8mm Forum: Looking for a UK Elmo 16mm specialist

This is topic Looking for a UK Elmo 16mm specialist in forum 16mm Forum at 8mm Forum.

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Posted by Stuart Reid (Member # 1460) on March 23, 2018, 09:42 AM:

Does anyone know who can take a look at my 16CL,I've tried to locate the rattling but I think it needs someone with a bit more knowledge than me.

Posted by Clyde Miles (Member # 4032) on March 23, 2018, 04:50 PM:

stuart, try kevin brown, nottingham,

Posted by Stuart Reid (Member # 1460) on March 23, 2018, 05:08 PM:

Clyde, unfortunately Kevin doesn't repair them...

Posted by Clyde Miles (Member # 4032) on March 23, 2018, 05:34 PM:

well that does surprise me i'm sure he did all 16mm projectors before, have you spoken to him?

Posted by Stuart Reid (Member # 1460) on March 23, 2018, 06:09 PM:

Yes, earlier this week. His reply:

Hi Stuart

I am sorry Stuart I don't repair the Elmo 16CL projectors

Posted by Mark Todd (Member # 96) on March 24, 2018, 08:36 AM:

Hi Stuart you could try John White but he`s maybe mainly super 8.

But you could ask.

http://www.the8mmshedshop.co.uk/

I did hear Lee Mannering on here does a bit sometimes now too.

Best Mark.

Posted by Stuart Reid (Member # 1460) on March 24, 2018, 11:21 AM:

Thanks Mark, yes John is solely super 8 - I tried pleading but no good! I'll give Lee a poke.

Posted by Kevin Clark (Member # 211) on March 24, 2018, 02:06 PM:

Hello Stuart

If you could capture the sound of the noise and put a video up on YouTube or a similar video sharing site it would be useful for us to then be able to help.

Does the projector work fine in every other respect?

If it is a grumbling sound that happens during projection when the take up spool has film on it the cause may be the take up drive roller and belt system, especially if it has never had the modified set fitted. Although you would think this type of noise would just come from the take up arm area in practice it travels right through the projector and has fooled many in the past.

Our own Richard Patchett in the USA has Elmo 16CL spares and the all important take up mod kits so don't despair parts and help do exist for these excellent machines. I've often purchased Elmo 16mm parts from him and his service is excellent in every way:

http://www.rcsclassic16mm.com/

Kevin

Posted by Stuart Reid (Member # 1460) on March 25, 2018, 11:48 AM:

Hey Kev, I did indeed shoot some video of the issue. My thinking is that it's coming from the cam, but it's not having any detrimental effect on sound or picture. Take a listen, see what you think. https://youtu.be/e3p88wYPw78

Posted by Simon McConway (Member # 219) on March 25, 2018, 12:46 PM:

Try a new drive belt. Always try simplest options first!

Posted by Stuart Reid (Member # 1460) on March 25, 2018, 02:23 PM:

Worth a punt isn't it!

Posted by Mark Todd (Member # 96) on March 25, 2018, 02:42 PM:

Hi Stuart are you sure its not the shutter catching a little somewhere as it does move quite a bit.

Just a thought.

Best Mark.

PS I don`t have sound though at the moment.

Posted by Stuart Reid (Member # 1460) on March 25, 2018, 02:47 PM:

I cant see it catching anywhere Mark, that's not to say it isn't, but I just don't know for sure... I think I'll need to properly familiarise myself with the service manual and strip it down. Not a task I would take on lightly.

Posted by Simon McConway (Member # 219) on March 26, 2018, 07:19 AM:

On the GS1200, a worn belt can cause some very concerning sounds, even though really there is very little wrong. I wondered if your drive belt appeared loose?

Posted by Mark Todd (Member # 96) on March 26, 2018, 08:08 AM:

Fitting a drive belt on one looks very hard going.

Out of interest Stuart if you have time whatt is the production number on the rear plate. It can sometimes give clues.

I`m just going to watch it with sound as at my sons.

Best Mark.

It does sound a little shutter catching on something to me now I`ve heard it but I am very far from in the know.I know ST600`s can sound a little like that with a V belt on. Best Mark

We can all hope Bill P will return to good health and fancy doing projectors again.

Posted by Kevin Clark (Member # 211) on March 27, 2018, 05:36 AM:

Hello Stuart

That belt looks different to any of mine which are thinner and tighter - I had some noise problems in the past with saggy Elmo square section belts so as others have said try that as well.

However, with my better speakers connected to the laptop, the projector does sound a bit 'dry' so a general lube will be good.

I think the noise is actually coming from the rewind drive clutch just to the left of the cam in the video - this part simply idles when you forward project so if it is dry or dirty the vibration form it sounds like a grating scratching noise.
The Elf SSL has a similar design with a near identical noise from the rewind gear assy if it has run dry.

Try the projector in rewind mode with the back cover off if you only hear the noise in forward mode it will be the rewind clutch.

Kevin

Posted by Stuart Reid (Member # 1460) on March 27, 2018, 08:23 AM:

Thanks Kev, I'll take a look tonight and report back.

Posted by Richard C Patchett (Member # 974) on March 27, 2018, 10:51 AM:

Greetings
I have been watching this post for some time
I have heard this noise before
Discovered that the worm gear is cracked
Its behind the silver plate, there also is a belt in there
Did you lube all the gears including the 2 drive shafts?
Did you take the spindles off and lube the shafts and bearings?
On the cam tank there is a cap on the front end drop a few drops of oil in there this lubes the shaft
Hope this helps ..

Posted by David Guest (Member # 2791) on March 27, 2018, 03:44 PM:

seems a lot of maintenance on these type of machines what with belts rollers etc might be best to buy a good elf or a good bell and howell I have plenty elfs in stock at a good price and also in mint condition I can sell you plus spares if you should ever need any

Posted by Kevin Clark (Member # 211) on March 27, 2018, 05:03 PM:

The 16CLs need no more maintenance than an Elf / Eiki David, once the transport rollers and take up mod are fitted they will go on trouble free for years. In Stuart's case he just needs some pointers to follow and thankfully Richard and others are providing him with suggestions. I'm sure if he wants to buy a projector in due course he may contact you but this is a technical question post not a projector sale opportunity.

Kevin

Posted by Stuart Reid (Member # 1460) on March 29, 2018, 09:09 AM:

Quick update, the 16CL is now with Clive Christian in Ukcfield, E Sussex - about a 40 minute drive from me. Clive specialises in stage lighting, but works on slide and cine equipment too. I will report back when he lets me know, hopefully next week.

Posted by Mark Todd (Member # 96) on March 29, 2018, 10:21 AM:

Sounds good, and fingers crossed Stuart.

Best Mark.

Posted by Kevin Clark (Member # 211) on March 30, 2018, 08:00 AM:

I hope Clive gets it sorted for you Stuart - if he needs spare parts tell him to contact Richard who I am sure will be pleased to help him.

Kevin

Posted by Richard C Patchett (Member # 974) on March 30, 2018, 08:48 AM:

Greetings Stuart

Best of luck

Thank you Kevin for the referral
RC

Posted by Adrian Winchester (Member # 248) on March 30, 2018, 01:18 PM:

Congratulations on finding someone to work on the projector - quite an achievement nowadays! I hope it turns out well. I've just found Clive's website, with cine repairs mentioned in the slide projector section: http://www.camerarepairer.co.uk/Home.htm

Posted by Stuart Reid (Member # 1460) on April 05, 2018, 03:13 PM:

Got a call from Craig today to let me know it's the motor that's causing the noise. Hoping to sort out the bushes.

Posted by Kevin Clark (Member # 211) on April 06, 2018, 12:59 AM:

Thank you for the update - that will explain the regular scraping sound then Stuart - just curious but was the projector once stored in a damp location - any evidence of rust or brown dust inside the lower rear casing?

Kevin

Posted by Stuart Reid (Member # 1460) on April 06, 2018, 01:10 AM:

Good question Kev, I don't recall seeing anything like that when I had the back off, but then again who knows what the machine was subject to in the nigh-on 30 years before I got it? Would you think a damp environment would cause the brushes to corrode and fall apart? Excuse my ignorance but are they like the wee brushes you used to get on the underside of a Scalextric car?

Posted by Kevin Clark (Member # 211) on April 06, 2018, 01:45 AM:

I was thinking along those lines Stuart - I have never had the need to strip a motor on a 16CL so don't know if they are carbon or wire brushes - I've owned seven of them in the past (six halogen and one Xenon) and recall the Xenon has a different motor to the halogen versions.

You are right all sorts could have happened to any of our projectors they are old now and could once have been a bit rusty not just dusty!

Kevin

Posted by Stuart Reid (Member # 1460) on April 06, 2018, 04:01 AM:

Indeed, I have (or rather Bill does) a Xenon too but the motor is kaput with zero chance of finding a replacement anywhere on the planet it seems.

Posted by Nantawat Kittiwarakul (Member # 6050) on April 06, 2018, 05:10 AM:

Had that 16-CL once in the past. As far as I remembered it uses induction motor,hence no brush to worn out/binding.
So what caused the noise? I frankly don't know. [Roll Eyes]

Posted by Mark Todd (Member # 96) on April 06, 2018, 07:32 AM:

Hi Stuart it should be possible to get the motor rewound/built etc I would think.

Worth it as a nice machine once done etc.

Best Mark.

Posted by Richard C Patchett (Member # 974) on April 06, 2018, 07:43 AM:

Greetings Stuart
Seeing that you live in the UK
This must be a 250 volt motor?
I have a 120 volt one for sale for the 16 cl
Refurbished $100.00 plus shipping

Posted by Stuart Reid (Member # 1460) on April 06, 2018, 04:38 PM:

Hi Rich, yes I'm UK based so would presumably need a 240v motor. By the way are you talking about the xenon or standard version?

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