This is topic Hi from new member in Greece in forum General Yak at 8mm Forum.
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Posted by Robert Perkins (Member # 3847) on July 30, 2013, 12:35 AM:
Hi there. My given name is Robert but just about everyone calls me Bob. I'm an American who's been living in Greece for the past ten years. Recently I was cleaning out a large storage room for my in-laws when I found the 8mm home movies my wife hoped would be in there. I also found a Eumig Mark S projector. So begins the quest to telecine these 3 minute flicks and preserve them against the ravages of time.
I joined this forum to be able to ask questions about the Eumig because I've never operated any kind of film projector before. I did a search for "Eumig Mark S" and am slowly reading every thread that that search produced. So far I haven't seen a thread about or a picture of the particular model that we have. From my searches around the web I've gathered that this is the first model of this line of projectors. So that would be my first question: could anyone please confirm this or positively identify this beast for me, please?
And speaking of the ravages of time, according to my wife's memory, this machine has not been used in at least 40 years and for most of that time stored in a room with a working oil fired furnace.
I was able to find replacements for the projector and pilot lamps but not a take up reel. I found that a reel from a reel to reel audio machine fit on the spindle of the Eumig and also had a slot that I could insert the end of the film into.
So I picked out a film reel last night of the 40 odd that I found, mounted on the Eumig, threaded it, hit the play control and as if by magic, this little time machine took us back to the early 60's to see some young Greek adults who my wife didn't recognize cavorting about and even skipping rope.
I had set up the projector pointing at the piece of paper on the wall and had the camcorder ready to capture whatever might happen.
The Eumig played through the entire 2 minute reel without a snag while I worked to get it and the camcorder focused. The snag came at the end when I tried to rewind the reel. I opened the back and saw that the drive spindle was not going far enough to the right to engage the disk and pushing it by hand would make it go no further. So, to rewind the reel I had to reverse the take up and supply reels and run it in forward.
That's where the project stands until I can get some more info. Thanks for having me on the forum. I hope to be hearing from some of you about this machine, movies in general and video processing.
And please call me Bob (is there a way I can change my login name to that?)
Posted by John Clancy (Member # 49) on July 30, 2013, 02:38 AM:
I shouldn't worry about the rewind not working. You have found one solution by reversing the reels and rewinding it forwards. An alternative would be to find a standard 8mm or dual standard 8mm and Super 8 editor on eBay and use that to rewind films manually.
With regards to transferring the films to video with the method you are doing it's probably not worth it because the end results will be fairly awful. The reels you are screening are probably Kodachrome which will mean excellent image quality. This will not be preserved at all by videoing them off the wall (or paper). But with a little trial and error you should be able to improve the results and one vital piece of information is to get the speed of the projector set to 16.66 frames per second. You'll know when it's around this speed because the video camera picks up perceptible flicker and it's gone when the speed of the projector hits 16.66fps. Whether or not your projector has a variable speed adjustment I don't know but it may well have.
Posted by Pasquale DAlessio (Member # 2052) on July 30, 2013, 02:47 AM:
WELCOME TO THE FORUM BOB!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted by Antonis Galanakis (Member # 1455) on July 30, 2013, 03:18 AM:
Kalimera from Athens.
Welcome to the forum.
Posted by Hugh Thompson Scott (Member # 2922) on July 30, 2013, 10:36 AM:
Hi Bob,welcome to the forum. Good advice from John, your projector does have speed adjustment from 16 to 24 fps.
If the projector tends to run slow, remove the rear cover and give
the rubber discs a rub with a bit of glass paper, this will ensure better traction with the ball drive, and might restore reverse.
Posted by Robert Perkins (Member # 3847) on July 30, 2013, 11:44 PM:
Thanks for the nice welcome, all.
@John Clancy: I'm not sure exactly what you mean by "But with a little trial and error you should be able to improve the results" or how much trial and error experimenting the projector or the films have left in them.
@Antonis Galanakis: Could you please tell me what you use to clean films with and where you find it in Greece?
@Hugh Thompson Scott: Since you say that the projector has a speed adjustment would you say that the answer to my first question in my OP is yes, that it is the first model of Eumig Mark S? I also said that the motor spindle is not making Any contact with the drive disk in reverse (there is a gap of about 2mm).
Thanks again for any info anyone may provide.
Posted by John Clancy (Member # 49) on July 31, 2013, 02:17 AM:
Trial and error:
1) Adjusting the speed to eliminate all trace of flicker
2) Getting the video camera as flat as possible in relation to the projected image
3) Seeing if you get better results in a fully dark room (I doubt it though).
Once you've experimented you may find you'll get image quality that is adequate. If not, then you'll have to start investigating aerial image transfers which will mean you'll need a special lens and adapting the projector with a low wattage lamp running off its own power supply. Other things required too but it's not impossible. Probably cheaper and better to get someone to do the job for you. Generally costs around £1 to £1.50 per minute of film transferred. Then again, some people do this and don't have much idea of what they're doing - I've seen some awful results where people have paid big money for the privilege and then the film has come to me to do it properly.
Posted by Yanis Tzortzis (Member # 434) on July 31, 2013, 05:50 AM:
a very warm welcome from a Greek living in the UK; 'kalos irthes'
...don't think you can find film cleaner in Greece...speak to Phil
Sheard from CHC or Paul Foster in the UK...
Posted by Robert Perkins (Member # 3847) on August 01, 2013, 03:53 AM:
Thanks for taking time to elaborate, John. After trying to video the projected image last night, I've decided to abandon that approach. I don't believe I'll be able to control the speed of this projector I have well enough to eliminate the flicker. This is one of the first projects I came across when searching for a telecine method and I'm still most impressed by this one: Retro Telecine .
Yanis, thanks for the welcome. Hope things are better in UK for a Greek than they are here. No big surprise about the non-availability of film cleaner here. Finding some 99% isopropyl was a small challenge.
Posted by Yanis Tzortzis (Member # 434) on August 01, 2013, 06:25 AM:
Robert,can I (strongly!) recommend that you come to the (sadly last....)BFCC on Oct.26th. Am sure you'll find more than a bottle of cleaner
Posted by Antonis Galanakis (Member # 1455) on August 01, 2013, 12:33 PM:
I use FILMGUARD and I buy it from EBay. It is excellent cleaner and lubricant. I use it all the time and I am very pleased with it.
Posted by John Clancy (Member # 49) on August 02, 2013, 02:48 AM:
The transfer method on 'retro telecine' looks extremely complicated to me. Best results come from aerial image transfer which defies logic as to exactly why they are superior to all the scanning methods in existence today. But it is easy to make a Gordon Brown of them and it takes quite a bit of experimentation to get them spot on.
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