8mm Forum: Elmo 16-CL Rubber Rollers

This is topic Elmo 16-CL Rubber Rollers in forum 16mm Forum at 8mm Forum.

To visit this topic, use this URL:
https://8mmforum.film-tech.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=000358

Posted by Maurice Leakey (Member # 916) on October 03, 2008, 04:56 AM:

I now have two Elmo 16-CL (optical) projectors and am asking for members comments on the rubber rollers which this machine uses.

On another site I read that these rollers can last a long time if maintained. For this the owner (American) used to use Rubbing Alcohol. A trip to Google reveals a number of advertisers but they only seem to be actually offering Isopropyl Alchohol but none seem to have that secret ingredient, an oil.

I tried in my local Boots branch but they were no help.

The topic also stated that the user also applied Filmrenew to his rollers with a Q-Tip after about each 10 hours of operation. This apparentately deep cleans the rollers of any chemicals left behind from films.

Can members offer any comments on maintaining their Elmo rollers please?

Posted by John Whittle (Member # 22) on October 03, 2008, 10:22 AM:

Over here rubbing alcohol is just isoproyl with a little water and fragrance. Alcohol can "dry out" rubber, so while it's good for removing magnetic stripe residue, it's not the best "cleaner".

I would look to an electronics supply source for "rubber re-nue" or "roller repair" which are sold under a number of names. What it does is clean and remove any oxidized material from the surface of the roller and provide a new "grip" to the surface.

MG Chemicals makes "Rubber Renue" catalog number 408A-100ml; Techspray makes "Roller Rejuvenator/Platen Cleaner" cat number 1612-250. The MG Chemicals contains Dimethylbenzene and Methyl Salicylate and the product is considered flammable. The Techspray product contains D-Limonene and Chlorinated Parafin.
(websites: www.mgchemicals.com and www.techspray.com)

These are just examples, there are other similar products for rubber treatments on office machines, tape recorders, etc.

John

Posted by Tony Stucchio (Member # 519) on October 03, 2008, 09:55 PM:

John,

Will these products also help the rubber disc drives on Eumig 800 series (Dual 8) projectors? They are notorious for wearing out and causing the machine to not maintain a constant speed.

Thanks!

Posted by Mark Todd (Member # 96) on October 04, 2008, 06:28 AM:

I`d have thought the best approach was just to leave them alone or if mucky a little natural weak soappy water on a cotton bud.

I think the rollers on your latest CL are new anyway Maurice so I wouldn`t mess with those.

Best Mark.

Posted by Claus Harding (Member # 702) on October 04, 2008, 09:52 AM:

For rubber rollers, I use Caig CaiCleen RBR.

http://www.markertek.com/Product.asp?baseItem=RBR100L-2&cat=CLEANING&subcat=&prodClass=CHEMICALS&mfg=Caig+Labs&search=0&off=

It cleans and rejuvenates and is very popular for tape recorder maintenance. I am using it for rubber parts on my reel-to-reel and my film machines.

Caig also makes a variety of circuit cleaners and such.

Claus.

Posted by John Whittle (Member # 22) on October 05, 2008, 06:55 PM:

There are lots of various rubber cleaning/renew products. They should clean glaze or dirt off the rubber. Material that is craced or dried out is a no-go with anything I know of. But add the CaiClean to the list. Always check the MDS for what the chemical composition is on any of these products. Some are much harsher than others and you should judge accordingly.

John

Posted by Josef Grassmann (Member # 378) on October 09, 2008, 05:13 PM:

Almost every Elmo 16CL we receive nowadays has soft, very sticky rubber on all 5 rollers.
There is no chance to improve them with rubber cleaner.

We remove sticky rubber from cores and put new rubber on and grind them to required diameter. If bearings are worn, new bearings are pressed on. Shafts have to be regrinded and polished if they show rough surfaces.

Posted by Peter Eastland (Member # 1296) on October 14, 2008, 04:19 PM:

Hello maurice thanks for the reply on the tubes for B&H. message board has now gone so not able to say thank you. My dad apreciates the reply. Regarding the rubber rollers it would depend on the rubber type as to what would be best to clean them with. I do not have any experience with projector rubber rollers but aything that affects the surface of the rubber could lead to reduced life or transfer of rubber to the film. Softening if basic rubber type is not resistant to the solvent or hardening if plasticisers are leached out. The IPA diluted with water 50/50 may be gentle enough.(clean gently with bud). Water will remove soluble dirt and IPA more greasy deposits.(vodka will give you a 40% ethanol mix). Some of the chemicals mentioned in the off the shelf products appear quite aggressive to rubber and humans. Hope this helps

Posted by Maurice Leakey (Member # 916) on October 15, 2008, 04:04 AM:

Peter

Thank you for your reply. Glad the valve info helps.

There seem many different ideas about the Elmo rollers. I have concluded that as my Service Engineer says he will be able to re-rubber the rollers (in due course!) then it seems pointless in applying different compounds in order to wield off the ages of time!

Posted by Gerald Santana (Member # 2362) on December 12, 2012, 01:12 PM:

Rather than start a new thread, I'm bringing this one back. I just started to clean up a 16-CL last night, everything was fine until I went to clean the rubber rollers...they turned to goo. [Frown]

Where can I find new ones? The older ones were melting into my cotton swab, which turned jet black when I applied a little more pressure to get dirt out. I can't run a print on this machine until that's been fixed.

Any ideas?

Posted by Janice Glesser (Member # 2758) on December 12, 2012, 02:27 PM:

I highly recommend Larry Urbanski http://www.ebay.com/itm/ELMO-16mm-16-CL-16-AL-ROLLER-KIT-set-of-4-ROLLERS-/230892381659?pt=US_Movie_Slide_Projectors&hash=item35c24225db

I bought mine a few months back and I installed them myself with great support from Larry.

Posted by Gerald Santana (Member # 2362) on December 13, 2012, 01:11 PM:

Hi Janice! I'll get those rollers...Muchas Gracias.

Posted by Laksmi Breathwaite (Member # 2320) on January 08, 2013, 12:30 AM:

Hey everybody I keep hearing horror stories about Elmo Channel Loading 16-CL Optical 16mm Film Movie Projector rubber rollers? Is this a good projector to run or what?

Posted by Dino Everette (Member # 1378) on January 08, 2013, 12:41 AM:

Laksmi
It is a great projector, as it is very easy to work on and it is very gentle on shrunken film, but as you have learned the pesky rubber rollers are its Achilles heel. But as janice pointed out they are very easy to replace.

Posted by Janice Glesser (Member # 2758) on January 08, 2013, 01:25 PM:

Dino is correct Laksmi...The Elmo 16CL is a terrific projector...fo r me it's a keeper. Replacing the rollers is a snap and new rollers will last you a very long time. I just wish it had a lens that I could fill my screen...but the image is super sharp and the sound great too.

Posted by Dino Everette (Member # 1378) on January 08, 2013, 02:22 PM:

Janice if you look around they make 2 inch 1.5 inch, 1inch, 3/4 inch and 1/2 inch lenses for the elmo. You'll fill the screen.

Posted by Janice Glesser (Member # 2758) on January 08, 2013, 03:01 PM:

That's good to know Dino. The lens I have is a 50mm...I've seen a 38mm lens on Ebay. I'm not that knowledgeable about lenses. Does the length of the lens determine the size of the projected image?

Posted by John Hermes (Member # 1367) on January 08, 2013, 05:32 PM:

Yes, the focal length determines the image size (in addition to distance from screen). A 25mm lens will have twice the picture width of a 50mm lens at the same distance (and four times the picture area). Keep in mind, all things equal, you will lose brightness as image size increases.

Posted by Terry Sills (Member # 3309) on January 10, 2013, 12:20 PM:

Hello Maurice
I had an Elmo CL with exactly this problem with the rubber rollers. An easy remedy is to remove the old rubbers and replace them with 'O' rings. You need to find the correct size and you will need 4 or 5 for each roller. Quite easy to fit and they work perfectly so long as you make sure they are not too thick, or they will protrude over the outer rim edges of the roller and the film will not follow the correct path. Simples

Posted by Laksmi Breathwaite (Member # 2320) on January 16, 2013, 11:14 PM:

How do I get the controls and motor nobs off to get to the rollers?

Posted by Janice Glesser (Member # 2758) on January 16, 2013, 11:35 PM:

Laksmi...you shouldn't have to remove the knobs to get to most of the rollers...just unscrew the two screws on the face plate. However, if you need to remove the inner plate to replace the one roller with the arm in back of the knob plate just pull the knob off and you will also need to remove the two screws on that plate.

Posted by Laksmi Breathwaite (Member # 2320) on January 17, 2013, 12:43 AM:

Thanks for the info and pics Janice Look at this picture I used fish tank tubing to repair the rollers .

How do I get the last roller off ? The one after the sound hub? The one next to the bigger spring number (1) roller

Posted by Janice Glesser (Member # 2758) on January 17, 2013, 01:19 AM:

Your model looks a little different than mine Laksmi...so you will have to pull off the knobs and remove the cover plate. You have to be careful with that #1 roller. You have to remove the arm that it is attached to see how it fits together at the base of the arm. There is also a spring that you will have to remove and reattach. It might be helpful to have the service manual I think the manual is available in the manual section of this site...if not pm me with your email address.

I'm not in agreement with your DIY solution. The thickness of the rollers has to be calibrated exactly. You might be saving money in the short term...but you are taking a big risk at potentially ruining the projector feed and your precious film.

I received a lot of expert assistance at the http://www.16mmFilmtalk.com forum. You might get more specific instructions on replacing the rollers.

[ January 17, 2013, 06:39 PM: Message edited by: Janice Glesser ]

Posted by Laurent Daudelin (Member # 3833) on June 17, 2019, 07:32 PM:

Anybody knows a source for new or reconditioned rollers? There is only one guy on eBay selling a set but at $45, I think he's trying to make a quick buck...

Posted by Janice Glesser (Member # 2758) on June 17, 2019, 08:05 PM:

Hi Laurent...I buy new rollers that are made to exacting Elmo specifications from Urbanski Films:

http://www.urbanskifilm.com/elmo.html

There is also a YouTube video showing how to install the rollers:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VSqzgKn09vk&t=6s

Posted by Mark Todd (Member # 96) on June 18, 2019, 02:31 AM:

Yes Laurent don`t buy those $45 ebay ones whatever you do if you can help it.

They are just black plastic flat ones, you need the rubber covered ones so threading etc works properly etc plus safety for the film and the tensions needed etc.

Those also stick causing the film to drag over them and scratch too as well as the other issues.

Best Mark.

Posted by Richard C Patchett (Member # 974) on June 18, 2019, 07:19 AM:

Greetings Laurent
Those $45.00 rollers are plastic. I've seen them many of times
They have atendisty to scratch film amd not quite up to specs
Its up to my customer if they want the rubber ones Most of the time i replace them per their request
I also sell the oem (re made) rubber rollers. There on my website with pictures

UBB.classic^TM 6.3.1.2