8mm Forum: DVD/VHS to 8mm

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Posted by Amandeep Singh (Member # 4565) on November 27, 2015, 06:07 AM:

Hello

I was wondering if its possible to convert from DVD or VHS to 8mm so that you can make your own 8mm features. Is this possible? What would be the process to do this?

Thanks

Posted by Steve Klare (Member # 12) on November 27, 2015, 12:47 PM:

There would have to be some kind of 8mm film printer. There used to be a company in Toronto that printed Super-8 from various kinds of digital image files, so they do exist.

-after that it would start to be more standard operations. The processed film would need to be striped and then synced and recorded.

VHS doesn't have the resolution to look good as film. I've seen transferred and/or projected VHS and it's kind of smeary.

Video to film is still being done on 16mm on a private basis (-mostly for providing footage to restore incomplete prints). I've seen optical sound prints made this way and they look and sound really good.

Posted by Mathew James (Member # 4581) on November 27, 2015, 01:09 PM:

This is a good question.
It would be fun to transfer modern digital home movies to 8mm.
I have tons of stuff i would love to play on my super 8....

Posted by Amandeep Singh (Member # 4565) on November 27, 2015, 01:46 PM:

Hi

Thanks for your replies. This sounds complicated for an amature like me. I'm in the UK so I'm not sure of any companies in the UK that can do this.

I was thinking that this might be able to be achieved by buying a 8mm camcorder and then using that to record the DVD being projected onto a wall or something like that. Would this work? How about getting the sound? Are there any 8mm camcorders that have aux inputs?

Thanks

Posted by Steve Klare (Member # 12) on November 27, 2015, 02:07 PM:

Pleeeeease Amandeep! We don't call Super-8 cameras "Camcorders"! [Wink]

-there are Orthodox Film Purists out there this kind of talk might just kill!

It's complicated for a lot of reasons. You would need to alter the cameras' frame rate to avoid getting flicker in the image filmed off the wall. Then again film originated at the altered frame rate wouldn't be right at the 24 FPS you'd want a projector to operate at. It's the kind of thing that's best done a frame at a time.

Then again there hasn't been pre-striped camera stock in decades so you'd have to post-stripe and record the sound separately.

Even before that, the typical consumer Super-8 camera uses the cartridge system which is 2 1/2 minutes of film at 24 FPS, so your transfer would use at least 24 cartridges per hour of screen time. (Which would need to all be spliced at exactly the same frame to avoid jumps in the action and a loss of sound sync.)

Impossible? No. It would certainly be an achievement, though!

Posted by Andrew Woodcock (Member # 3260) on November 27, 2015, 11:44 PM:

Also the striping facility in Europe on polyester stock in particular is almost now, non existing.
The price of silent camera stock is also now, unbelievably expensive.

I'm afraid realistically speaking now, for all intents and purposes due to the sheer amount of obstacles you need overcome, it's sadly a non starter Amandeep.

The professional people out there that continue to use Super 8 camera stock, do so for its image characteristics and unique qualities but they end up being used as a finished article digitally after editing the raw footage more often than not.

Posted by Tom Photiou (Member # 130) on November 28, 2015, 02:08 AM:

Surly the cost would be through the roof. Wouldn't it be easier to to use a dvd projector? [Confused]

Posted by Amandeep Singh (Member # 4565) on November 28, 2015, 10:45 AM:

Hi

Thank you all for your replies. Apologies for using the wrong terminology for things, It's pretty obvious I'm new to all this [Smile]

The fact that most of this is way over my head is enough of a reason for me to not pursue this any further. I think it's going to be more hastle than its worth. I guess that would also explain why full length feature films in 8mm are so expensive.

I already have a projector connected to my Bluray player which is what I use most of the time but even though the picture and sound ar fantastic there is something about traditional film that you just can't let go of it. Maybe its because I'm nostalgic...I love vinyl also!

Is there anywhere in the UK where I can buy full length feature films in 8mm? I am actually looking for old cinema trailers and idents that where use before the movie started e.g. the Odeon First Choice one which would zoom onto a cinema building with the words Odeon on it and then it would say "time for your feature presentation" or perhaps the UCI ones with the comet going round the logo. Where could I find these?

Thanks

Posted by Steve Klare (Member # 12) on November 28, 2015, 11:02 AM:

You are in luck!

You live in a place with a number of respected film sellers: so much that people world-wide deal with them all the time.

Here are two I know well:

Classic Home Cinema

Paul Foster Films and Collectables

There are others, and unfortunately in times past there were many, many more.

Showing a feature on Super-8 is a labor of love. They are divided up into multiple reels so you either do one reel at a time or do what I do and run two projectors for changeovers.

It's a lot more hands-on than using video. It all depends on your own state of mind at the moment whether this is actually better or not.

-Kind of the difference between "showing a movie" and "seeing a movie". Sometimes you want to cook a meal, sometimes you just want to grab some food.

Posted by Steven J Kirk (Member # 1135) on November 28, 2015, 06:11 PM:

Using super 8 to show trailers, cartoons and cinema logos, sometimes called 'day sets' and then the feature on a video projector from a DVD/Blu Ray is a perfectly acceptable way to go. ( Don't let anyone tell you differently!) It gives you the best of both worlds and the 'feel' of real cinema. A lot of shorts and promos and day sets are out there on super 8, both for Odeon and ABC. Have fun splicing up trailer reels of maybe 20mins before the feature...

Posted by John Hourigan (Member # 111) on November 29, 2015, 02:00 PM:

Agree, Steven -- why on earth would anyone think that screening Blu Ray isn't "acceptable"?? -- just the other night, I screened "The Polar Express" Blu Ray. Absolutely stunning results, with picture and sound quality I would not have ever thought possible when I started in this hobby back in 1971.

While I've collected films for more than four decades, I don't want to be limited to only those comparatively few features released on Super 8 for my feature-screening pursuits. I have an extensive film collection, but I also want to screen recent movies, and not just the same shorts, digests, etc. that have been in circulation for 40-, 50-, 60-plus years, etc. Today's technology enables me to do just that. It's the primary reason that I built a home cinema (that supports both formats).

It truly is a great time to be in the hobby. (Also, allow me to thank Doug and the forum members -- in my mind, this is the only forum out there today that examines the hobby from a mature, intelligent perspective.)

Posted by Andrew Woodcock (Member # 3260) on November 29, 2015, 02:29 PM:

The results from Blu Ray and now of course 4k home projection methods will surpass the image quality from any film gauge (with perhaps the exception of 70mm) nowadays given the unbelievably high standards of the kit that's out there in this era to show these mediums.

However, Amandeep makes a very good point indeed regarding the magic and unique qualities of any analogue high quality source.

There are still many excellent feature films available on celluloid right up the turn of the century on 8 and 16mm for the true amateur film home cinemas out there.

Posted by Graham Ritchie (Member # 559) on November 29, 2015, 04:08 PM:

Quote from Andrew...

"4k home projection will surprise the image quality from any film gauge" [Roll Eyes]

I doubt it, my 85 year old Ernemann2 35mm will still blow the weeds of any video projection...Blu-ray will never come close [Smile]

Posted by Andrew Woodcock (Member # 3260) on November 29, 2015, 06:29 PM:

Surpass I said Graham, not surprise. I do believe Blu Ray still has exceptional clarity on even very large screens when used in conjunction with some of the very best digital projectors.
4k is outstanding on very large screens.

Posted by John Hourigan (Member # 111) on November 29, 2015, 07:00 PM:

Both 35mm and Blu Ray look outstanding on large screens -- while I do enjoy film, I'm so grateful that I can achieve stunning (and consistent) image and audio quality while only paying peanuts for features thanks to today's technologies. I certainly can't argue with that! It's opened up for me a whole world of screening possibilities, and has increased my enjoyment of the hobby tenfold.

Posted by Graham Ritchie (Member # 559) on November 29, 2015, 09:59 PM:

My apology Andrew for getting that bit wrong [Frown]

its been a long day.

However there is no way blu-ray digital projection will come close to anything like the quality image, a good 35mm print can give, never mind 70mm which in itself a class of its own.

I have seen 4K projection in a cinema but the results are just "so so" its ok, but nothing great.

Film in many ways and that includes many Super 8 films eg Peter Pan etc, will still leave the image of projected Blu-ray at home well behind.

PS what do you call a large screen these days? [Roll Eyes]

Posted by Andrew Woodcock (Member # 3260) on November 30, 2015, 04:04 AM:

Well I don't have Peter Pan yet on Super 8mm Graham. But I have nearly all the other Derann Disney Feature prints.
Most of the ones I have, I also have the Blu Ray and DVD of the same film.
If we take say Aladdin, Beauty & The Beast or the Lion King for example, I would agree every time that it's a close run call between which produces the most "perfect" image between the DVD and Super 8mm print
On some occasions I have definitely felt the Super 8mm film has the edge.

It has to be said however, that I am not using one of THE most expensive projectors in the world digitally and to completely run a fair comparison I would have to screen the print on the Beaulieu alongside the DVD on some of these £30k machines to give it a fair comparison I'd say.

Also, even using my 2200 quoted lumen output HD Panasonic projector with a standard inexpensive Sony Blu Ray player, the picture most certainly blows the Super 8mm image out of the contest on just about every comparable aspect you can choose. Simply no competition or comparison.

I do however use a very expensive screened HDMi cable as this was a permanent installation under my flooring so I purchased the best I could find at the time from both the Blu Ray player and then to the projector via the receiver.
I set even the DVD images(and all other signals except Blu Ray) to be upscaled also by the receiver which does make a difference.
Perhaps even things like cables etc do make a big difference??

My screen size is a very modest one but no matter how large I magnify the image so it would be filling something like a 30ft screen, the evidence of the Blu Rays image being superior in every way is only further cemented,as can only be expected I'd say.

I am the biggest advocate of Super 8mm quality prints that you'll find, but no matter how much bias I view this with,I cannot in all honesty say that Super 8mm or 16mm beats the best on Blu Ray for picture quality during projection.

Posted by Douglas Meltzer (Member # 28) on November 30, 2015, 08:42 AM:

We seem to have strayed from the topic. Amandeep, I hope your question has been answered.

Doug

Posted by Joe Caruso (Member # 11) on November 30, 2015, 02:45 PM:

Along that line, is it possible to get a picture off a DVD? Eventually want to have a t-shirt made with the shot

Posted by Steve Klare (Member # 12) on November 30, 2015, 03:17 PM:

Hi Shorty,

I think this would work:

You'd have to have a computer with a DVD drive and playback software. You would play the disc and pause it where you want your picture. (You might have to fish around a little to avoid frames with motion blur.) Then you would use the settings in the player to make the image full screen.

You would then use the "print screen" key to copy the image, and then paste it into a program like Paint. After that you could save it to any picture file format you like and use photo editing software to crop it to shape and apply any effects you'd like.

I usually don't keep DVDs at work (management frowns...)

-but this is the same technique applied to one of my favorite YouTube videos:

(I'm imagining Nicholas Cage in this scene...)

I'd expect a DVD still to look even better. The source format and the final format would both be higher resolution. (This screenshot isn't even the 200K we are allowed here.)

Posted by Janice Glesser (Member # 2758) on November 30, 2015, 06:42 PM:

Shorty...If you have a PC (it's also available for the MAC) ...download the free media player software VLC http://www.videolan.org/vlc/download-windows.html

It has a frame capture feature to grab frames off a DVD or any video file. Like Steve suggested...it's best to use the pause button then capture the image to make sure it's not a blended frame image.

[ November 30, 2015, 09:35 PM: Message edited by: Janice Glesser ]

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