graham Ritchie   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hi Bill

The Blu-ray arrived today so I watched it tonight, I would certainly recommend it.
 -

 |  IP: Logged

Lindsay Morris
Film Handler

Posts: 87
From: Darlington, WA, Australia
Registered: Jul 2013


 - posted January 12, 2019 06:37 PM      Profile for Lindsay Morris   Email Lindsay Morris   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The film is still playing in some art house cinemas in West Australia to reasonable audience numbers.
I think public requests prompted the cinemas to re-run it which we are grateful for as we managed to miss it when it opened last year.

Very very good as well as confronting & full marks to Peter Jackson for delivering a movie that was smooth & not jerky/stuttering archival stuff with missing frames and varying speeds.

--------------------
Lindsay

 |  IP: Logged

Bill Brandenstein
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1627
From: California
Registered: Aug 2007


 - posted January 16, 2019 11:56 AM      Profile for Bill Brandenstein   Email Bill Brandenstein   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Thanks for the updates, friends!

I'm hoping it gets additional screenings in southern California. Want to see this on a big screen the first time.

 |  IP: Logged

Janice Glesser
Film Goddess

Posts: 3372
From: Sunnyvale, CA USA
Registered: Sep 2011


 - posted January 16, 2019 03:48 PM      Profile for Janice Glesser   Email Janice Glesser   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I saw this movie and the attention to detail was phenomenal. The rotoscoping frame-by-frame restoration made the old film images come to life. It was the most amazing film transfer I have ever seen. Truely a work of art.

--------------------
Janice

"I'm having a very good day!"
Richard Dreyfuss - Let It Ride (1989).

 |  IP: Logged

Melvin England
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 672
From: Hull, East Yorkshire, UK
Registered: Feb 2016


 - posted January 30, 2019 03:26 AM      Profile for Melvin England   Email Melvin England   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
In the UK there is a further showing of this documentary on television on BBC2 this coming Saturday evening 2nd February at 9pm

--------------------
"My name is for my friends!"

 |  IP: Logged

Melvin England
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 672
From: Hull, East Yorkshire, UK
Registered: Feb 2016


 - posted January 30, 2019 03:26 AM      Profile for Melvin England   Email Melvin England   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
In the UK there is a further showing of this documentary on television on BBC2 this coming Saturday evening 2nd February at 9pm

--------------------
"My name is for my friends!"

 |  IP: Logged



All times are Central  
Post New Topic  Post A Reply Close Topic    Move Topic    Delete Topic    next oldest topic   next newest topic
 - Printer-friendly view of this topic
Hop To:

Visit www.film-tech.com for free equipment manual downloads. Copyright 2003-2019 Film-Tech Cinema Systems LLC

Powered by Infopop Corporation
UBB.classicTM 6.3.1.2