8mm Forum: Sound films for silent projectors

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Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on October 30, 2014, 02:30 PM:

I saw an ad for standard (regular) 8 accompanied with a 33 rpm record (in English). The system is easy to understand : you screen the (silent) film with your silent projector and at the same time you play the record with your record player. Does any one know if there had been many films relased this way ?

Posted by Douglas Meltzer (Member # 28) on October 30, 2014, 02:39 PM:

Dominique,

Americom Films released silent Standard 8 & Super 8 films along with a soundtrack record. The films also were subtitled.
Here's one thread about them.

Doug

Posted by Maurizio Di Cintio (Member # 144) on October 30, 2014, 03:53 PM:

How did they keep in sync???? [Confused]

Posted by Douglas Meltzer (Member # 28) on October 30, 2014, 04:27 PM:

Maurizio,

I got some of these when I first started collecting. I had a variable speed Ricoh projector and I'd have to adjust the speed every so often. It was never in perfect sync, but I didn't care! I could show movies with sound!

Doug

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on October 30, 2014, 05:06 PM:

Thank you, Doug !

Posted by John Yapp (Member # 2873) on October 30, 2014, 05:32 PM:

"Start Projector on tone."

Posted by Brad Kimball (Member # 5) on October 30, 2014, 05:57 PM:

The audio was modulated to play at 18fps. When you listen to the records today it's so apparent that the audio has been slowed down a tad. It sounds pretty awful. Years ago it was a big thrill to be able to actually have the audio accompanying the film and at the age of 12...Who knew? The Americom film with records were a great novelty that unfortunately didn't last long being that Americom went bankrupt some time in the mid 70's. The film prints were actually printed by Triangle Laboratories in New York and the licenses were held by Columbia in partnership with Americom (a flexi-disc company) also based out of New York. Triangle did the prints for Columbia's 8mm home movie division. I've heard that Triangle also did many prints for Blackhawk after Blackhawk's lab suffered considerable damage due to a fire in their building. This would explain the vast quality differences that collectors often refer to during Blackhawk's last few years in the 8mm game. Many of their 16mm titles were printed by a different lab, but I don't know whom.

Posted by Maurizio Di Cintio (Member # 144) on October 31, 2014, 08:51 AM:

Thanks, Doug. One of the previous posts mentioned the fact the sound was slowed down without altering the pitch- How was that possible considering the era's technology? Would it be possible to put some mp3 samples of these discs on here?

Posted by Douglas Meltzer (Member # 28) on October 31, 2014, 08:58 AM:

If any members have an mp3 file of sample audio from an Americom release and can send it to me, I'll provide a link.

Doug

Posted by Gary Crawford (Member # 67) on October 31, 2014, 09:15 AM:

I had to tape the records onto reel to reel and later to cassette to run them....and yes the sound was a bit odd and never in perfect sync...but I remember Curse of Frankenstein worked pretty well since it had little or no dialog.

Posted by Jean-Marc Toussaint (Member # 270) on October 31, 2014, 10:11 AM:

Same here, although it was for "Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea".

Posted by Brad Kimball (Member # 5) on October 31, 2014, 11:18 AM:

Gary's correct... "Curse Of Frankenstein" is mostly music and sound effects, but "Birth Of Frankenstein", "Horror Of Dracula" and the "Fu Manchu" titles have more dialogue that is very difficult to sync up to. They're still fun to watch, though. My kids, of course, think the whole concept is outrageous and can't wrap their brains around any of it. You had to be a collector back in the day to really grasp how this was (as kids today say) "bangin'". My Lord how things sure have changed. Including the english language. I asked my daughter if "bangin'" was a word she learned in class. To which she replied (fortunately) "No..Silly....It's something kids say when something is really cool. Dad... you're so out of touch". Then she giggled and said "enjoy your movie, Dad" and left the room.

Posted by Brian Fretwell (Member # 4302) on November 01, 2014, 08:16 AM:

I had/have a Laurel & Hardy one and a cartoon "Beetle Bailey". At the time I had a battery/mains projector which could be slowed down by touching the manual frame advance and a turntable that could be slowed by putting a finger on it. I could keep sync roughly like that,.

I'm not sure where they are now, but do still have the projector - now unused as it has a flat gate and scratches all films.

Posted by Len Horowitz (Member # 2217) on August 07, 2017, 09:33 PM:

I purchased some Offical Films that were 8mm Vitaphone with lip synch. I want to find that projector. One 12 " record with each 200 ft reel of film. Can you help me?

Posted by Guy Taylor, Jr. (Member # 786) on August 08, 2017, 05:08 AM:

Actually it is "Birth of Frankenstein," an extract from "Curse of Frankenstein," that is the one with little dialog. It begins with the scene in the graveyard with them cutting down the body from the gallows.

This was the only one I had from Americom. Like Warner Brothers, the Vitaphone Sound System was my first method of sound movies.

Posted by William Olson (Member # 2083) on August 08, 2017, 10:47 AM:

I still have Americom's Curse of Frankenstein with the original packaging including the record.

Posted by Panayotis A. Carayannis (Member # 1220) on August 09, 2017, 02:03 PM:

[ August 10, 2017, 02:22 PM: Message edited by: Panayotis A. Carayannis ]

Posted by Panayotis A. Carayannis (Member # 1220) on August 13, 2017, 03:49 AM:

This topic and "Vitaphone 8" should be joined together as they deal with the same question. Yes,there were other companies selling films with discs.I have seen an ad from the thirties of a 16 mm projector/disc player combined unit. For some reason I couldn't upload all four pictures I took from my (only!) film- with-disc,(the first photo was appearing four times) So,I am posting them separately.

Now, a similar thing happened.I posted another picture,it looked ok at the preview post but,it also changed the previously posted picture into the recent one.Pleaase explain someone [Confused]

Posted by Maurice Leakey (Member # 916) on August 13, 2017, 05:58 AM:

Western Electric had a 16mm sound-on-disc projector in the early thirties. The projector was made by Victor, and the sound by W.E.
https://www.google.com/culturalinstitute/beta/asset/motion-picture-projector-western-electric-16mm-sound-on-disc-projector-and-speaker/HAHiNr81u2IWAQ

Posted by Douglas Meltzer (Member # 28) on August 13, 2017, 02:40 PM:

Panayotis,

The change in picture has to do with how you've named it. If you upload a picture with the name "picture 150" it will replace the previous picture named "picture 150". Try using a combination of your first name, the subject and a different number to differentiate between the pictures you upload.

Doug

Posted by Panayotis A. Carayannis (Member # 1220) on August 14, 2017, 12:50 AM:

Thank you. I will ty it.

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