8mm Forum: John Wayne Home Movie

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Posted by Phil Slater (Member # 2388) on April 23, 2011, 03:51 AM:

Hi, I bought a super 8 colour home movie collection recently which contained a 5 minute sequence filmed on the set of CHISUM, the 1970 John Wayne film.

It contains some great shots of the cast and crew on a western set, chatting and posing for photos while waiting for the next take. There is also a shot of a 'take' where a group of cowboys mount their horses and ride off. There are several shots of John Wayne himself. I have fould out that it was filmed in Durango, Mexico in 1969.

My question is, does anyone know the best place to sell such a film? I could try EBAY but there may be organisations who collect this sort of thing for use in documentaries etc. See photo.
Thanks

Posted by Jean-Marc Toussaint (Member # 270) on April 23, 2011, 05:47 AM:

Nice catch and great screenshot.
You could try the JW estate at johnwayne.com
The question is: do you want to make money out of it? Any official cine-related organization won't pay much (providing they are willing to pay...)
Fleebay will be your best bet if you want collectors battling over it.

Posted by Osi Osgood (Member # 424) on April 23, 2011, 10:30 AM:

It would be very interesting to see how much it would go for on ebay. There has been Marylin Monroe footage that has popped up, (I think it was behind the scenes footage from "River of No Return") and that went for hundreds, if I remember correctly.

Anytime new footage turns up that hasn't been seen before causes quite a stir with collectors.

That has to be the best screen capture from Super 8 I have ever seen! It looks like 16MM

Posted by Winbert Hutahaean (Member # 58) on April 23, 2011, 10:44 AM:

Hi Phil, is your film really a typical of "home movie" i.e which can be seen from shaking hand, grainy pictures and "not-really-a professional shooting" or you find it like a professional made for behind the scene.

The reason is because similar to nowadays DVD releases, during the 8mm heyday there are some specially released behind the scene of particular films.

If that is the case, then your reel is not one of a kind.

From my bare eyes, I can see that your film was shot by a 16mm camera and since what you have now is an 8mm format, it means this is typically an official released behind-the-scene, which make it not one of a kind.

Good luck and again Ebay is the best way to sell.

Posted by Phil Slater (Member # 2388) on April 23, 2011, 01:06 PM:

It's on a 400 foot reel with other footage of a holiday or trip around Mexico, which is mainly scenery, towns, mountains, coastline, aztec temples etc. It seems that the family stopped off at the set as part of their trip.

There are several shots of the actors posing for photos with tourists and signing autographs. Definately a home movie and not a professionally shot film, and definately on super 8 (but glad to hear that it looks like 16mm!)

Here's a couple more screen shots.

Posted by Michael O'Regan (Member # 938) on April 23, 2011, 01:29 PM:

That does look like an excellent find.

Does the leader have any writing or other markings?

Posted by Pasquale DAlessio (Member # 2052) on April 23, 2011, 02:10 PM:

That second screen shot looks like Richard Jaekel posing with a fan. What a great find.

Posted by Nathan DeHahn (Member # 2192) on April 23, 2011, 08:07 PM:

The frames do look like it is from 16mm which it is not. Back in Day lot of people use 8mm Kodachrome film to film their home movies. Thats why it is so sharp, it is exactly Kodachrome II film stock. Which it is rated 25 ASA, that makes footages look like from 16mm. [Wink]

Posted by Adrian Winchester (Member # 248) on April 24, 2011, 07:42 AM:

I've seen 8mm behind-the-scenes material that looks less impressive than this turn up on DVDs as an extra or as documentary content, so it might be worth seeing if the distributor of the feature would be interested in it.

"is your film really a typical of "home movie" i.e which can be seen from shaking hand"

It might be typical but my hand held camera home movie shooting is extremely steady!

Posted by Winbert Hutahaean (Member # 58) on April 24, 2011, 07:56 AM:

quote:
It might be typical but my hand held camera home movie shooting is extremely steady!

Adrian, you can say that your hand is steady, but since we are working with 8mm (expensive and only 3 minutes), everything will be shot in very quick and short scene [Wink]

O yes, Phil one other thing that is commonly typical home movies, is the 18 fps instead of 24 fps used for shooting.

Although some cameras have 24 fps shooting feature, but people rarely used it, except they have a lot of money.

The 18 fps resulting picture looks a bit shaky too.

Posted by Gerald Santana (Member # 2362) on April 24, 2011, 08:10 PM:

Hello Folks - There are a few things about the making of this film that could serve of interest to Paramount, who released True Grit in 1969, I'll get to that in a moment. Chisum, as mentioned by Phil was filmed in Durango, Mexico. John Wayne had a ranch there as he and Hollywood set its sights on the location for the exquisite scenery. By then, he was there regularly as an established actor and resident. Obviously, people sought him out during the filming of a movie. Americans regularly traveled to Mexico and through Durango in a chance to see one their favorite actors from the 50's through the 80's.

It was there in Durango that he was told that he was nominated for both a Golden Globe and an Oscar, during the filming of Chisum. Could this be the day of that call? Well, that would have more value than say, day 33 of shooting Chisum. Chisum by the way, isn't really the best of his films in fact, he was very unpleased by several of the directors choices and his stuntman. The film also served as a mouthpiece of propaganda for Richard Nixon's views of justice in the West.

This footage is obviously unique, the film stock superior perhaps, Agafchrome. The (amateur) cinematographer obviously knows how to frame a picture as well, considering this there are different values. First, how much footage is there of John Wayne, the more...the more "value". Second, you mention that the collection also features Aztec Temples, please post some of those, as they also have "value". How much depends on the footage and how much there is. If there are only a "couple of shots" can you estimate the amount of time John Wayne appears on screen?

Personally, I would say this has more sentimental value than money value. At auction, if there are more than 60 seconds of John Wayne, it could go for around $30 -$60 on ebay with screen shots, trivia, and a low starting bid and a one week auction to attract a buyer. Otherwise, if there are over 60 sec. you should try to contact Paramount Pictures or Turner Classic Movies to see if they would include like to have this footage for either True Grit or Chisum. I doubt that they would pay anyone what they deserve for anything.

Posted by Michael O'Regan (Member # 938) on April 25, 2011, 02:21 AM:

quote:
Personally, I would say this has more sentimental value than money value.

I have to respectfully disagree.
Unfortunately, these days, everything has a money value first and foremost.
An avid collector of John Wayne memorabilia may well pay a lot of money for this.

Posted by Osi Osgood (Member # 424) on April 25, 2011, 02:00 PM:

I agree Micheal ...

Posted by Phil Slater (Member # 2388) on April 25, 2011, 04:43 PM:

Gerald,

Thanks for the extra information about the filming of Chisum.
I've timed the sequence and it runs to 4 minutes 45 seconds at 18fps. John Wayne is on the screen for about 35 seconds, over several different shots.

The rest of the film, according to the label on the can, is of Old Mexico City, Matalazan and Guadalahara. There are lots of street scenes, shots of buidings, markets, churches etc, plus some mountain scenery, coatline and beaches. The Aztec temple sequence is only a couple of minutes and is nothing special, just shots of the temples and people walking up the steps. There is also a sequence of what looks like an old abandoned wild west town. Not sure where this is - one sign on a building said Tombstone, so it might be the one in Arizona or it might be in Mexico.

I have decided to list the film on Ebay, probably during May, but will see what johnwayne.com and Paramount have to say first. Thanks for all the advice guys.

p.s. I've also got some fantastic 16mm home movie footage of New York City in 1958 (judging by what's showing at the cinemas) if anyone is interested in seeing some screen shots.

Posted by Michael O'Regan (Member # 938) on April 25, 2011, 04:49 PM:

I'd love to see those NYC screenshots.

Posted by Phil Slater (Member # 2388) on April 25, 2011, 04:52 PM:

OK, will try to post some this week.

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