8mm Forum: Eumig 860 PMA

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Posted by Ethem Pekin (Member # 932) on November 26, 2007, 11:39 AM:

Dear 8mm forum members,

can someone comment on the following camera?
I am planning to buy this for 25€ including a macro-set.

as a beginner in super8, i will apreciate your comments.

Eumig 860 PMA

Year: 1976-78

Weight: 1450 g

Lens: Makro-Viennon 1,8 / 8 - 48 mm

Macro focusing

Split Image Focusing

Auto / Manual Zoom with 2 Speeds

Frame rates: 9, 18, 24, 45 + single frame

Shutter degree: 190

Manual / Auto Exposure

Backlight Control

+/- correction for auto exposure

Time exposure

Flash contact

Fades

Remote control socket

Interval timer with 1/4 - 60 second intervals

No sound

Made in Austria

PMA wide angle lens attachment.

http://super8wiki.com/index.php/Eumig_860_PMA

Posted by Andy Oliver (Member # 604) on November 26, 2007, 01:25 PM:

Hi, i've seen results many years back with the said camera, and they were great. That said, the camera will not read kodaks 64t in auto mode, so you will have to use manual exposure. I'm not sure if the camera can read 100d or the kodaks black and white stock. If you plan to shoot the cinevia ( fuji 50 ) then the camera will be fine, just set the 85 filter to indoor lighting. I understand that quality control was not good on later eumig/bolex super 8 cameras, so best to check the camera is in full working order. It would be a great starter camera to learn with, especially at that price, also you have that 4mm wide angle thrown in too, oohhhh check the batt compartment hasn't leaked.

Posted by Mike Peckham (Member # 16) on November 26, 2007, 02:06 PM:

Hi Ethem

If it's any help, I have a scan of the "Movie Maker Magazine" Test report of the Eumig 880 PMA, not sure how similar the two cameras were but it might be useful. Let me know if you want it, I'll email it to you if you do.

Mike

Posted by Ethem Pekin (Member # 932) on November 27, 2007, 05:41 AM:

Dear Mike,

I am very interested about the document you have mentioned in response to my question concerning Eumig 860 PMA.
Can you kindly forward it to my personal email address: pekinethem at gmail dot com

Dear Andy,

Thanks also for your comment. I will make sure that the camera is fully operational before buying. With this camera I really would like to practice shooting. Based on your experiences is it easy for an amateur to work with manual exposure? Where can I contact to learn more about this subject?

Thanks,

Thanks,

Posted by Kevin Faulkner (Member # 6) on November 27, 2007, 06:22 AM:

Ethem, I have editied your email address in the post above. Some spammers have software for scanning forum for email addresses so it's not a good idea to publish your email address in the normal manner. Put it like I have above, others will know what to do to email you.

Kev.

Posted by Mike Peckham (Member # 16) on November 27, 2007, 12:07 PM:

Hello Ethem

I've sent the scans off to you, could you confirm they have landed safely!

Mike

Posted by Ethem Pekin (Member # 932) on November 27, 2007, 04:01 PM:

Kevin, thanks for your method. I will apply this when sharing an email address in the forums.

Mike, I have recieved all of the 5 pages. I will read it tomorrow! I am amazed to see how useful this forum is.

By the way, I read in one website that new Kodak films can work with such cameras. Does anyone had similar trials with their cameras?

Posted by Andy Oliver (Member # 604) on November 27, 2007, 06:08 PM:

Hi, regarding the camera, i'm not sure how the manual exposure works, on some cameras it can be a real pain, ie very fiddly. Supposing you wish to shoot the kodaks 64t stock, once the auto exposure has given you a reading of say f8, you will have to lock the exposure, then manually adjust the exposure to say somewhere between f8/fll, adding around 2/3 (two thirds) of a stop on whatever the auto exposure indicates. If your planning to film, say newsreel type events, or even say a wedding, where your not given much time to think, i suppose you really need a camera with auto exposure that can read all film speeds, these are harder to find, and of course commanding higher prices. You'll learn a lot quicker with a camera that you have to work at, and adjust the exposure, i'm not sure whether your after the grainy home movie look, kodaks 64t is a bit on the grainy side, it actually looks retro, if you want the best possible super 8 images then the fuji 50 cinevia is the best stock out there, plus your camera will expose the stock ok.
Good luck

Posted by Knut Nordahl (Member # 518) on November 28, 2007, 02:30 AM:

Hi Ethem

The 860/880 or similar bolex or revue cameras are good cameras.
As mentioned be sure to check the battery compartment for leakage. If there is some clean it out with a mix of baking soda and water. Hold the camera with the handle down. Of course.

These cameras have a feature that very few cameras have. They have an Auto B function or Time Exposure function. This means you can film (still) objects in very dark places as the camera will hold the shutter open for as long as it takes to expose each frame enough.

The camera is originally a 40/160 camera. It was intended for kodachrome 40, not E64t as tons of other cameras are.
The question is “what will this camera expose E64t like” as many other 40/160 cameras can use E64t, and the results are ok.

I’ll see if I be able to do a test later today.

The manual exposure is a rocking-switch. This solution is not the best, but works.
Also check out I dismantled this beast. You’ll find that in the wiki

EDIT:
Testing with different cartrindges shows that E64t should work.

[ November 28, 2007, 02:25 PM: Message edited by: Knut Nordahl ]

Posted by Ethem Pekin (Member # 932) on November 28, 2007, 04:20 PM:

Hello Knut,

Many thanks for your comments and the test!
Today I have printed the analysis of this camera from the "Movie Maker Magazine" that Mike has provided but I did not have time to read it.
But with your remarks I feel much confident with my choice.
On Friday, I will see the camera in Leuven and I will take a close look at its condition to finalise my decision.

I will inform the topic whether I get it and my experiences in the future.

Posted by Knut Nordahl (Member # 518) on November 29, 2007, 01:29 AM:

Ethem,

Check out this thread over at filmshootig.com

http://filmshooting.com/scripts/forum/viewtopic.php?t=18245&sid=a6bf91b62d9acc46774170ce42888970

Posted by Ethem Pekin (Member # 932) on November 30, 2007, 04:08 PM:

This evening I have met the person and saw that Eumig 860 PMA was in great condition. So I have returned home with a big bag, the camera, macro set and few more items for my projectors....

The only practical problem I have is with the users guide, it is only in French, which I am only a beginner.

I already googled but did not find the guide in English.
I will be glad if anyone can scan it for me?

I wikk order super8 films to shoot during the Christmas period.

Posted by Knut Nordahl (Member # 518) on December 01, 2007, 12:14 PM:

I have the manual here i english. mail me your address and I'll send it to you snailmail if you promise to make a e-version of it.

Send me a cartridge of film as well and I'll send you a PMA widescreen attachment lens that goes with these cameras. It's the clip on type in case you were wondering.

I have one lying around in a plastic case that I do not use.

Posted by Ethem Pekin (Member # 932) on December 01, 2007, 05:02 PM:

Knut,

PM is sent.

Posted by Ethem Pekin (Member # 932) on December 06, 2007, 04:56 PM:

here comes a link with an original film which was shot by my camera from the person who I bought the camera:

the seven wonders of Leuven

http://getir.net/bz1

Posted by Alessandro Machi (Member # 461) on December 11, 2007, 03:35 AM:

Hi Ethem. The Eumig 860 PMA is probably the most complex super-8 camera ever made. Hopefully you are an experimenting type and will realize that.

Two words of caution. These cameras seem to run "dry" very often and need a technician expert on relubricating them. If your camera makes squealing sounds either when zooming the camera, when the f-stop exposure servo engages, or when the camera is actually running, you may want to reconsider not running it much more and seeing if you can get it serviced.

The second thing is there is an automatic fade out slider switch on these cameras. In what was probably a secretly acknowledged mistake, if you fade while in automatic exposure mode using this slider switch, the camera shuts off and will not turn back on until the slider switch is moved back. I know this was a huge mistake because in the next version, (the 881), the slider was changed to spring activation so that it automatically went back to it's original position.

The camera offers so many varities of filming opportunities that how it handles shooting in automatic exposure mode is not really that big of a deal. The exposure dial has three positions, regular auto-exposure, auto-over-exposure of one f-stop, and manual exposure. It is relatively easy to switch from automatic exposure to manual and just shift the exposure 2/3's of one f-stop. If you don't have a filter key for the top of the camera you can use an American Quarter, when you slip the quarter or filter key in, it removes the 85 filter.

I hope that helps.

Posted by Ethem Pekin (Member # 932) on February 17, 2008, 05:49 AM:

Dear Alessandro,

Based on your remarks my Eumig needs to be lubricated but with my budget I want to do it my self.
Do you know what kind of oil is necessary?
Any tips and recommendations from 8mm Forum will be appreciated.

Posted by Alessandro Machi (Member # 461) on February 17, 2008, 01:29 PM:

There is an extensive discussion about this on one of the super-8 forums. However, once the camera is taken apart, there are so many dials and levers that suddenly look nameless it is really difficult to actually reassemble the camera and keep every knob and dial working as it was before taking it apart.

Too bad the cameras are so cheap to buy because virtually everyone gets into a mind set that they would never spend more to repair a camera than they spent to buy it, and in this situation that is actually an erroneous conclusion to arrive at.

Posted by Ethem Pekin (Member # 932) on February 18, 2008, 09:13 AM:

You are right.
But my option with professional service is to send the camera to Bolex Switzerland and pay almost 300 euros. For a beginner and an amateur this is well beyond my budget.
I already succeeded in dismantling the camera (still seems to work).
As for lubrication I guess I should read the other forums and/or develop my own method.

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