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Author Topic: Kodak's New Super 8 Camera
Steve Meyer
Film Handler

Posts: 59
From: USA
Registered: Jan 2016


 - posted February 17, 2016 08:00 PM      Profile for Steve Meyer   Email Steve Meyer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
This is so COOL.
Kodak's New Super 8 Camera

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Osi Osgood
Film God

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From: #399R K.O.A. Mountian Home, ID. 83647
Registered: Jul 2005


 - posted February 18, 2016 12:09 PM      Profile for Osi Osgood   Author's Homepage   Email Osi Osgood   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
This is ABSOLUTELY INCREDIBLE NEWS!!!

This actually fires me up to get that anamorphic lense, buy one of these cameras, and actually shoot a feature on super 8 film!!! I mean, I have seen the image quality of this modern super 8 film, and the sharpness is incredible!

Very ... very curious. I'm going to watch this seriously!!!

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"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "

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Mathew James
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 703
From: Hamilton, Ontario, Canada
Registered: Dec 2014


 - posted February 18, 2016 12:42 PM      Profile for Mathew James   Email Mathew James   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
It is very cool...

That is why we have now had 4 threads(including this one) generated on the topic now - he hee
http://8mmforum.film-tech.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=010412# 000000

http://8mmforum.film-tech.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=010416# 000000

http://8mmforum.film-tech.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=010433# 000000

btw- I was getting a haircut today and telling my barber about the new camera. He was interested. I think it will gain some ground...

[ February 19, 2016, 07:47 AM: Message edited by: Mathew James ]

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Cheers,
Matt 📽

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Adrian Winchester
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From: Croydon, London, UK
Registered: Aug 2004


 - posted February 18, 2016 11:52 PM      Profile for Adrian Winchester   Email Adrian Winchester   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Mathew - in fact the top one of those is about the 50th anniversary of Super 8, so this is only the 4th thread so far!

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Adrian Winchester

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Maurice Leakey
Film God

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From: Bristol. United Kingdom
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 - posted February 19, 2016 02:57 AM      Profile for Maurice Leakey   Email Maurice Leakey   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
No mention was made of a tripod bush. The demonstrator was happily "hose piping" as he held the camera away from his body to look at the large screen/viewfinder.

There is nothing worse on screen as an unsteady camera. The old "Amateur Cine World" magazine used to say :- "The film moves, the camera doesn't".

The fact that the cine-camera user had to hold it close to his face to see through the viewfinder, and the often leather strap to slide your left hand through ensured a steady shot.

$750 for a camera with separate sound. No, I don't think any genuine amateur would be interested.

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Maurice

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Rob Young.
Phenomenal Film Handler

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From: Cheshire, U.K.
Registered: Dec 2003


 - posted February 19, 2016 03:23 AM      Profile for Rob Young.     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I think the idea here is very much a film negative original which will then be handled (edited / distributed / viewed) digitally.

In that respect I think it's a really nice idea. I do think it's crazy, but still exciting and brave of Kodak to give this a go.

The SD card for audio is inspired.

I do wonder how the cost of a few minutes of film will be received, but, hey, here's hoping for a success...then we may see a European launch. [Smile]

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Paul Browning
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From: West Midlands United Kingdom
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 - posted February 19, 2016 01:05 PM      Profile for Paul Browning   Email Paul Browning   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Watching the follow on video on youtube, the presenter seems to think you can get 15 minutes of filming on the "cartridge", I think he may have miss read the information on the packaging it came in, which probably states 1.5 minutes at 24fps, or maybe he
thought Kodak are going to somehow "compress" the film like the sd card in a computer, whatever the outcome I carn't help thinking if they spend all that money on keeping film alive, why not just put the stripe back on the cartridge and re introduce the 200ft cart, we'll show them how to keep it alive alright.

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Rob Young.
Phenomenal Film Handler

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From: Cheshire, U.K.
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 - posted February 19, 2016 02:41 PM      Profile for Rob Young.     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Paul, I really don't think Kodak are expecting the film to be projected in the traditional way; although I may be very wrong.

I think the ideology is that of originating on 8mm negative with a subsequent digital work flow, "just like the pros!"

So I reckon going back to magnetic stripe isn't ever going to be on the agenda.

The 200ft cartridge at a sensible price would be a really good idea though.

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Mark Todd
Film God

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From: UK
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 - posted February 19, 2016 03:02 PM      Profile for Mark Todd   Email Mark Todd   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I`d guess where the pistol grip goes would be where the tripod can go on.

I would of added a normal view finder as well myself.

Its great and I hope it does well.

Best Mark.

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

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From: Long Island, NY, USA
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 - posted February 19, 2016 03:08 PM      Profile for Steve Klare   Email Steve Klare   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
-maybe what they think is "15 Minutes" is really "15 Meters"! (The boxes say "15 M".)

A young guy like that probably thinks film time comes in "megabytes" and not "feet" or "meters".

I'm glad they are developing an "Ecosystem" to go with the camera: I love nature films!

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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Barry Fritz
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From: Burnsville, MN, USA
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 - posted February 19, 2016 03:16 PM      Profile for Barry Fritz   Email Barry Fritz   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I thought Kodak went out of business. Obviously not. [Eek!]

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

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From: Long Island, NY, USA
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 - posted February 19, 2016 03:30 PM      Profile for Steve Klare   Email Steve Klare   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
They seem very big on this idea of one stop process and scan.

I hope it will continue to be possible to just process!

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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Paul Browning
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 - posted February 19, 2016 03:42 PM      Profile for Paul Browning   Email Paul Browning   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Good point Steve, rob what annoy's me about this youtube upload is the fact that the Kodak rep has not done his homework about how sound can be synced to the film via a stripe, with out the need for an SD card, and then side steps any question's put to him over this and many other's he should know the answers to. With a company as big as Kodak, either now or before you would think they could at least have had a working camera to show what it can do. At those price's which he did not know either, at 400 quid maybe ???, they are living in cloud cuckoo land if they think they will sell enough to make a cheaper version. If it keeps film around for a bit longer, then that's great, but just give the film, we already have the camera's.

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

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From: Long Island, NY, USA
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 - posted February 19, 2016 03:48 PM      Profile for Steve Klare   Email Steve Klare   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The line "the video gets stored on this..." referring to the film cartridge gave me a little chill!

That's a little like referring to the audio stored on a vinyl record as "radio".

(Kind of like the time I saw somebody call a 50 footer a "file".)

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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Mark Todd
Film God

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From: UK
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 - posted February 19, 2016 04:05 PM      Profile for Mark Todd   Email Mark Todd   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
It was the image goes through the elsn, then film on to a sensor by the interviewer made me tremble and the kodak chap didn`t really put him right.

Best Mark.

PS they could of done with a cut open of the film gate and claw etc.

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Osi Osgood
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From: #399R K.O.A. Mountian Home, ID. 83647
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 - posted February 20, 2016 11:32 AM      Profile for Osi Osgood   Author's Homepage   Email Osi Osgood   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I was going to ask if this new camera and film has a magnetic stripe to it, but it sounds like it doesn't.

However, if us super 8 enthusiasts make a campaign of asking them to provide a magnetic service to sound-stripe the films, they might just go for it, (as well as giving them a better idea as to just how many of us are out here!) [Smile]

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"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "

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Steve Klare
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From: Long Island, NY, USA
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 - posted February 20, 2016 11:41 AM      Profile for Steve Klare   Email Steve Klare   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
If they striped film again I'd buy a sound camera in a heartbeat!

Even in the old days people shot Super-8 with separate sound capture. For example the black and white stocks never came in a sound cartridge and if you wanted sound, you had to stripe and sync later.

This one IS a sound camera, just in a new way. I think you could still manage sound to post stripe with this, and it would be a lot easier than lugging a tape recorder around.

Yet I take it for granted how much simpler it is to shoot silent. There is so much stray sound in the world and that's the reason they have sound stages at studios: isolation. If I'd been shooting sound the whole time I can't count how many times I'd have some yahoo saying "Ya takin' pitchas?" on my stripe!

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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Andrew Woodcock
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From: Manchester Uk
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 - posted February 20, 2016 12:56 PM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
Osi, I think there is little chance of magnetic sound film ever being produced again now as most of the process and substances used back then to produce pre striped stock wouldn't be permitted or considered safe in today's health and safety obsessed world.

It's a real shame because it would really only be sound film that I would ever be interested in purchasing if I were to start filming again now.

I used sound cartridges all of the time in the early 90's so to go back to using silent stock would be like devolution to me I'm afraid and therefore wouldn't interest me if I'm honest.

Transferring the sound from an SD card wouldn't be an issue,
but watching it on a projector while ever no viable striping services exist here in the UK, would be.

As with package movies, I really wouldn't ever have the patience to be bothered setting up a separate digital sound rig just to sync pulse every screening of each film, so that isn't an option either as far as I'm concerned.

I shot nearly two hours worth of film in my time at Florida back then and I have to say, no one batted an eyelid at what I was doing.
The live sound wasn't spoiled or impaired in any way. Quite natural to be honest and certainly much much better than if the film had just had music overlayed onto it from some post development striping, something I was never a fan of to be honest.

I cannot imagine the stage show of the newly released film at the time, Beauty & The Beast, Sea World, or the Mickey Mania procession without live sound quite frankly.It really wouldn't be half the production it is without any live sound.
The quality was also exceptionally good from the Canon boom microphone and camera used back then.

I would definitely purchase another high end Canon sound camera if stock were produced again.

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Dominique De Bast
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From: Brussels, Belgium
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 - posted February 20, 2016 01:06 PM      Profile for Dominique De Bast   Email Dominique De Bast   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I agree that sound stock is better and easier to use that silent cartridges that you have to strip after process. But, from experience, for many subjects, there is no need to have direct sound. If you shoot your holidays, a documentary and so on, you will anyway have to record your sound after the film is edited. It is different if you shoot films with actors but how many amateurs do that ?

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Dominique

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

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From: Long Island, NY, USA
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 - posted February 20, 2016 01:09 PM      Profile for Steve Klare   Email Steve Klare   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
You would think with the computer technology we have now somebody would think of a simplified scheme of second system playback.

For example if you had all your tracks stored on a laptop and all that was encoded on a special leader was a filename for the track and a sync point.

Once the leader ended, so would the stripe.

You'd cable the projector audio and the per frame switch out to the laptop, click "go" on the computer and start the projector. After that the software would do the work.

(Won't be me!...I'm profoundly analog! I haven't done software since I discovered girls! -no coincidence, btw!)

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012


 - posted February 20, 2016 01:14 PM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
It's all the faffing around with a separate sound system that is off putting to me Steve.

The pre stripe mag sound stripe was perfect for most people's wishes back then and would still hold its own now in the current retro revival.

What it would need without, is a new projector with an SD card slot built in that syncs the sound for you to the frames in run, before my ears would prick up to this future way of obtaining the live sound.

That'd work!

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

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From: Long Island, NY, USA
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 - posted February 20, 2016 01:19 PM      Profile for Steve Klare   Email Steve Klare   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I look at it this way:

Right now I have all this hanging off my projector(s): mixer, 30 feet of shielded cable, interface box, amplifier, four speakers.

-what's one more piece?

Especially where the variables of striping and analog recording leave the equation.

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012


 - posted February 20, 2016 01:25 PM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
Yes, if you have a dedicated screening room, I suppose most equipment is already in place but for myself. I put it up and pull it down on each occasion.

More often than not, I just connect two small bookshelf speakers and I'm done unless I'm making a special effort.

Then I will additionally place a 5 pin din to 2x phono lead into a mixer and additionally feed the screen room with sound from the existing home cinema 5.1 set up on top.

Pulse sync lets not forget, still requires an exact start point between projector and source.
This currently still has to be done manually and is open to error. It's something that can achieved with practice quite easily within 3 attempts to make a recording onto stripe.
But to have to do this accurately with live screenings on each and every occasion, well not for me I'm afraid.

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

Posts: 6820
From: Long Island, NY, USA
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 - posted February 20, 2016 01:33 PM      Profile for Steve Klare   Email Steve Klare   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I don't have a dedicated screening room.

-I have the southern third (...sometimes half) of the dining room table and a supportive wife!

My end of the bargain is to return to full dining room mode whenever the need arises.

(Next house: full, finished basement!)

What my system would do is have a very low speed digital signal recorded on the leader that would tell the laptop (or tablet?) "play this audio file starting right here".

For the user it wouldn't be that different than having the track on stripe.

The beauty of it is any sound projector with a 1/f switch and an audio output could do the job. Even a monaural machine could play stereo films.

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012


 - posted February 20, 2016 01:44 PM      Profile for Andrew Woodcock         Edit/Delete Post 
Yes that'd work Steve while ever you can place a sonic blip onto the magnetic leader and recreate it accurately on your digital track.

You'd just need to get hold of an D.C. electronically driven projector with a connecting pulse socket to make this all work for you plus a piece of electronic gadgetry to make the digital track commence from detecting the first sound trigger point.

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"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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