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» 8mm Forum   » 8mm Forum   » ELMO GS1200 - Take-up motor stopped - HELP!

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Author Topic: ELMO GS1200 - Take-up motor stopped - HELP!
Paulo Pereira
Junior
Posts: 2
From: Porto, Portugal
Registered: Oct 2018


 - posted November 07, 2018 04:25 PM      Profile for Paulo Pereira   Email Paulo Pereira   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hi!

The take-up motor (on rear arm) of my ELMO GS-1200 has stopped some time ago (always worked fine and smooth!).

Since then, me and a friend, we've been trying to figure out what's the problem. He, as a specialist on electronics, has done several procedures:

- verified the motor and it is working, so it's not the problem;
- verified voltages;
- replaced relay ry302 - Matsushita NC2D-P-DC12V;
- cleaned most of electric and electronic components

- and (wich was the most dramatic) concluded that the Layout drawing for the main circuit board that's presented on the Service Manual doesn't correspond to the one that is on the projector..;
- and, more, the circuit board that's on the projector doesn't have the reference for its components..
- and it's missing the schematic of the regulator for the tension of the motors...

We've tried almost everything..
Does anyone have a clue on what's going on?
Does anyone have the schematics?

Thanks!

Paulo

[ November 07, 2018, 05:43 PM: Message edited by: Paulo Pereira ]

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Bill Brandenstein
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1624
From: California
Registered: Aug 2007


 - posted November 07, 2018 05:53 PM      Profile for Bill Brandenstein   Email Bill Brandenstein   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I'm no expert on this, and others here will do better, but since I'm first: a broken gear may be the suspect.

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Stuart Finkelstein
Film Handler

Posts: 52
From: Boston, MA, USA
Registered: Dec 2010


 - posted November 07, 2018 11:51 PM      Profile for Stuart Finkelstein   Email Stuart Finkelstein   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
This is a common problem with the GS series. These units are now 40+ years old. The motors do go.

Contact Leon Norris through this board, he has many posts and threads laced throughout these pages. He's the answer man for Elmo GS projectors.

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Jim Schrader
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1554
From: Savage, MN, USA
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted November 08, 2018 01:18 PM      Profile for Jim Schrader   Author's Homepage   Email Jim Schrader   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Yep Leon is your guy he is currently selling these motors now get them before he runs out here is is quote form a different thread-
Also the price for the GS1200 take-up and rewind motors are 185.00 each! I also have the all gold look motors with the longer motor shaft . they take the all brass gear. Which can last forever! These were in the newer models of the GS1200. All are brand new.

--------------------
jim schrader
"Let's see “do I have that title already?"

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Leon Norris
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 665
From: Elkins Park, PA, USA
Registered: Jun 2012


 - posted November 09, 2018 09:37 AM      Profile for Leon Norris   Email Leon Norris   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hi Paulo, I sent you a PM on how to fix it! Let me know how you made out! Leon Norris

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Bill Brandenstein
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1624
From: California
Registered: Aug 2007


 - posted November 09, 2018 05:56 PM      Profile for Bill Brandenstein   Email Bill Brandenstein   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Paulo stated up front that the motor is OK.

Unless it isn't?

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Leon Norris
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 665
From: Elkins Park, PA, USA
Registered: Jun 2012


 - posted November 09, 2018 06:12 PM      Profile for Leon Norris   Email Leon Norris   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Bill,I gave him three things to do to fix the takeup problem! Hopefully he will straighten it out! I have not heard from him yet! We will see? Leon Norris

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Paulo Pereira
Junior
Posts: 2
From: Porto, Portugal
Registered: Oct 2018


 - posted November 13, 2018 11:33 AM      Profile for Paulo Pereira   Email Paulo Pereira   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Thank you very much, guys, for all your kind help!

Thank you Leon! I'll read what you've send me and after i'll post here some news about it.

Just to remember, i've said that the motor itself is working fine, but it's not getting power to work.

When you press "play" the "power" doesn't arrive to the motor..

Leon, i have replied to your PM.

Thank you once again!

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Thomas Knappstein
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 109
From: Erwitte, Germany
Registered: Oct 2017


 - posted January 23, 2019 10:29 PM      Profile for Thomas Knappstein   Email Thomas Knappstein   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
You must replace Relay 301 and not 302.
It is the bigger one. This Relay swich the DC Power on for the take Up Motor.

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Antoine Orsero
Master Film Handler

Posts: 372
From: marseille france
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted January 28, 2019 04:43 AM      Profile for Antoine Orsero   Author's Homepage   Email Antoine Orsero   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
When I move a little relay 302, the take-up motor restarts! When I flush weld points with the contact cleaner, the take-up also starts. I would like to remove the relay cover to clean the contacts but I can not do it too hard!

--------------------
Tony

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Phil Murat
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 624
From: Villeneuve St Georges, France
Registered: Dec 2015


 - posted January 28, 2019 07:44 AM      Profile for Phil Murat   Email Phil Murat   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hello Antoine,

Avoid to open these relays. Even if you temporarily save them, it will not last a long. These relays are not oversized at the origin and are allowing low amp (5 Amp).
I suggest you to find an equivalent oversized (more than 5 Amp to be safe and quiet for a long).
Dial on google the norm of this relay will lead you on a choice of different brands.

For Exemple , have a look for this one (Ref :55.32.9.012.0040) , it is rated for 10Amp (instead of 5Amp) :
[URL=https://fr.rs-online.com/web/p/relais-sans-accrochage/1893156/?cm_mmc=FR-PPC-DS3A-_-google-_-DSA_FR_FR_Relays-_-Non-Latching_Relays-_-DYNAMIC+SEARCH+ADS&matchtype=b&dsa-533155 652332&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI2ZP-o9SQ4AIVTkPTCh3oBg3WEAAYASAAEgIP0fD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds]BIG RELAY[/URL]

I suggest you to download "Datasheet" at the bottom of Web page, you will find a lot of informations to make your "market"....

If you met difficulties with equivalent items send me PM, in French or course .... [Wink]

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Myriam Longin
Junior
Posts: 5
From: Zwijndrecht, Belgium
Registered: Feb 2015


 - posted January 28, 2019 08:52 AM      Profile for Myriam Longin   Email Myriam Longin   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hello Antoine,
see all parts for gs1200

www.van-eck.net

https://www.van-eck.net/itable.php?lang=nl&size=0&cat=film&merk=52&type=GS 1200

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Antoine Orsero
Master Film Handler

Posts: 372
From: marseille france
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted January 28, 2019 10:14 AM      Profile for Antoine Orsero   Author's Homepage   Email Antoine Orsero   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Thank you for your answers! I know that van-eck sells relays. But my problem is that I have no repairer in Marseille.

--------------------
Tony

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Phil Murat
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 624
From: Villeneuve St Georges, France
Registered: Dec 2015


 - posted January 28, 2019 01:00 PM      Profile for Phil Murat   Email Phil Murat   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hi Antoine,

I suggest you to put a thread in Forum "Le Transfert de Pellicule", some members registered are keen in Electronic systems.
From my side I learned a lot in Electronic with some of them, this is one of the best web site I have seen !

Some of them are living in south of France.
Register and explain exactly what you need joinning very good pictures and you ll get an answer.
There are some tabs dedicated to "Electronic" questions.
Indicate that you need somebody to make the repair in your region.

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Antoine Orsero
Master Film Handler

Posts: 372
From: marseille france
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted January 31, 2019 07:45 AM      Profile for Antoine Orsero   Author's Homepage   Email Antoine Orsero   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hello,
I had a problem with one of my Elmo GS1200. The reel made a strange noise and I changed the corresponding engine by another brand new one I had in reserve. But the film rewinded upside down. I concluded that it came from electrical connections. But it was not that. I looked at the planks of spare parts and I realized that a gear does not have the same reference between the arm of the supply spool and that of the take-up spool.
I am attaching the pictures of these spare parts and I have marked in red the gears.
Do you think the problem comes from there?
Thank you for your advice.
cordially
 -  -

--------------------
Tony

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Phil Murat
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 624
From: Villeneuve St Georges, France
Registered: Dec 2015


 - posted January 31, 2019 12:18 PM      Profile for Phil Murat   Email Phil Murat   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
PM sent Antoine

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Antoine Orsero
Master Film Handler

Posts: 372
From: marseille france
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted February 06, 2019 05:02 AM      Profile for Antoine Orsero   Author's Homepage   Email Antoine Orsero   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
hi

It's weird: I turn on my GS 1200 and look at relay 301, it works but the take-up does not run. If I send a jet of product to clean the contacts of the plate where the welds are, take-up turns. I'm watching a 120m film and the take-up always turns until it stops alone. I put the product back on the welds and take-up turning again. I checked the welds with a magnifying glass and they are in good condition. I do not understand anything anymore

--------------------
Tony

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Miguel Roman
Junior
Posts: 8
From: Granada, Spain
Registered: Dec 2017


 - posted February 06, 2019 06:38 AM      Profile for Miguel Roman   Email Miguel Roman   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hello Antoine: for weeks my GS1200 was working irregularly, sometimes the engine picked up the film, others stopped intermittently ... until it stopped working.
I dismounted, checked ... and finally threw the towel, put it in the hands of
Van-eck: € 282.20 was the amount of the repair, transport costs included.
Luck

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Paul Browning
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 992
From: West Midlands United Kingdom
Registered: Aug 2011


 - posted February 06, 2019 06:41 AM      Profile for Paul Browning   Email Paul Browning   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Antoine, if you spray contact cleaner on the soldered joints and it works temporarily you must have a dry joint of at least one of these. All the cleaner is doing is shorting the terminal so that the electrical energy is connection across it. I would find someone close at hand to re solder these connection with fresh solder, remove the old stuff completely, these are dry joints...

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Leon Norris
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 665
From: Elkins Park, PA, USA
Registered: Jun 2012


 - posted February 06, 2019 09:35 AM      Profile for Leon Norris   Email Leon Norris   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Antoine, Take your soldering iron and hit all the solder joints! Around the relay! Then try it. That might bring it back to life? By the way what model is it? Newer or older! Easy way to tell is look at the front cover! If the loop former knob is pointing towards the rear. Then its the newer one, if its pointing towards the front. Then its the older model!

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Phil Murat
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 624
From: Villeneuve St Georges, France
Registered: Dec 2015


 - posted February 06, 2019 09:45 AM      Profile for Phil Murat   Email Phil Murat   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
PM sent Antoine

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Antoine Orsero
Master Film Handler

Posts: 372
From: marseille france
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted February 06, 2019 03:55 PM      Profile for Antoine Orsero   Author's Homepage   Email Antoine Orsero   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Leon:
the loop is turning towards the rear
Antoine

--------------------
Tony

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Leon Norris
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 665
From: Elkins Park, PA, USA
Registered: Jun 2012


 - posted February 06, 2019 05:30 PM      Profile for Leon Norris   Email Leon Norris   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
That's the newer model that you have. Elmo Improved it!

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