8mm Forum: Which projector should I go for?

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Posted by Joel Whybrow (Member # 1377) on November 04, 2013, 10:26 AM:

Ok, so now I've settled on Super 8 as my format of choice, what projector should I go for?

I've had my eye on the GS1200 Xenon but I hear a lot about how unreliable it is, not to mention the price of them.

I definitely want to go with Xenon (or some other bright, cold lamp type) and stereo is a must. Optical audio would be nice but I suppose I can live without it (unless anyone has a reason I should need it?).

Ability to mount a scope lens is also a must and ideally a gate with good masking though I'm not sure if this really changes machine to machine?

What are your suggestions?

Posted by Ernie Zahn (Member # 274) on November 04, 2013, 10:34 AM:

There's a high end Beaulieu that I've heard is great. Maybe someone here has the correct model.

Though the specs you're looking for means that you're going to pay a tidy sum either way.

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on November 04, 2013, 10:43 AM:

Ernie, you may be refering to the Beaulieu 708 el. http://www.filmprojectors.eu/listshow.asp?catid=1&brand=Beaulieu You can also find xenon on some Fumeo projectors http://www.filmprojectors.eu/listshow.asp?catid=1&brand=Fumeo

Posted by Joel Whybrow (Member # 1377) on November 04, 2013, 10:46 AM:

Yeah I'm sure someone was selling a Fumeo on a forum here somewhere but I can't find the link to it now.

I wouldn't mind a pedestal unit, it's really space for the films that bothers me.

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on November 04, 2013, 10:54 AM:

I know that Buckingham Film services had a Fumeo at the BFCC but I don't know if it is a xenon model or not.

Posted by Maurice Leakey (Member # 916) on November 04, 2013, 11:11 AM:

Elmo, Fumeo or Beaulieu? I have all three, but not xenons. Of the three I much prefer my Beaulieu 708 EL CD.
The Beaulieu 708 ST HPL would suit you, with its metal halide HTI lamp 250w 32v (£190+VAT).
But as said before, you're talking big money.
http://www.super8data.com/database/projectors_list/projectors_beaulieu/beaulieu_708_hpl_stereo.htm

Posted by Flavio Stabile (Member # 357) on November 04, 2013, 12:46 PM:

hi Joel,

in my opinion I would stay on an halogen projector, like a standard ELMO GS 1200.

Both the Xenon version of ELMO or HTI version (not Xenon!) of the Beaulieu are really noisy, due to presence of the big fan to maintain low the temperature of the lamp.

Unless you have the possibility to have the projector in an isolated room, consider this as a possible issue!

The Beaulieu has also another issue, in my opinion... if you need to change the standard reels (120 or 180mt) of a film during a projection, you have to shut down the lamp every time! Of course this is not a good practice for a HTI lamp because it reduces its lifetime. This will not happen for the ELMO, where the lamp can be left on.

On the countrary the lamp replacement is a pro for the Beaulieu, because the lamp replacement in a Xenon model (like the ELMO) is not very practical and safe and requires a certain expertise.

I would consider also the cost and how easy to find are the lamps: the original ELMO lamp (Toshiba) is no more available while the OSRAM HTI lamp used in the Beaulieu can be found.

Last, but not least, these two models are not so easy to find and really costly... I spent about five years to buy bought and today I still continue to use more often my halogen version of ELMO. [Wink]

I hope to have added some bit of useful information for your final choice ! [Big Grin]

Flavio

Posted by Osi Osgood (Member # 424) on November 04, 2013, 12:48 PM:

A high end EUMIG is always a great bet. Eumig's are well renown for being extremely delicate with film, which I appreciate, (the less scratches and wear the better, eh?).

I also use high end CHINON's as well, (the 9500 model), however, some CHINON's can be horrible with film. I have had good luck, however.

Posted by Joel Whybrow (Member # 1377) on November 04, 2013, 01:10 PM:

Hmm, quite a bit to consider there.

Maybe a halogen model could be converted to LED? There are some seriously high powered LEDs out there now, has anyone tried that lately?

Availability seems to be a bit of an issue too. Maybe I should just get a mid range model to tide me over until something nice comes up?

Posted by Lee Mannering (Member # 728) on November 04, 2013, 01:14 PM:

Bucks has been carting that Fumeo around for a bit and Tony was telling me how heavy it was to lift around. If you have a young back Joel you should be OK but as a first decent machine might be worth looking at a clean Eumig 938 stereo or if you have more money a GS800 perhaps. A good GS1200 Xenon is an excellent machine but as with all used machines avoid a projector that shows signs of a novice messing with the inner workings.

Posted by Paul Adsett (Member # 25) on November 04, 2013, 02:20 PM:

I second Lee's choice of the Eumig 938, a superb machine, but you need to get a good f1.0 or f1.1 lens for it. The lens that came with the 938, featuring an optical levelling system, is not that great.
If you just have to have the brightest picture, the Elmo GS1200 is hard to beat, particularly if converted to a 2-blade shutter and fitted with the f1.0 lens.
No matter which projector you are looking at, remember that the lens quality is everything in super 8 projection.

Posted by Michael O'Regan (Member # 938) on November 04, 2013, 02:23 PM:

Of course, you don't need to spend big money on the big buck projectors. If you're willing to stick with Halogen, I use a ST-1200 with the 1.0 lens at a 22ft throw and the image is (to me anyway,)excellent.

Posted by Maurice Leakey (Member # 916) on November 04, 2013, 02:25 PM:

A further good choice is the Beaulieu 708 CD Stereo, this has a 150 watt lamp, f1.1 lens and a spool capacity of 2300'. The lamps are quite cheap too!
http://www.super8data.com/database/projectors_list/projectors_beaulieu/beaulieu_708el_cd_stereo.htm

Posted by Joel Whybrow (Member # 1377) on November 04, 2013, 04:32 PM:

I think I may try out the ST 1200 then before I go mad buying a super expensive unit.

I notice you are also in Essex Michael, would it be an imposition to come and see yours in action before I pull the trigger? If you are close enough of course. Also do you know of any regular local events?

Thanks again for all the help guys [Smile]

Posted by Maurice Leakey (Member # 916) on November 05, 2013, 04:26 AM:

Joel
You earlier said that stereo is a must, are you aware that the Elmo ST-1200 is not a stereo projector?

Posted by Mal Brake (Member # 14) on November 05, 2013, 05:21 AM:

Maurice is absolutely correct in saying the ST1200 is a mono only m/c as is the ST1200D.
However the ST1200HD is capable of stereo playback (not recording) by connecting the two 3.5mm jack sockets on the back of the projector to a stereo amplifier.
There is a fairly low level output from these so a decent amp or pre-amp would be needed.

By the way, my apologies to you, Maurice regarding name badges for the BFCC. I realised I left mine back home when I was about to leave my sister-in-law's house in Romford on Saturday morning. [Frown]

Posted by Joel Whybrow (Member # 1377) on November 05, 2013, 05:46 AM:

Ah I see. I assumed most models (especially at the price) were stereo.

It may still do as a starter though if I can get one cheap enough.

Posted by Maurice Leakey (Member # 916) on November 05, 2013, 08:22 AM:

Here's a nice Bauer T600 for €265 on German eBay. I have bought from this seller whom I can recommend.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=111207775208

Posted by Andrew Woodcock (Member # 3260) on December 12, 2013, 05:46 PM:

Just to add my two-pennyworth to Mals statement, I have never been happy with the stereo output from the 1200HD when fed through a professional stereo mixer then Denon high end home cinema amp as the sound level inputs are SO LOW using the two track green monitoring output sockets that when amplified the magnetic tape noise is intolerably loud, it really does manage to completely spoil even the best recorded stereo track on any of my films. You are far better off getting a Eumig 938 or 940 or any other true stereo projector whereby when amplified, the sound if initially good, will be excellent through a decent home cinema amplifier and speaker set up.

Posted by Gary Crawford (Member # 67) on December 13, 2013, 06:48 AM:

I , too , was a bit disappointed in the outputs from the St1200Hd's.... I was running them through a mixer using the mixer's line level jacks. However, just for fun one day, I put them into the mixers mic level inputs. IT WAS PERFECT. The line level from the projector was low enough not to cause distortion of any kind, but really cleaned up the sound...gave it punch, sparkle and plenty of volume headroom. I've been using it this way for about a year now...with no problems. The difference in quality and volume was enormous. In fact, with that hookup, the st122hd's sound as good or better than the GS1200. My mixers are just very small Radio Shack units, powered by a 9 volt battery.

Posted by David Singer (Member # 3953) on December 13, 2013, 05:58 PM:

Gary, is this the Radio Shack mixer you are using?

RadioShack® 4-Channel Stereo Microphone Mixer
Model: 3200029 | Catalog #: 32-029

Thank you

Posted by Andrew Woodcock (Member # 3260) on December 16, 2013, 03:57 AM:

That's a great suggestion Gary, given the very low output from the green 3.5mm sockets! I must try this. A word of warning though, this method should not be used for the yellow output or for that matter the headphone output as these mono outputs are at normal line level and may damage your mixer.

Posted by Gary Crawford (Member # 67) on December 17, 2013, 08:09 AM:

Yes...David..that's not exactly how my mixers look, but close enough. there are two rocker switches on mine. one for off/on and another for stereo /mono. but basically the one you are showing is quite a bit like mine.

Posted by Osi Osgood (Member # 424) on December 17, 2013, 11:56 AM:

On the high end ...

EUMIG (personal choice)
ELMO (some folks swear by them ...)
CHINON (the 9000 level machines, which I enjoy)

Posted by Dimitris Mpakirtzis (Member # 3897) on December 17, 2013, 12:05 PM:

Suggestions...

1. ELMO [ elmo st180 0-M telecine, I love it]

2. EUMIG 824 [PERFECT ]

3. BAUER [good machine but mine was a lemon....I return it back]

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