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Author Topic: Mindless "adult" stupidity from eBay
Adrian Winchester
Film God

Posts: 2941
From: Croydon, London, UK
Registered: Aug 2004


 - posted March 02, 2011 09:20 AM      Profile for Adrian Winchester     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I've recently been offering on eBay several 8mm films from a collection of 1960s glamour films I acquired. I initially unwisely posted a screen shot featuring a topless lady, so since then I've been careful to avoid posting anything dubious. I'm now irritated that eBay have removed my latest listing. The film had a few inoffensive topless shots but was basically cheeky comedy, it would probably get a 12 certificate today and no one could possibly consider it an adult or erotic film. I complained but received a bland but lengthy stock reply, which did not explain why my film was removed whilst numerous others are being sold - which I find highly descriminatory! Maybe the problem was that I had the word "Gay" in the listing, but that was the surname of the producer! I've tried another message but I don't expect a proper reply. Its even more annoying when you see that there's no problem selling graphic DVDs like 'Last Tango In Paris' (which contravenes several of their rules), because it counts as a 'mainstream film' that has been certificated by an appropriate body!

I wondered if anyone thinks there's any way to get a direct answer to a question like "why is that listing that's been on eBay for weeks OK when mine isn't?". They should offer the opportunity to have a listing approved in advance. If I conclude that I'm being discriminated against, I'll see if any trading standards-type body will offer support, but I won't count on it!

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Adrian Winchester

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Wayne Tuell
Master Film Handler

Posts: 488
From: Minden, NV
Registered: Jul 2009


 - posted March 02, 2011 10:03 AM      Profile for Wayne Tuell   Author's Homepage   Email Wayne Tuell   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Amazing how they will remove stuff over stupid crap such as someones name being gay...and a boob.

I emailed and CALLED ebay over a dirtbag seller who was stealing photos from my site and claiming them as his own to sell things he didn't even get from me. After going through a series of clicks, ebay has a specific section to file a complaint for someone stealing your web material and passing it off as their own. What do I get back...a nothing we can do about it, contact VERO if you believe our guidelines have been violated.

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www.16mmDrive-InFilms.com

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Michael O'Regan
Film God

Posts: 3085
From: Essex, UK
Registered: Oct 2007


 - posted March 02, 2011 12:49 PM      Profile for Michael O'Regan   Email Michael O'Regan   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Even if the word "gay" appears in the listing, why would that be grounds for removing the listing?

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Mark Williams
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 846
From: West Sussex
Registered: Mar 2007


 - posted March 02, 2011 01:06 PM      Profile for Mark Williams   Email Mark Williams   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Adrian,

You have to be very careful when it comes to listing adult titles on the ever puritan ebay even the most inoffensive topless glamour movies can be pulled if they don't like the description and a pair of breasts in a photo are a real no no!!!

However you can get round this by putting stickers over the offending orbs or other naughty bits to appease the powers that be.

Its a pathetic situation really.

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Adrian Winchester
Film God

Posts: 2941
From: Croydon, London, UK
Registered: Aug 2004


 - posted March 02, 2011 01:25 PM      Profile for Adrian Winchester     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
It's only speculation that the word 'gay' was a factor, but as I've listed several similar films without problems (including 2 or 3 that are still on eBay), I wondered if it could be the explanation but I may well be wrong. My rationale would be that a carried away eBay staff member might spot the word and assume that it has a sexual connotation. Another possibility is that as the listing mentioned that the film title was 'The Naked Truth', they felt it implied explicit nudity. Maybe they automatically filter listings for certain words, because this one was removed within about 2 hours.

Regarding photos, I don't even risk featuring box covers with areas covered; my listing showed a screen shot of the star wearing underwear.

The irony is that you see people 'getting away' with listing films that definitely are 'adult' and any staff member with a brian would perceive that! I can only assume they generally manage it by not mentioning the title of the film, not featuring anything revealing in a screen shot and being very careful with the wording.

I wouldn't mind them being puritanical if they were consistent; it's crazy that feature films with explicit sex and graphic nudity are considered OK if vintage glamour isn't.

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Adrian Winchester

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Michael O'Regan
Film God

Posts: 3085
From: Essex, UK
Registered: Oct 2007


 - posted March 02, 2011 01:41 PM      Profile for Michael O'Regan   Email Michael O'Regan   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Somebody has been selling a lot of 8mm adult stuff over the past few months but listing them as "art" films. I'm not sure if that's you Adrian but if not, perhaps you could try this as this guy seems to have no problem.

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Adrian Winchester
Film God

Posts: 2941
From: Croydon, London, UK
Registered: Aug 2004


 - posted March 02, 2011 02:01 PM      Profile for Adrian Winchester     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
It's not me but I think I might know who you mean. One person is always vague and claims to not know the titles. The other has been known to offer 100ft 16mm glamour films for up to £299! It might be worth a try but I'm surprised that the strategy works; in all my years of collecting, I can only recall ever seeing one or two genuine 'art films' on offer, so there's no way that anyone will own dozens of them!

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Adrian Winchester

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Lee Mannering
Film God

Posts: 3216
From: The Projection Box
Registered: Nov 2006


 - posted March 02, 2011 02:05 PM      Profile for Lee Mannering     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Adrian
Gay traditionally means happy but thats fleabay for you as they get it wrong again!
[Roll Eyes]

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Pasquale DAlessio
Film God

Posts: 3523
From: Bristol,RI, USA
Registered: May 2010


 - posted March 02, 2011 03:05 PM      Profile for Pasquale DAlessio     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Ebay has a "mature" section for all those films to be listed. That's where it belongs. Anybody that wants to buy it will go there looking for it. I was looking for a cartoon with my granddaughter and one of those films was listed. I didn't appreciate it one bit. That's what none of you are thinking about. Put it in the adult section plain and simple.

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Mark Williams
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 846
From: West Sussex
Registered: Mar 2007


 - posted March 02, 2011 04:06 PM      Profile for Mark Williams   Email Mark Williams   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Ebay.co.uk has no mature section unlike ebay.com USA so thats why we have so much trouble listing even the most innocent of films,perhaps they don't want to treat us as adults here in the UK?

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Greg Marshall
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 612
From: Nashville, TN USA
Registered: Sep 2008


 - posted March 02, 2011 08:42 PM      Profile for Greg Marshall     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Ebay USA... Porn capital of the world! [Eek!]

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Winbert Hutahaean
Film God

Posts: 5468
From: Nouméa, New Caledonia
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted March 03, 2011 12:02 PM      Profile for Winbert Hutahaean     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
[see below]

[ March 03, 2011, 03:21 PM: Message edited by: Winbert Hutahaean ]

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Winbert

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Adrian Winchester
Film God

Posts: 2941
From: Croydon, London, UK
Registered: Aug 2004


 - posted March 03, 2011 02:20 PM      Profile for Adrian Winchester     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Much as I'd object to having to put the glamour films I've been selling in a 'mature' section, I'd be interested to know why the USA can have this and the UK cannot. Can anyone think of a reason?

I must emphasise how inoffensive many of the glamour films of the 1940s to the 1960s are - some that I've sold simply have ladies walking around or posing in swimsuits.

If anyone can face reading it, here's my latest depressing reply from eBay, which acknowledges that they are willing to remove films that are completely inoffensive, if they are "unrated":

"I'd like to draw your attention that eBay can not verify the details of the film you have listed on the site. We, therefore, rely of official rating of the films to judge the items. Hence, any unrated such films are prohibited to be listed on the site since these items open the risk of explicit nature. Though, it might be possible that your film is not in adult nature but please consider that we can not risk other items herewith and we have to judge on the basis of film ratings.

Please consider that millions of items are listed on the site on every single day on eBay, our investigation departments work on them and they generally reply on reports from community members, legal authorities and right owners. It's sometime possible that we are not able to reach all the listings. Sooner or later all such items are removed from the site, you will be able to see a gradual decrease in the volume of such listings.

At any given time when you see an item that is prohibited, that does not mean that is allowed or we have made an exception but we are still not made aware of the same or we are still working on such items."

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Adrian Winchester

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Winbert Hutahaean
Film God

Posts: 5468
From: Nouméa, New Caledonia
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted March 03, 2011 03:21 PM      Profile for Winbert Hutahaean     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
I'd be interested to know why the USA can have this and the UK cannot. Can anyone think of a reason?
It is about local rules. Although Ebay (also Paypal) a global-wide company but still must to follow the local rules.

Probably in UK you cannot sell "mature" items at the place where is public.

In Germany, I found that you cannot do the same. It has to be put like "21 Jahre"...sort of like that. Also not for Swastika items.

Obviously when Ebay operates in Indonesia nothing such item even soft porn can be sold. We are more puritan in this matter. Also Item with "The hammer and sickle" symbol.

cheers,

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Winbert

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Adrian Winchester
Film God

Posts: 2941
From: Croydon, London, UK
Registered: Aug 2004


 - posted March 03, 2011 04:34 PM      Profile for Adrian Winchester     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Winbert - I'm not sure if that can explain it in relation to the UK. Countless newsagents and DVD shops here sell material that is vastly more explicit than vintage 8mm films that feature scenes of ladies in underwear, swimwear and some topless shots. Any such retailer would think it laughable that these sort of 8mm films are considered 'adult' by eBay!

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Adrian Winchester

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Winbert Hutahaean
Film God

Posts: 5468
From: Nouméa, New Caledonia
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted March 03, 2011 05:31 PM      Profile for Winbert Hutahaean     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Adrian selling those porn movies freely on the store does not mean that is legal.

Here in Toronto, I can also easily to get pirate DVDs from several big malls.

The same thing too with fake perfumes. Even they were sold in CNE (Canadian National Exhibition) without any problems.

The second thing that might be, those stores have license to sell it but Ebayers cannot show that license. Similar to sell a gun, you cannot do that through Ebay, but yet there are gun stores every where.

My 2 cents though,

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Winbert

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Adrian Winchester
Film God

Posts: 2941
From: Croydon, London, UK
Registered: Aug 2004


 - posted March 03, 2011 06:20 PM      Profile for Adrian Winchester     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
For what it's worth, I think the key point regarding the absurdity of this is that there were very restrictive censorship laws in the UK in the 1960s, so any glamour film that was clearly sold by distributor openly operating in the UK is bound to have far less explicit nudity than many of the 18 certificate films that eBay consider acceptable to sell. I would therefore say that eBay's point that they are not certificated is irrelevant. To look at it another way, features like 'Last Tango In Paris', that eBay have no problem with, would have been banned in the 1960s, as a result of the very same laws which considered glamour films acceptable!

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Adrian Winchester

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