8mm Forum: Butlers Film Cleaner

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Posted by Maurice Leakey (Member # 916) on January 13, 2019, 02:42 AM:

There appears to be a new product on the market, Butlers Liquid Film Cleaner, it's described as Cleaning, Lubricating & Preserving all film gauges. It seems to be named after the proprietor, Alastair J. Butler. At £5.99 for a 250ml bottle it seems very reasonable.
It's on eBay and on YouTube with a demonstration video.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/264131049693?ViewItem=&item=264131049693
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qYa0cBFKhw4&feature=youtu.be

Posted by Tom Photiou (Member # 130) on January 13, 2019, 04:26 AM:

I cant help thinking that this is what Derann use to sell. Liquid film cleaner.
The bottle looks the same to. My only concern is having used filmguard for the majority of our prints, would there be any kind of chemical reaction to the film if you switched to this?
I certainly wouldn't use a projector in rewind to clean a clean, even the editor would move about if you put any pressure on the film to clean it. You do need to use a some pressure otherwise your just coating the film rather than cleaning it. Thats my take on it.
That price is certainly more like it. i paid £90 for my last bottle of filmguard before xmas.

Posted by Maurice Leakey (Member # 916) on January 13, 2019, 05:10 AM:

The gentleman on the film says that it contains a lubricant, and it dries on the film, more or less. It evaporates and does not leave the film wet. He also shows the cloth after a while which he says "shows dirt already", but it's brown. Brown dirt? [Embarrassed]

If it does evaporate, how can the lubricant remain?

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on January 13, 2019, 05:24 AM:

I would not use a product for which there is a warining such as : "TEST ON A SMALL SECTION OF FILM FIRST"...

Posted by Matthieu van der Sluis (Member # 6040) on January 13, 2019, 05:57 AM:

Indeed, like it is not developed for film, but just tried out on one and suposingly seems to work.

Posted by Robert Curtis (Member # 6470) on January 13, 2019, 06:21 AM:

My personal experience of cleaning films and 'bargain' eBay purchases has not been a success! After a long break from film collecting, I returned to the hobby last year and made numerous purchases of used films all in generally good condition. I found some film cleaning fluid on eBay and duly applied it. After projecting the films some while later, all the cleaned films had warped/buckled creating terrible wandering focus issues. So now I don't use any cleaning fluid on films and certainly not eBay items! I have collected films since I was about 8 years old (I'm now 50!) and never had a film buckle or warp before. I can only presume it was as a result of the film cleaner - films not cleaned with the eBay product haven't buckled. Now if anyone can suggest a way to un-buckled a warped print...! [Smile]

BTW, I used Hahnel Liquid Blue from Derann y-e-a-r-s- ago and that was fine [Smile]

Posted by Tom Photiou (Member # 130) on January 13, 2019, 09:04 AM:

I think i will stick with filmguard [Wink]

Posted by Will Trenfield (Member # 5321) on January 13, 2019, 05:21 PM:

This is a link to some substances for cleaning film on Kodak's website. The use of Trichloroethane is banned and others may not be allowed depending on your location. Cleaning is one thing but film benefits from some lubrication as well.

https://www.kodak.com/us/en/motion/support/people_and_planet/product_use/film_cleaning_solvents/default.htm

Posted by Graham Sinden (Member # 431) on January 13, 2019, 05:32 PM:

Tom, Im sure you're right. This is basically the old derann LFC, and from memory it contains a small amount of silicone to lubricate but the main part is isoprop.

Graham S

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on January 13, 2019, 08:27 PM:

Use ONLY products which have been on the market for a very long time. Anything else you are really risking your film's livelihood with because a new product hasn't had enough TIME in testing to find out the LONG TERM effects.

Some products can take 10-20 years before film damage starts to occur from it. Unless you just don't care about your films, don't risk it...but then again if you don't care about your films, why are you spending money on them trying to improve their quality and extend their life in the first place?

Posted by Maurice Leakey (Member # 916) on January 14, 2019, 02:54 AM:

Brad
You give a very thoughtful reply.
On another tack, is there an agent in the UK who can still officially receive and sell FilmGuard?

Posted by Mark Todd (Member # 96) on January 14, 2019, 04:30 AM:

Hi Brad can you help us buy it affordably in the UK somehow please, and from there also Europe can as well.

We really need it. Nothing to touch it I think.

Best Mark.

Posted by Matthieu van der Sluis (Member # 6040) on January 14, 2019, 05:05 AM:

I bought it from the real image and it's send to the Netherlands, but he ships to the UK as well in bottles of 0,5 liter

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on January 14, 2019, 06:15 AM:

Matthieu, what are the p & p costs to Europe ?

Posted by Lee Mannering (Member # 728) on January 14, 2019, 07:20 AM:

Yes Matthieu REEL IMAGE are excellent to deal with 100% reliable and certainly the leaders for Super 8.

Talking of waiting a decade to see if a certain cleaner affects your own films. Quite a few of my own home movies had 2.22 lubricant applied in the 80's which was popular back then and widely advertised in the movie magazines. Doesn't seem to have had any adverse effect on the films pleased to say. Part of its makeup was Carbon Tetrachloride so not really healthy to use these days due to its toxicity.

Yes it would be nice to have a reliable outlet in the UK for FilmGuard someone like dear Barry from Ind8, a really nice guy with good film experience.

For general film cleaning I still use what the trade used when I managed a lab/darkroom, good old Isopropanol on a lint free cloth. Must have got thru many gallons and anyone doing Mag film striping will be using it still I am sure.

Happy cleaning!

Posted by Matthieu van der Sluis (Member # 6040) on January 14, 2019, 09:52 AM:

The Real Image works by the old fashioned way, hand written on paper.
I was looking for my invoice, but it is with my accountant.

Posted by Robert Curtis (Member # 6470) on January 14, 2019, 10:41 AM:

Further to my previous reply, I have checked the bottle of Film Cleaner purchased on eBay and confirm it is the same Butlers Film Cleaner. All the films I treated with Butlers Film Cleaner have buckled causing terrible focus issues. Fortunately, I have only cleaned 200' and 400' digests and didn't use it on features. But based on my experience, I don't recommend it! Probably best avoided! In the cinema, we used Drypur dry compound rollers. A shame something similar doesn't exist for 8mm.

Posted by Maurice Leakey (Member # 916) on January 14, 2019, 11:22 AM:

Here's a link to Steve Osborne's site. He advertises FilmGuard in 16oz spray bottles @ US$36.95. Scroll down.
https://thereelimage.jimdo.com/

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on January 15, 2019, 09:48 PM:

The Reel Image is absolutely an honest and legitimate FilmGuard dealer. Steve takes good care of his customers and will export no problem.

We are currently working on a dealer for the UK and one for Australia. With any luck both will be setup by summer.

Posted by Lee Mannering (Member # 728) on January 16, 2019, 01:54 AM:

Good news Brad. Fingers crossed it will be Barry at Ind8 for the UK a top man and extremely reliable.

Posted by Maurice Leakey (Member # 916) on January 16, 2019, 02:35 AM:

I whole heartily agree with Lee's comments.
Well done, Brad.

Posted by James Wilson (Member # 4620) on January 16, 2019, 09:47 AM:

Has anyone tried Cresclean?
I`ve been using this for a number of years now
and have no complaints.
James.

Posted by John Fields Smith (Member # 5879) on January 16, 2019, 12:23 PM:

Yes James,i have been useing Cresclean for many years and have no problems.I get mine from Phil at Classic.regards John.

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