8mm Forum: B+H 2692 electrical fault?

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Posted by Chris Bird (Member # 3839) on October 31, 2013, 03:17 AM:

Hi Everyone. Sorry I only ever seem to post problems on here! I got a Bell and Howell 2692 from Phil Sheard 3 months ago. Nice condition, not abused. As I posted here a month ago, the ceramic lamp holder burned out, and Maurice gave some very helpful advice on how to replace it. My friend Marryn Stevens very kindly did this for me, and I collected the machine from him at Ealing last weekend, and bought a new 24v 250w lamp.

Got it home, fitted the lamp in the new lampholder, and switched on. Got a lovely bright picture for 30 secs or so, them it faded to dark grey, then black, and I could smell burning, so switched off at once. The lamp had clouded up and started to melt!

Oh hell, now what can be wrong? It's definitely the correct lamp. Is it possible there is some deep seated electrical fault with this machine? Anyone had problems like this before? Sadly I am a novice where technical matters are concerned, and don't have any electrical testing equipment etc.

Any advice VERY much appreciated. Have I just got a dud machine that will give trouble forever? I used to use these machines a lot at a film society when I was a student, and never had trouble with them.

Is there anyone is my area who can service this machine?

Posted by Robert Crewdson (Member # 3790) on October 31, 2013, 05:05 AM:

Really Chris, you shouldn't have to pay to have it serviced, it should have been in good running order when you bought it from CHC.

Posted by David Guest (Member # 2791) on October 31, 2013, 05:24 AM:

I can sort it for you but would have to drop it of or post it to me I am near southport been fixing projecetrs for over 30 years

Posted by frank arnstein (Member # 330) on October 31, 2013, 07:05 AM:

It might just be a faulty new lamp.
I would try another one before blaming the projector.
New lamps can sometimes fail inexplicably and its very annoying [Smile]

Posted by Martin Jones (Member # 1163) on October 31, 2013, 07:32 AM:

Good point , Frank! (You just beat me to it!)
Martin

Posted by Maurice Leakey (Member # 916) on October 31, 2013, 11:07 AM:

It's true that lamps do fail straight from the box, but quite rare for one to do so. Did you buy the correct lamp? It should have been an ELC 24volt 250 watt, known in the UK as A1/259.

Posted by Terry Sills (Member # 3309) on October 31, 2013, 01:16 PM:

I agree with Maurice.First check that you had the correct lamp. Very rare for a brand new lamp to fail. I have in the past had to scrape corrosion from the pins to make a 'new' lamp work, but to fail in the manner that this one did is a bit worrying. I don't like the sound of the burning smell and the lamp blackening. I can't imagine the voltage to the lamp would be too high, more likely that the lamp fitted was the wrong voltage. Other than that I think Robert is right - take it back to CHC

Posted by Chris Bird (Member # 3839) on October 31, 2013, 05:54 PM:

Thanks so much for your advice everyone. Robert, you are right, it shouldn't be my problem. But I did have a show when I first got the machine and had no problem, then put it away for a while. It must have just limped through that show and then called in sick. It's now three months since I got it. When the lamp holder burnt out I called Phil but he just told me I could push a replacement one into the wires, clearly not the case. Hence I looked for help elsewhere. I will check the lamp I used when I get home, but am pretty sure it is the right one. I guess I will have to waste 8 quid on another lamp just to confirm it's not a freak occurrence. Really disappointed though. David - thanks so much for your offer, but I am wanting to keep shipping the machine as a last resort as they are such a pain to package properly. Thank you though.

I'll keep you posted, and thanks so much for your help everyone. Meanwhile my ancient 9.5 Specto soldiers on reliably with contempt for the modern Bell and Howell!

Posted by Terry Sills (Member # 3309) on November 01, 2013, 01:06 AM:

I just had a terrible thought! It occurred to me that this machine could be an import from the USA and that it is set for 110/120v. I'm sure I have seen such TQ111 B&H's advertised on Ebay. It would certainly explain the lamp burning out and melting, but then Chris you say you have had it running previously? Was it running fast/ was the sound ok? I cannot recall whether it is a simple job to change the tappings but it is certainly worth removing the rear cover to have a look. Any thoughts anyone?

Posted by Chris Bird (Member # 3839) on November 01, 2013, 03:15 AM:

Right, an update: the lamp I tried was definitely a 24v 250w A1/259. Terry: a good thought, but on the back of the machine is a switch you set to either 220v or 240v, so it can't be an American model (it's currently set at 240v).

On the back is also a switch for lamp brightness that on other models is usually just part of the main rotary switch. For the successful show, I had this on full brightness without realising it. For this recent test, when the lamp melted, I had it set to reduced brightness, which means less power should have been going to the lamp. Baffling.

Anyway, is the consensus that I should first order a new lamp? Nothing else obvious that I can be doing wrong?

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on November 01, 2013, 03:43 AM:

8 pounds for a 24 v 250 watts bulb ? That's cheap comparing with the 24 euros they are sold in Belgium. I understand now better what the seller meant by "We import them from England because they are sold cheaper there than from the Belgian importator". I know what I will have to buy next time I go to England...

Posted by Terry Sills (Member # 3309) on November 01, 2013, 03:43 AM:

Chris I don't have your model but I do have a 1698 and on the back panel is a sliding switch to change the running speed from 18 to 24fps and a on/off rocker switch. There is also a rotary dial switch/indicator with a number of adjustments from 100v through to 250v. I have never seen one with the voltage switch you describe but maybe the later models have a different design.
Anyway good luck with a new lamp.

Posted by Robert Crewdson (Member # 3790) on November 01, 2013, 06:43 AM:

Chris and Dominique, I have sent you a PM with a link to new Osram ELC bulbs at £4.50 plus postage.

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on November 01, 2013, 09:37 AM:

I got it, thanks a lot.

Posted by Chris Bird (Member # 3839) on November 01, 2013, 10:15 AM:

Fantastic, Robert, thank you.

Posted by Robert Crewdson (Member # 3790) on November 01, 2013, 11:20 AM:

Chris, I have a brand new boxed ELC bulb you can have if you want to PM your address.

Posted by Maurice Leakey (Member # 916) on November 01, 2013, 11:34 AM:

Chris
Am I right when I believe this a dark grey model and has TQM marked on its side cover? If so, they did have slightly different controls from which we were all used to. For cheapness?
I believe this range was the last made by Bell & Howell before they changed to badged Eiki projectors.
There certainly sounds that there is something wrong with the electrics, although you say you have used it previously when it ran OK.
It does seem as if it needs a professional check-over.

Posted by Chris Bird (Member # 3839) on November 01, 2013, 03:24 PM:

Robert, PM sent.

Maurice, you are right on, that's the one! I'm just going to give one final try with the lamp Robert has so kindly offered, then yes, it's time for someone who knows what they are doing to have a poke around. Thanks everyone for your advice.

Posted by Maurice Leakey (Member # 916) on November 01, 2013, 03:49 PM:

A well-known service & repair man is approximately 20 miles from you, John White at Stanmore, Middlesex. Why not give him a call.
http://www.the8mmshedshop.co.uk/

Posted by Robert Crewdson (Member # 3790) on November 01, 2013, 03:59 PM:

Chris, will be in the post tomorrow by 1st class.

Posted by Chris Bird (Member # 3839) on November 04, 2013, 02:39 PM:

Eureka!!! First of all, a big public thank you to Robert for sending me a new lamp. Anyway, I thought, that's really nice of him, but of course I know it'll just burn out in seconds like the last one. I was wrong! I installed it, and have just run the machine with the lamp on for 10 minutes, with no problem at all - it has stayed brilliant white, no melting, no smell of burning. THANK YOU ROBERT! And thanks to those of you who suggested trying a new lamp first. The other one must have been a dud. Either that or it's some dreadful intermittent electrical fault (don't even want to think about that...)

Anyway, as far as I can tell I'm up and running again, so great advice everyone! Just as well as the nights are getting darker, and I've got a couple of 16mm features I picked up at the recent fairs just waiting to be watched. [Smile]

Posted by Maurice Leakey (Member # 916) on November 04, 2013, 02:54 PM:

That is good news.
One more word of advice. You must get a spare lamp.

Posted by Terry Sills (Member # 3309) on November 04, 2013, 04:23 PM:

Good news indeed and what a kind gesture from Robert. Very much in the spirit of this forum.

Posted by Robert Crewdson (Member # 3790) on November 05, 2013, 01:22 PM:

That's good new Chris, keep your fingers crossed. Enjoy your features.

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