8mm Forum: MOON LANDINGS

This is topic MOON LANDINGS in forum General Yak at 8mm Forum.

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Posted by Chris Quinn (Member # 129) on January 13, 2007, 12:07 PM:

On July 20th 1969 I was 11 years old and watching the biggest event on TV that there has ever been. Neil Armstrong took the first steps on the moon, an achievement that was beyond comprehension only a few years earlier and thought by most to be impossible and ridicules. Six more expeditions were made five of which were successful, 1972 was the last time we ventured so far. The furthest that man has been in space since is a mere 1000 miles, nothing compared to the 248000 required to reach the moon.

Unfortunately over the years there has been conspiracy stories running round saying that it was all a hoax and that it was manufactured by NASA for political reasons. It was my 19 year old son who prompted me to write this, the moon landings came up in conversation and he looked at me and said, of course you know it was all a fake. I found it really sad to think that mans greatest achievement is thought of by my son as a fake and it turns out not to be just him, many of his generation are sceptical and find it difficult to believe that it happened at all.

Well if there are any sceptics under the age of 40 reading this, then the answer to this is very simple. In the 60s and 70s the USA and western Europe were in the grips of cold war with the USSR and there came times when in nearly turned in to full out nuclear war, thank god it didn’t as I would not be here to write this. If America had been stupid enough to create such an elaborate hoax, and made the biggest lie to the world, don’t you think the Russians would have made it there business to show the world that it had been a hoax. They had the technology as they had already landed probes on the moon,and before the moon landings by America were well ahead in the space race, they had even started there own Apollo program and were planning a landing for 1968! It would have been political suicide for America and complete madness for them to hoax it.

At last there may be an end in sight to all this, NASA have plans to send a probe to the moon in 2008, initially to look at craters, and to see if any new craters have been made on the old landing sites since they were last photographed, and as they can photo down to an object half a meter in length they say that they will pick up on the Apollo remains including the moon buggies. Hopefully this will be an end to the conspiracy theorists and the young people of today can be proud of what was achieved back in 1969.

Long live NASA.
Chris.

Posted by Graham Ritchie (Member # 559) on January 13, 2007, 02:19 PM:

Chris
On the 20th July 1969 The images of "One Small Step For Man" came from a satellite dish in outback Australia the only one that could track Apollo 11 in the Southern Hemisphere. There was an excellent Aussie film made in 2000 made simply called "The Dish" starring Sam Neill, get your son and any other non believers to watch it and see if they still think its a fake [Roll Eyes]

Graham.

Posted by Mark Todd (Member # 96) on January 13, 2007, 03:21 PM:

I`m in two minds over this but I do find a stumbling block in the Van Allen Radiation thing.
I`d like to think they had but I really am not too sure, lets face it its all to recent that you can`t always believe what you hear or see.
Best Mark.

Posted by Paul Adsett (Member # 25) on January 13, 2007, 03:49 PM:

If you visit the Kennedy Space Center here in Florida, you will leave with all doubt removed that Armstrong stepped onto the moon. To stand underneath a Saturn V rocket is about the most awesome thing you will ever experience, as is to actually touch a piece of rock brought back from the moon. It was the pinnacle of US engineering brilliance (and truly heroic men)to carry out those missions, and the thousands of people who had a part in it are mighty proud of it.
I agree that the space shuttle program has been a waste of 38 years and a whole lot of money, just to cruise around in earth orbit. The USA could have had a lunar base by now, and the US treasure being squandered in Iraq could fund a Mars mission, Universal health care, better schools........but don't get me going about George W. Bush [Frown]

Posted by Stewart McSporran (Member # 128) on January 13, 2007, 05:22 PM:

This subject really boils my blood.

It's a triumph of stupidity over evidence. I have looked into these claims in detail and there's not one that stands up to scientific scrutiny. I'm not going into any details here, and won't be drawn. There are plenty of sites and books on this subject.

A family friend of ours, a man of great integrity, was a Colonel in the US Airforce who worked on the X projects in the 1960s and was responsible (I can't recall how) for the Canaveral museum. He knew most of the astronauts, including the Apollo 11 crew, and he felt personally insulted by this issue.

What really angers me, and it's not just over the Apollo stuff, is the sheer willingness of vast numbers of people to uncritically accept nonsense. I was living in the US when the original Fox "documentary" about this was broadcast and was amazed at how quickly people wanted to throw away a great achievement.

It's the same attitude that says that aliens are responsible for microelectronics. "How could we think up something that smart without help?"

Should we all just abandon technology and go back to the caves?

Sorry, I'm getting cross now. Must have a G&T and calm down.

Stewart

Posted by Mike Peckham (Member # 16) on January 13, 2007, 05:36 PM:

Can't understand the motivation for creating a conspiracy theory, it wouldn't occur to me to question the moon landings; they happened and they were a fantastic achievment, something the states are justifiably proud of.

Mike

ps. what I want to know though, is did Armstrong take a super 8 camera and a couple of reels of K40 with him? [Big Grin]

Posted by Paul Adsett (Member # 25) on January 13, 2007, 06:19 PM:

Hi Mike,
A special movie camera was designed by NASA, but I'm not sure what film guage it was. But it had to be as light as a feather, possibly made from Beryllium.
A visit to KSC is the most satisfying and inspiring day that any visitor to Florida can spend. When you sit in the Apollo spacecraft you suddenly realize how tiny and cramped it is- literally no elbow room, and you marvel at the heroism of the Lunar astranauts who spent about 10 days literally strapped in there - and I had claustraphobia after about 5 mins!
Truly an awesome and inspiring place to visit, and provides some much needed pride in being a citizen of the USA.

Graham, I have seen the movie 'The Dish', and as you say, it is great.

Posted by Steve Klare (Member # 12) on January 13, 2007, 07:34 PM:

Conspiracy theories are a great hobby for some people, it gives them the satisfaction of being "In the Know", maybe even making a buck if they write a book.

They are a constant of modern life and are inevitable whenever something important happens.

I think these people should stick to the Lincoln Assassination: there really was a conspiracy and 140 years after the fact nobody can be harmed by some hair-brained theories about it!

(Lincoln isn't dead! He's almost 200, but he's actually hiding with Elvis!)

I absolutely agree that the Soviets are the fly in the ointment of any theory that NASA didn't go to the moon, doubly so since they were on the verge of going themselves and would have loved the double whammy of an American hoax revelation followed by a Soviet success. In the propaganda business, it doesn't get much sweeter than that!

Posted by Michael De Angelis (Member # 91) on January 13, 2007, 10:00 PM:

Living on Long Island,
I personally met people
that worked on the Lunar Module.
It was contracted here in Bethpage,NY
by Grumman Aerospace.

The people that worked here were
genius, and their foresight,
imagination, persistence
and determination is what put
the space program in gear.

(re-edited by me from here down)

The love of this hobby for me
goes way back to 1969.

I watched The Castle Film Apollo 11
First men on the Moon at my
friend Ronnie's House. That was historic too.
Because you could watch it, rewind it,
and play it again in the marvel of
your own home.

Ronnie had a collection of silent version of Castle
film releases. He got me going with this hobby.

His specialty was Horror, and although
mine became collecting Laurel and Hardy, we would share
and project and have great times together.

It was difficult to earn money
as a young lad during those early Apollo days and
to save for my next Laurel & Hardy
Blackhawk silent version release of a sound
film. This was all because I could not
afford a sound projector and sound films.

I would later record the sound from the
Television and try to sync the
sound from my audio Tape recorder.

It was not perfect, but with some
skill I would practice syncing the
until it was correct.
In the end it was very
satisfying.

If I had the opportunity, I would take
out the 16 mm equivalent from the Public
Library, bring the print to school,
and record the sound using
the school projectors.

Eventually I introduced my collection to
two other friends and they too began
collecting Blackhawk Films.

The '69 Moon Landing Launched a great
many things, which for myself
I am very grateful.

Michael

[ January 14, 2007, 07:05 AM: Message edited by: Michael De Angelis ]

Posted by Steve Klare (Member # 12) on January 13, 2007, 10:17 PM:

Also living on Long Island, my wife's Uncle worked on the LEM and my Mechanical Engineering professor at College designed the legs!

I graduated after the glory days were over, and never worked on anything sexier than an on-board battery charger for the F-16.

Posted by Trevor Adams (Member # 42) on January 13, 2007, 10:20 PM:

Hi Paul,it was a 3mm film with a centre sprocket [Smile]

I've a neighbour who doesn't "believe" the Int.Space Station exists-even though I've shown it to him! The cave dwellers are alive and well! [Wink]

Posted by Chris Quinn (Member # 129) on January 14, 2007, 01:01 AM:

Todd,

Don't be fooled by the Van Allen radiation belt, the conspirator’s ace card so they think. The fact of the matter is simply this...

To leave the earth’s gravity you have to reach a speed of 25000 mph (escape velocity) that’s an incredible 7 miles per second. By the time the Apollo craft had done so it had slowed down to a mere 3.5 miles per second. Now that is still fast and at that speed it took them only 1.5 hours to get through the radiation belt. The belt is not of the same kind of radiation that you would get from an atomic power station and it was calculated that the astronauts would receive an exposure of about 1 rem, you need 25 rem to get radiation sickness and 500 to kill you. (Got this bit from the internet) [Big Grin]

No one knew for certain if the astronauts would have any long term problems, but they themselves decided to take the risk, after all they were strapped to a Saturn V rocket if they made it to the belt they were too busy thanking god to worry about a little radiation.

I’m hoping that I live long enough to see the first Mars landings, but I see this as a very far off project. It would take a president like Kennedy to say lets do it.

On a positive note Britain is launching its own probes to the moon in 2010 in search of ice and possibly cheese, wensleydale I think. [Wink]

Chris.

Posted by John Clancy (Member # 49) on January 14, 2007, 03:39 AM:

I have a couple of the Apollo moon landing films on Super 8. A particularly nice 400 foot reel of Apollo 17 comes to mind. Anyone who sees this would not bother listening to the loonies trying to call the moon landings a hoax. It's hard to believe anyone out there would be so thick, but there you go.

At least the current US President has set his country back on the path to space exploration. Let's face it, it's the only chance the human race has of surviving as this planet is finished. And what a waste of great Super 8 films and equipment if we let ourselves die out.

By the way, I've just had an email from NASA to say Comet McNaught is currently visible during daylight about a fist width at arms length from the sun. Apparently the brightest comet in 40 years.

Posted by Michael De Angelis (Member # 91) on January 14, 2007, 07:03 AM:

I re-edited my earlier post since before,becuase I became way off track and upset that people may believe in a conspiracy behind the Space program.

It is a good thread that takes me back to fond memories.

Posted by John Cook (Member # 203) on January 17, 2007, 07:00 PM:

OK gents, plug the link below into your web browser. Speaking of the movie The Dish, this site has some interesting "he was there" Super 8 associations to the Apollo 11 landing

http://www.honeysucklecreek.net/Apollo_11/Ed_Super_8.html

Enjoy......

Posted by Michael De Angelis (Member # 91) on January 18, 2007, 05:07 PM:

John,

Thank you for this amazing link.
The background notes and free download
are phenomenal.

Watching the the decent and captured audio
awakens the exact thrill as witnessing
the moon walk for the very first time.

Wonderful to view the side by side
comparison of video and Home made
Super 8 film footage taken straight from
the source monitors.

In viewing the sharp clarity
DVD transfer,can you imagine the
clarity of the
original Super 8 footage?

Michael

Posted by John Cook (Member # 203) on January 19, 2007, 03:00 PM:

You're welcome Mike.

Hey, here's another intersting site for you:

http://moon.google.com/

Photo optics these days being what they are, select a moon landing site and then use the zoom key to drill down to the landing site...neat stuff.

Regards, John

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