8mm Forum: Is there life after BFCC?

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Posted by Yanis Tzortzis (Member # 434) on October 23, 2013, 06:21 AM:

....with the opening of the (last?) BFCC imminent,can't help thinking of the next day in conventions. SO I decided to ask for info about it-let those who know a bit more than me help with the following questions:
--is it REALLY the last BFCC as we know it? Or does it depend on other factors (eg. attendance, fees etc) that are difficult to say how they'll decide its future-so we play by ear?
--IF it's the last, are there any thoughts about having another event in London for the south,as there's always Blackpool for the North?
--if yes, is it going to be a 'smaller' thing (eg.without film shows-just dealers & bring & buy) to make running it affordable? And perhaps make it more spring-time so as not to almost coincide with Blackpool (two fairs within 3 weeks)?
...quite a few questions there I know, but it'd be good to have an idea about the future;does anyone have some info to share?...

Posted by Mal Brake (Member # 14) on October 23, 2013, 08:33 AM:

According to John Clancy, IF there enough collectors on the day, then MAYBE the event could survive for another year.So I suppose it's up to us to make the effort to attend if possible and show how much the BFCC means to us.
I imagine feedback from the dealers would play a major part in deciding what happens in the future.
Whatever the outcome we should just enjoy the day to the fullest.

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on October 23, 2013, 08:53 AM:

That's good news. It would be sad that the first time I will go to the BFCC would be the last one !

Posted by Fabrizio Mosca (Member # 142) on October 23, 2013, 11:18 AM:

I think that the attendance is also linked to the material (both quality and quantity) that the dealers have for sale.
As a lot of films are going on ebay (even some dealers started to sell there), there's the risk that the attendance will go down due to the lack of availability of "good" films.
Unfortunately I noticed this both in 2011 and in 2012, at least for super8.
I hope that the dealers will consider this when they participate to the conventions.

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on October 23, 2013, 12:17 PM:

The amount of material is not the only thing to consider as you can anyway buy only a small fraction of what will see. These meetings also allow you to meet people sharing the same interests and you get often unexpected informations or advices.

Posted by Osi Osgood (Member # 424) on October 23, 2013, 12:48 PM:

I sure as hell hope so!

I'm hoping that I will be able to make one of these, especially if the organizers of this magnificent gathering can actually make it a go for at least one more time!!!!

(Fingers crossed on that!)

Posted by Fabrizio Mosca (Member # 142) on October 23, 2013, 01:13 PM:

Dominique, it's true what you say, but I've met collectors that go to convention mainly for buying (I'm speaking in general not specific for BFCC. Being one of the organizer of the previous editions of the Super8 Film Festival here in Milan made me aware of different aspects that, as a simple collector, I would not have seen).

Posted by Maurice Leakey (Member # 916) on October 23, 2013, 02:42 PM:

I go to Conventions mainly to buy. It's a chance to see what is available and to actually handle what is on sale, in the case of films we can see just what the colour is like, and if it is necessary we can also sniff to check for V.S.
None of this can be offered on an eBay sale.

Posted by Robert Crewdson (Member # 3790) on October 23, 2013, 03:31 PM:

Is there life after BFCC?. I have never been to a convention and this year will be no different. I buy my films through the post. I can understand that some people will go for the atmosphere. For me its a hobby, not an obsession. I'm spending less time on here to do other things, widening my horizon.

Posted by Paul Adsett (Member # 25) on October 23, 2013, 04:02 PM:

Robert, I would hardly call going to the BFCC as an obsession. Most film collectors go for the chance to meet other film collectors and exchange their views, ideas, and experiences of the hobby. If you happen to find a film to buy while you are there, well for most people that is icing on the cake.
Having been to the BFCC several times, I can tell you for sure that you are really missing out by not going, and the fact that you live so close makes your decision not to go all the more incredible to people like myself who have made the effort from overseas, and have been happy for it.
Doug Meltzer is coming all the way from New York this time, and I can assure you that Doug is not obsessed.
You still have plenty of time to re-consider, and show your support.

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on October 23, 2013, 04:55 PM:

Robert, I think that you're missing something. Why not considering to go once to see for yourself if it worths for you to go again or not ? Fabrizio, it could be interesting to have more informations about this Italian festival.

Posted by Adrian Winchester (Member # 248) on October 23, 2013, 05:06 PM:

While it's important to support the dealers, another great attribute of the BFCC is the spectacular shows on all guages and the chance to see recently-released material on Super 8. This is something you can't manage at home unless you live in a mansion with a massive screen and own the sort of projectors used at the BFCC. Sociable chat with fellow enthusiasts is part of it, although I find it's important to not get caught in conversations for too long, or you don't get round all the stalls. Conventions are also great for finding obscure bits and pieces (often equipment/accessories) that never otherwise seem to turn up.

Posted by Michael O'Regan (Member # 938) on October 23, 2013, 05:09 PM:

quote:
Conventions are also great for finding obscure bits and pieces (often equipment/accessories) that never otherwise seem to turn up.

I totally agree. There have always been items - both film and equipment - that never show up on dealers lists or on ebay.

Posted by Douglas Meltzer (Member # 28) on October 23, 2013, 06:05 PM:

Well, perhaps a little obsessed. This is a wonderful hobby and to get a chance to check out films for sale from a room full of dealers, learn about Warner Brothers and CinemaScope (this show's twin themes), see Super 8 projected on a 24 foot screen and meet many of the people who post on this Forum....what could be better?

Doug

Posted by Yanis Tzortzis (Member # 434) on October 23, 2013, 07:29 PM:

...if there's an obsession,it's with film,not with the Convention as such. BFCC's provided a great chance to get together,know how many we are, who we are,what we like,exchange opinions, experiences, knowledge and share all good things that make our hobby that great. OK it's also about buying,welling & viewing, but that's in the margin of BFCC...it's all that makes BFCC what it is-& sad losing it,if it happens...only thing, set in October it's just so close to Blackpool....

Posted by Steve Klare (Member # 12) on October 23, 2013, 07:44 PM:

The social dimension is definitely a plus. A guy I work with flies model helicopters. At least once a month he and a bunch of pals from his model aircraft club spend a Saturday morning flying together. They don't do much differently than they would alone, they just enjoy it more.

-as nice as it would be to have a bunch of film collectors in every town get together every month, we are just fewer and further between than all that. So conventions it must be.

Something that kind of sneaks up on you without you realizing it is that when you do this in solitude, every film you watch is one of your own, and unless you just got a package every film you watch is one you've seen several to perhaps many times. (Sometimes too many.)

When you get together with other collectors, you will see something on screen you've never seen before, and (unless you buy it) you may never see it again.

This is kind of refreshing!

[ October 23, 2013, 08:46 PM: Message edited by: Steve Klare ]

Posted by Lee Mannering (Member # 728) on October 24, 2013, 02:29 AM:

It’s always good to share things with others including our hobby me thinks. [Smile]

Posted by Terry Sills (Member # 3309) on October 24, 2013, 04:10 AM:

I used to love going to the BFCC convention when it was held at the Town Hall, Ealing, but the St Benedicts venue just doesn't hold the same appeal for me. The Town Hall had such atmosphere, with people rushing from room to room, up and down stairs, desperate to get a bargain. Great fun and almost a party atmosphere, a bit like hunt the thimble at Christmas used to be. I realise that the greedy council made it financially unviable - but such a shame to lose that venue. Just not the same now (for me anyway).

Posted by Fabrizio Mosca (Member # 142) on October 24, 2013, 03:20 PM:

Dominique, I'll give all the information directly on Saturday [Smile]

In any case, here is the link to the Italian super8 forum, the first three topics deal about the past S8FF (sorry, they're in Italian):

http://freeforumzone.leonardo.it/a/55211/FORUM/cartella.aspx

At the moment there is no plan for the next one, I hope in 2014

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on October 24, 2013, 03:31 PM:

Great, Fabrizio. [Smile]

I will read the forum you mentionned later as I am going to sleep in a few minutes to take the train to London tomorrow morning. See you at BFCC, I hope. You will probably recongnize me from my picture [Wink]

Posted by Graham Ritchie (Member # 559) on October 24, 2013, 06:21 PM:

I would really like to go to...but I need a "generous financial benefactor"...is their anyone out there? [Wink]

Remember its not all about dealers and finding the latest bargain etc...its more about having fun and the chance to meet up with other like minded, obsessed film nuts. [Big Grin]

Posted by Martin Jones (Member # 1163) on October 25, 2013, 08:22 AM:

Not going to make it...... [Mad]

Sorry, Gentlemen (and Ladies)

Martin

Posted by Adrian Winchester (Member # 248) on October 25, 2013, 09:26 AM:

Although I agree with Terry that Ealing Town Hall had a certain charm, I also recall the cinema used on one or two occasions that seemed to involve finding a way down to the basement and then heading down long corridors before - with luck - you eventually found the room in question. It wouldn't surprise me if one or two collectors are still wandering around down there!

Posted by Osi Osgood (Member # 424) on October 25, 2013, 01:05 PM:

HAH! Funny! [Smile]

Posted by Barry Attwood (Member # 100) on October 26, 2013, 12:30 AM:

I think a little perspective should reign here, Keith has found a fine venue, it's in his Ealing area, and more importantly It's in his price range, remember he has to pay money up front before anyone walks through the door, I think he's bloody amazing to carry on with it. He didn't want to leave Ealing Town Hall, but when they virtually doubled the price in one go, what could he do.

I would rather have one BFCC in a school than no more BFCC's at all, after all it's the people and films you go and see, not what the venue (unless it's a poor one, which this isn't) is like.

Posted by Mark Mander (Member # 340) on October 26, 2013, 01:30 AM:

Well said Barry!! Mark.

Posted by Terry Sills (Member # 3309) on October 26, 2013, 04:44 AM:

Hey Barry/Mark!. - I was not decrying Keith in any way. Great guy and does a terrific job and I have nothing but praise for him. As I previously mentioned, it was the not the fault of Keith, but the greedy council, that he lost the venue. All I was saying is that the Ealing town Hall was a great and deserving venue with wonderful atmosphere and that I preferred it to St. Benedicts. That's all! Wow

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on October 27, 2013, 06:49 AM:

Fabrizio, I've just watched the video from your link. Interesting to see Ugo Tognazzi's children invited to talk about their father using super 8 !

Posted by Mark Williams (Member # 794) on October 27, 2013, 07:12 AM:

Very well said Barry [Smile]

this new venue is excellent and far superior in many ways to Ealing so I'm afraid anyone who thinks otherwise is missing out BIG time.

The atmosphere is still there too and what other one day Convention has attendees from Italy,USA,Greece and Norway just for the day!!

Enough said 😄😄

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on October 27, 2013, 07:29 AM:

You can add Portugal, France and Belgium ;-)

Posted by Adrian Winchester (Member # 248) on October 27, 2013, 07:35 AM:

It's nice for a film convention to be in a venue with arts connections and that has applied to various previous London venues. E.g. the Watermans Centre could list the event in the midst of their programme of films and theatre. At Conway Hall in Holborn it was nice at the end of day to head straight to a West End pub for a drink with fellow collectors. When I attended my first BFCC at Holborn Library, it seemed very fitting to walk past the premises of Mountain Films on my way there.

But having said that, the current venue offers practically everything that could reasonably be hoped for: a very good 'cinema' and a spacious dealers room, bring and buy and cafe facilities all close together on the ground floor, and free parking adjacent. So as long as it remains affordable, lets hope can enjoy more BFCCs there in future.

Posted by Vidar Olavesen (Member # 3354) on October 27, 2013, 08:58 AM:

Posted some pictures on facebook, if anyone should want to check it out.

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=oa.238652662958479&type=1

Will post some here later, need to find some good pictures and resize them

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on October 27, 2013, 09:03 AM:

Thanks ! Your pictures are better that the ones I took with a mobile phone.

Posted by Mark Williams (Member # 794) on October 27, 2013, 11:58 AM:

Apologies for Leaving the other countries out Dom 😄😄

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on October 27, 2013, 12:04 PM:

Don't worry, Mark. Britain's contribution to the hobby (and the British wonderful breakfast) forgives everything.

Posted by Mark Williams (Member # 794) on October 27, 2013, 02:47 PM:

Cheers Dom [Smile]

The best breakfast in the world lol!! [Smile]

Posted by Fabrizio Mosca (Member # 142) on October 27, 2013, 04:46 PM:

Yes Dominique, it was an interesting talk the one with Maria Sole Tognazzi (unfortunately Gianmarco Tognazzi had to leave early to go to a set in Sicily).
BTW, Maurizio Di Cintio, member of this forum, was the "man chair" (as was appointed umorously by some during the day) of all the conventions we had.

Posted by Graham Ritchie (Member # 559) on October 28, 2013, 01:10 AM:

Thanks Vidar

Photos look good...spotted a Bolex SM8, plus plenty of Super8 film [Smile]

Posted by Mal Brake (Member # 14) on October 31, 2013, 12:13 PM:

John Clancy has updated www.bfcc.biz with two pages devoted to the 62nd event last Saturday. Click on past events to see them and a ten minute video.

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on October 31, 2013, 01:24 PM:

There is still hopr for next year ! Here is their message : "63rd BFCC
WE HAVENT DECIDED ON A 2014 EVENT YET SO PLEASE KEEP WATCHING THIS SPACE " I will keep my fingers crossed and my remaining pounds in an enveloppe.

Posted by Paul Adsett (Member # 25) on October 31, 2013, 05:08 PM:

Fabulous pics and superb video by John and Suzie. That 24 ft screen is HUGE! Hard to believe that John's HTI GS1200 can do such a great job showing 8mm that large. The displays of film posters and lobby cards look great, and the whole place looks like it was a hive of film collecting activity.
Great to see that photo of the always congenial John Bird. I hope I look as good as him at 90!
Here's hoping the fabulous BFCC will roll on for many more years.

Posted by Mal Brake (Member # 14) on October 31, 2013, 05:32 PM:

Paul,It's a shame you couldn't come to the BFCC this time.
Talking to Doug Meltzer, he said although you and he live in the USA the only time you met each other was at a BFCC.

Posted by Michael O'Regan (Member # 938) on October 31, 2013, 06:00 PM:

Wonderful photos and it's great to have access to that piece of video.
Once again, I really enjoyed the day. Thanks to Keith and John.

Posted by Lee Mannering (Member # 728) on October 31, 2013, 06:46 PM:

Life after BFCC? Answer YES!
As some will know I stage the East Lancashire FF and can say for what is a fairly small yet enthusitaic event it’s very hard work. We are not 20 years old but in the 50+ bracket which makes it that much harder. Keith and his amazing team stage an extravagant multi media event where you can view many film formats, walk the walk with some interesting dealers many of whom will have interesting stories to tell and this particular event will encompass some extraordinary cinematic events. Even yet I can remember Keith’s gala premier super 8 screening of Star Wars with no Less than Dave Prowse present, top that anyone! The BFCC has become synonymous with top end film presentation and the best of 8mm. So many of you in the UK will remember Derek and Keith standing side by side bantering but at the end of it all 8mm film was at the heart and what a great love they have for it. Derek may be gone but we have a great enthusiast for 8 in Keith who has taken many hours putting together some amazing DVD material for us all to enjoy about our hobby. The BFCC will never die, it may change but the enthusiasm Keith and his team of enthusiasts follow
is legendary. Enthusiasts like myself and others who put on film events pale into significance under the screens bright light led by keith and speaking for myself he has absolute respect. The BFCC will continue as I know he and others love this medium so much you will not hold back its momentum whatever age you are. The BFCC is beyond film it is ultimate film and if I may say bloody well done one and all.......

Posted by Paul Adsett (Member # 25) on October 31, 2013, 08:56 PM:

Hi Mal,
I would have loved to have been at the BFCC, but unfortunately circumstances made it impossible this year. Judging by John's photos and video it must have been excellent.
Yes, Doug and I met for the first, and so far only, time at the 2003 BFCC. I am hoping to make it to his next CineSea convention in April if all goes well.
Incidentally Mal, we were watching the new Upstairs Downstairs TV series the other night when all of a sudden it showed an extended scene filmed at Penarth beach and the pier and promenade, where I grew up. I almost fell out of my chair! [Smile]

Posted by Yanis Tzortzis (Member # 434) on November 02, 2013, 07:18 AM:

....so to conclude,my understanding is,it may or may not be ''the last BFCC as we know it''but even if it is,there might be something else organised to replace it,which is obviously good news...the only thing I can add is my hope that that something new will take place in the spring-not good having BFCC & Blackpool within 20 days from each other & then no major event for 11 months...

Posted by Graham Ritchie (Member # 559) on November 02, 2013, 01:00 PM:

Excellent photos on the "BFCC" web-site plus a 10 minute you-tube video....really good [Cool]

With the video in particular, its great to see the projectors running and what's involved and "all the hard work" in putting up the 24ft screen.

It a pity I will never make it to any of those conventions but a huge thanks for recording it, in both photo and video.

Graham. [Smile]

Posted by Antonis Galanakis (Member # 1455) on November 02, 2013, 02:54 PM:

I believe that BFCC and Blackpull should have a space of 6 months in between. That would be better for dealers and admirers – customers, especially for the foreign ones like us from Greece.

Posted by Yanis Tzortzis (Member # 434) on November 03, 2013, 07:17 AM:

....have been saying this since last year Antonh; let's hope we'll be heard....

Posted by Lee Mannering (Member # 728) on November 04, 2013, 05:07 AM:

It is tricky coming up with dates and we will never please everyone although we do try. My own next film fair will be in April but it has been tricky to fix the date as so many film related events are already going on then I have to agree it with the venue as well. Some of the dealers asked me to put on another event a little later in the year WHAT! To which I replied support Blackpool and I think this may have helped with bookings. I tend to look at the positive side of things re cine events as we are extremely lucky to have so much going on in our vibrant hobby of film collecting, a number of magazines and not to forget film making either. Blackpool dealer wise is pretty much sold out which demonstrates great interest in the event and its excellent rather lavish new venue so expect a good day if you come to buy.

Posted by David Guest (Member # 2791) on November 04, 2013, 06:42 AM:

re bfcc and blackpool re 6 months apart blackpool has always been in novemeber and will continue in November for many many many years to come

Posted by Yanis Tzortzis (Member # 434) on November 04, 2013, 06:55 PM:

....it was not only November though-there was a time when DERANN had two events in Blackpool,wasn't it-one March, one November? Plus, in more recent years, when they dropped the March one, there was another initiative that month-just for a couple of times if memory helps? So it wasn't always an exclusively November event...

Posted by Gary Brocklehurst (Member # 606) on November 05, 2013, 03:50 AM:

Hello Yanis!

How are you? Regarding single day March events over the years. Derann organised a few at Blackpool, these being replaced by a couple in Birmingham at the Strathallan Hotel

There is a chance that my wife and I will see you at Blackpool, although we can not commit 100% at present

Kindest Regards Always

Gary

Posted by Maurice Leakey (Member # 916) on November 05, 2013, 04:29 AM:

I remember Derann at Birmingham, much smaller and much more friendly, and also much closer to me in Bristol.

Posted by Barry Attwood (Member # 100) on November 06, 2013, 05:31 AM:

I really don't know what all the fuss is about, apart from the dedicated few who go to both Ealing and Blackpool, many who attend both will never likely go to the other event. It doesn't really matter that there is only 3 weeks or so in between, the fact that 2 events are scheduled and held should be the most important thing. I attended both for well over 20 years, and I could count easily how many ventured to both (not many at all). It may be more of a problem for the overseas visitors than those who live here, but I'm afraid that will never change, as these 2 dates seem to be the only viable proposition for both organisers, and we should applaud both for still giving this hobby the time and commitment they do.

Posted by David Guest (Member # 2791) on November 06, 2013, 05:53 AM:

this is a list of dealers booked in at my northwest film I cannot be held resposable if they don't turn up
DEALERS HERE TODAY
Classic Home Cinema. Super 8 / 16mm Film +Accessories.
Dave Guest. 16mm Film & Projectors + Accessories.
Paul Wooding. 9.5mm / 16mm Film.
Tony Hutchinson. 16mm Film.
Laurie Ringrow. 16mm Film.
Keith Cockayne. 9.5mm / 16mm.
Brian Lancaster. Used Equipment
Tony’s Classic D V D’s.
David Eaves. Memorabilia.
Peter Churchill 16mm Film.
Ashley Swaine 16mm Film.
D Mcloughin 16mm Film + Projectors.
Paul Mellor. 16mm/35mm Film & Projectors.
Kevin Ashton. 16mm Films.
Glynn Jones. S8 Projectors/Films +16mm Films.
J & A McGovern 16mm Films.
Lee Mannering. Super 8, Standard 8, 9.5mm, 16mm and 35mm
Jennifer Cadger. Projectors & Cine Cameras.
C Douglas S8 & 16mm Film.
Dennis Parkinson. E F S.
A Alexander. S8/16mm Reconditioned Projectors.

SUBJECT TO ALTERATION

[ November 11, 2013, 09:26 AM: Message edited by: David Guest ]

Posted by Yanis Tzortzis (Member # 434) on November 07, 2013, 05:54 AM:

...4 reasons I can fond for the remaining conventions to be held in some time distance from each other:
--BFCC's on a Saturday in London, where all roads lead to; Blackpool's on a Sunday in a less convenient space/time occasion,
so hard to travel on the day as in BFCC-accommodation needed...
--in conjunction to the above-finances: having spent what they have spent in BFCC, how many will travel to Blackpool & spend again in 3 weeks?
--foreign visitors: London being more convenient to fly to than Blackpool, how many will travel to the UK again in 3 weeks?
--finally, it's good, methinks, to have a comfort of 'time management' re; conventions. Once upon a time, when there were 4-5 such majors events, it was different as there was choice;now it's 'either-or', so I personally find it a bit strange not to have anything for 11 long months & then everything in 20 days...

...this is just an idea for the conventions' organizers to perhaps discuss? NOT an imperative on what SHOULD happen; after all, at the end of the day it's collectors that will decide on attendance. But wouldn't it be better if that attendance was made easier?

Posted by David Guest (Member # 2791) on November 08, 2013, 04:08 PM:

you can fly to blackpool you can fly to Liverpool then 40 mins on the train to blackpool you can fly to Manchester the less than an hour on the train .make a weekend in blackpool theres plenty to see including the worlds famous blackpool tower and forgetting the winter gardens

Posted by Robert Crewdson (Member # 3790) on November 08, 2013, 04:47 PM:

Yanis makes a good point, the conventions are too close together. UK, residents might have spent up, and holding another convention a few weeks later means that some who might want to attend can not. For overseas visitors it's an impossibility. I haven't attended any convention so I am not affected. I gather that you hold the Northern Convention traditionally in November, so maybe the BFCC could choose another date rather than October. Spring would probably be a good time as most people wouldn't be going away on their holidays then. Just a suggestion.

Posted by David Guest (Member # 2791) on November 08, 2013, 06:37 PM:

I could never change the month at blackpool as this business I am in keeps me busy every weekend from easter to 2nd week on November that is why it has to be in November ,bfcc changing to the spring would be a good move then it would make both conventions as good as each other

Posted by Yanis Tzortzis (Member # 434) on November 10, 2013, 06:43 AM:

...an airport near to Blackpool isn't just as simple as that-how often there are flights to & from, how expensive they are, plus the short time from BFCC... it'd be a weekend anyway as it's not a one day event really.

Posted by Yanis Tzortzis (Member # 434) on November 10, 2013, 10:04 AM:

....just thought I'd add that I kind of agree with Robert-BFCC had better be a spring event;but again,as he suggests,we can't but ask Keith & John to consider this-not to make a commitment....

Posted by Graham Sinden (Member # 431) on November 10, 2013, 03:48 PM:

John Clancy has already stated that he cant do a spring BFCC anymore due to work commitments. So the event will have to stay in the autumn. I think we should just be glad that the BFCC is still going regardless of when it is.

Graham S

Posted by David Guest (Member # 2791) on November 10, 2013, 03:52 PM:

what about august

Posted by Graham Sinden (Member # 431) on November 10, 2013, 04:01 PM:

Not many conventions happen in August mabye because more people are on holiday. It might be a risk to move it from October, but im sure many people would still turn out.

Graham S

Posted by Michael O'Regan (Member # 938) on November 10, 2013, 04:57 PM:

Why do we need to move the BFCC? We should consider ourselves lucky if it continues at all.

Posted by John Clancy (Member # 49) on November 11, 2013, 03:39 AM:

Okay, I don't post here any longer as a rule but I had been made aware that people were passing their opinions on this. The BFCC for years was in Spring and Winter but there are not enough of us collectors left for two per annum these days. For that Ruislip convention a few years ago we held it in Spring and it caused me significant losses so we could not do it again. Keith has agreed to hold it in October when I still lose out financially but a bit less than in Spring.

Please stop passing your opinions on when we hold the BFCC because you're just making me want to give up. I do this simply out of my own appreciation of the hobby and to try to help things tick along. If you can't make the BFCC in October then that's a shame. The new film fair in Blackpool David is running happens to be in November and that's fine but even David would not claim it is on the same scale as the BFCC, although I know from Robert Nichols there are improvements in the pipeline for this year. Please try to support it because if we give up on the BFCC (mainly because I can't afford to keep pumping time and money into it) that's all you'll have left.

I doubt I'll be checking in here again any time soon but a PM will still get me and I do still post on the new forum so you can communicate with me there.

Posted by Paul Adsett (Member # 25) on November 11, 2013, 09:28 AM:

Well if John is losing money on the BFCC then the admission price should be raised to help cover his, and Keith's, expenses.
I don't think anyone expects them to lose money hosting this convention. A 15 or 20 pound admission fee is not unreasonable for a day's fun. I spend more than that on a couple of hamburger's at Disney World!

Posted by David Guest (Member # 2791) on November 11, 2013, 09:47 AM:

re conventions. these 2 film conventions blackpool and ealing are over 200 mile apart ,and most people who attend blackpool don't go to ealinge and vice a versa ,I remember when deran run 2 film fairs in blackpool then stopped the march one and started one in Birmingham I had a stall several times there ,Derek Simmonds told me it would attract the london gang because it was nearer than them going to blackpool I don't recall seeing many ,I don't know many people from London but I have good ears and its not hard to know when a guy is at side of you talking with there cotney accent I wil make a note this year how many have travlled the 200 plus miles

Posted by Maurice Leakey (Member # 916) on November 11, 2013, 10:08 AM:

I am in complete agreement with Paul, nobody can expect the organisers of any event to lose money.

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on November 11, 2013, 11:46 AM:

The entrance fee was 7 pounds. Perhaps with a 10 (or 12) pounds fee it could be viable ?

Posted by David Guest (Member # 2791) on November 11, 2013, 11:52 AM:

the answer to the previous post use it or lose it ,its no use everybody having there opinions and the bunch of nit pickers who have plenty to say but never go .these films convenyions which are organised by ealing ,Accrington and blackpool are for your benefit so fill up the car with petrol or book a train or book a plane. if your funds are low you can always sell something on the bring and buy that could go towards getting there

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on November 11, 2013, 12:02 PM:

To which "previous post" is yours answering, David ?

Posted by David Guest (Member # 2791) on November 11, 2013, 12:04 PM:

organisers losing money

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on November 11, 2013, 12:07 PM:

Do you think, as an organisator that the increase of the entrance fee could be a solution ?

Posted by David Guest (Member # 2791) on November 11, 2013, 12:11 PM:

no if I could get enough dealers and enough customers to spend with the dealers as its a great expense for them. I would do free admission at my film fair ,but every year less people are attending inc dealers so you must support these film fair as in years to come there will be none

Posted by Christian Bjorgen (Member # 1780) on November 11, 2013, 01:57 PM:

For me, having to pay £150-200 in mere travel expenses to attend either convention, it's not going to bother me if it's 7, 12 or 20 pounds to come inside and enjoy it. Most people should be fully able to pay i.e. £15, which would more than double the income from fees if everyone still attended.

And to be honest, it's all in the hands of the collectors now.

I have many times thought of doing a convention in Norway/Scandinavia, but most times I end up with the same result: lack of enthusiam from collectors. Not pointing fingers here, but there was a lot of "good reasons" floating around for not doing it. I get John here, we should be glad that we have the BFCC and stop arguing about it's date, venue or whatever. If this goes on, we'll have no conventions left in a few years, and it'll be over.

Posted by David Guest (Member # 2791) on November 11, 2013, 02:00 PM:

looking forward to seeing you then at blackpool christian

Posted by Christian Bjorgen (Member # 1780) on November 11, 2013, 02:09 PM:

I certainly hope so! Had to cancel BFCC at the last minute, so trying my best to make it a two-day trip for Blackpool.

Posted by Adrian Winchester (Member # 248) on November 11, 2013, 09:04 PM:

I'm sure our friends who come from overseas and collectors in the USA who travel long distances to attend conventions must be surprised that some in the UK are put off by a journey within the UK that may (e.g) take 3 or 4 hours. Going to the capital city or a popular seaside resort (and many of the major attractions are still open in November) can add to the fun. But some of the people I spoke to at Ealing were from the north, and a good proportion of the Blackpoool dinner bookings I've received are from people from London, the south coast, Northern Ireland, Scotland, etc. For us it's a short holiday with a film convention being the major attraction, and no one thinks that travelling a few hours to go on holiday is a problem.

I appreciate that overseas visitors won't want to come twice in 3 weeks, so they have to make their choice and perhaps could alternate between the two. But I doubt if many UK collectors have spent so much at Ealing that they can't face another trip - it's not like the old days when it was easy to spend a fortune on new releases. If you're a Super 8 collector, unless you're buying new material from CHC, it must difficult to spend a great deal because a large majority of the films on sale nowadays seem to be from before the 1980s revival, so most of us have had plenty of time to find anything from earlier years that we want.

Posted by Lee Mannering (Member # 728) on November 12, 2013, 03:39 AM:

Of course one of the greatest attributes of any hobby and for some of us a part of every day life is the camaraderie to be found and these film events wherever they take place, either in a garage sale or a lavish hotel do give us a great opportunity to meet other enthusiasts and wax lyrical.Keep up the good work those who organise movie events..

Posted by Robert Crewdson (Member # 3790) on November 12, 2013, 04:12 AM:

Adrian, there are still plenty of remote places in England, I have been to places where there were only 2 buses a day and no railway service, due to the Beeching axe in the 60s. If you lived in the wilds of Cumbria or Northumbria, a trip to Ealing would be out of the question.

Posted by Christian Bjorgen (Member # 1780) on November 12, 2013, 06:02 AM:

Indeed, Adrian, that was the deal when I tried aswell. Lots of overseas who wants to come, especially from the UK, but of the 30-odd collectors I know locally, everyone had excuses. And to be honest, you can't base such an arrangement on people attending from abroad, because you never know if they can make it, afford it etc. considering it's a 2-day trip at the least.

For me, I don't care where the collectors come from, as long as they come and have a good time, making the arrangement worthwhile. And not to make excuses, but for me the economic aspect has been an issue for previous conventions in the UK. As you may know, I am a student working part-time, and I have two mortgages, so spending 300+ pounds (about 1/3 my salary) on a single weekend to London is risky.

Posted by Yanis Tzortzis (Member # 434) on November 12, 2013, 08:54 AM:

...well, the organisers have spoken-there's no point going on with the argument. Either one can see the points I made or not,it's EITHER-OR, which is still better than NONE at all;from now on,it's up to the collectors to choose which to attend & which not. I'll try my best to attend both for as long as I can,though still think it's unfortunate....

Posted by Adrian Winchester (Member # 248) on November 12, 2013, 11:37 AM:

Indeed, two major conventions close together is a much better 'problem' than no conventions at all. Perhaps we could consider something else in Europe in terms of boosting the opportunities earlier in the year. Does anyone know if that big fair that used to happen in France is still happening and if so where and when? With members that show an admirable willingness to travel, perhaps we should start a list here that has all the major events worldwide.

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on November 12, 2013, 03:11 PM:

You may be refering to "Les Cinglés du Cinéma" ("cinglé" means crazy) in Argenteuil (about 15 minutes in train from the center of Paris). Although there are less sellers and visitors than it used to be, it is still there. At the moment, it is set in September but there are discussions to see if it will not be set back in January as it was before. There are three rooms but one is now dedicated to paper (magazines, posters...). There are some projections in a small room but what is nice to see is that several sellers projects also in the two "selling rooms" where films and material are sold. The convention is held during three days. The first (a Friday) is a "sellers day", so there is an 15 euros entrance fee for non sellers, but the two following days are free. There is new organisator, so things may change. You can see pictures of this convention in another thread. Another thing to add is that you can also find films and materials in Paris (for example at the shop "La bande des cinés", the name of the shop plays with the prononciation between des cinés and dessinée, la bande des cinés means the group of ciné(ma)s and la bande dessinée means the comic strip ; at the beginning the shop sold comic strips, then they opened a second shop with films and material). And of course, Paris worths (more than) a visit. I was told about another interesting convention in Roubaix, which is located in North France (interesting for our British members, maybe). I haven't been there but several French people told me it is growing.

Posted by Robert Crewdson (Member # 3790) on November 13, 2013, 06:06 AM:

[ November 13, 2013, 01:55 PM: Message edited by: Robert Crewdson ]

Posted by Lee Mannering (Member # 728) on November 13, 2013, 07:10 AM:

The openness is one of the things I have always liked about this particular forum and it is sad to hear of others where some do delight in grilling someone which does little to forward the ‘we love film’ movement or perpetuate it. I would love to see the day when those who take part in such grilling comments use time to more useful purpose such as helping others instead of bashing out internut text particularly behind closed doors. I don’t think members are argumentative and we need to remember this forum spans the world with different cultures and languages which sometimes get forgotten. To quote some Lancashire dialect ‘Yon mon con whisper o’er three fields’ [Smile]

On the positive side and a film event organiser myself I learn from the views of others as it is an important way for me anyway to improve my own annual movie event and we would be daft not to listen carefully to any input from visitors be it good or bad.

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on November 13, 2013, 07:23 AM:

Lee, is that you ? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dfyQJ_G_AE0

Posted by Lee Mannering (Member # 728) on November 13, 2013, 07:24 AM:

Minus a Eumig [Cool]

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on November 13, 2013, 07:25 AM:

[Smile]

Posted by Robert Crewdson (Member # 3790) on November 13, 2013, 09:17 AM:

As in any group discussion you will always get differences of opinion, it would be a boring world if we were all identical. Even if our views have been taken on board it doesn't mean that it's possible to change things; the matter might be out of our hands, but it's good to listen to the other persons view.

I haven't read all the comments from the beginning on either forum, so I don't know who these people are taking a delight in all this. The only thing I am aware of happening behind closed doors was John's posting. Not exactly closed as this Forum is open to anyone, and the messages can be read without being a member, though not as well attended as this forum. Many of the people on the other forum are also members here, and as far as I know they have shared their knowledge like the rest of us, putting their time to good use.

My previous post has been deleted. John kindly wrote an explanation, there was more going on than I was aware of.
Nothing further is to be gained by prolonging this thread.

[ November 13, 2013, 02:02 PM: Message edited by: Robert Crewdson ]

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