8mm Forum: Recommendations needed Video projector 3D ability

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Posted by Mark Silvester (Member # 929) on September 16, 2015, 02:43 PM:

Hi all

as most will know, I enjoy video projection and have been there and owned stuff from its infancy - this was the first I ever owned. Mine was the U.K. version of this and s lot of money at the time...beautiful piece of furniture too.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pm0oLFr0j2s

I am looking to see how the current V/P's for sale are at utilising 3D tech. I enjoy it through my TV and Blu Ray.
already..anyone on here utilised this through V/P yet? If so, what can you reccomend. I prefer LCD as the DLP "rainbow" gets me everytime.

[Smile]

Posted by Kevin Clark (Member # 211) on September 16, 2015, 03:17 PM:

Hello Mark

My 3d setup is an Optoma HD65 (HD Ready not full HD) DLP projector using the add on Optoma ZD1 3d box and it still works a treat after five or so years use. I won't replace it until it goes kaput (better to dump a duff VP than repair due to parts costs) and thankfully none of us at home see any RBE.

I've never liked LCD projectors myself having had problems with dust ingress and dead pixels on three previous LCD projectors I owned (Sony / Panasonic / NEC) so for me any future upgrade would likely be a JVC D-ILA or similar.

Kevin

Posted by Andrew Woodcock (Member # 3260) on September 16, 2015, 05:07 PM:

The models you speak of are excellent Kevin. What I will say is all Panasonic and Epson LCD projectors have a vacuum sealed light engine and dust ingress isn't an issue with these machines.

The later models are extremely bright, produce beautiful images and have very little drawbacks if any.

From the last 3 Panasonic models I've owned, I can honestly say I've never seen a dead pixel.

The contrast ratio also is something that has much improved in later times with these two excellent manufacturers of LCD projectors.

The JVC D-ILA models are the dogs dodahs from all accounts,but if you want to spend much less,I wouldn't be dismissive of either of the two manufacturers of LCD projectors that I mentioned.

Posted by Paul Adsett (Member # 25) on September 16, 2015, 06:29 PM:

I have a Panasonic AE700 from 2004 and a Panasonic AE4000 from 2012. I have never had a dead pixel or a dust spec with either one of them. Today's LCD projectors are every bit as good as DLP projectors, without the single chip DLP 'rainbow' artifact that many people are sensitive to. The Panasonic AE8000 reportedly has first class 3D.

Posted by Andrew Woodcock (Member # 3260) on September 16, 2015, 07:17 PM:

It's a stunning machine Paul when auditioned.
The images it produces are out of this world, to my eyes at least!

Posted by Kevin Clark (Member # 211) on September 16, 2015, 07:18 PM:

Sincerely Paul none of us here at home have ever seen rainbows from our now humble HD65 and as said I don't plan to upgrade to a new VP of any make or flavour just yet.

From my research and seeing one in action the JVC D-ILA is the only current technology I rate as worthy of producing true film like presentation at home. For me it isn't just about brightness and contrast, there are more crucial areas to consider such as shadow detail, deep black levels and fluidity of motion without tearing or judder. Going back to LCD would not be for me however it is Mark that is looking to upgrade not myself.

My experiences with LCD projection go back to the mid 90's for business use at work to my old Panasonic AE300 which ended up unusable due to dead pixels and a discoloured screen section caused by a defective optics block (plastic optics). I am sure their current range will be better.

I do like some Panasonic equipment though, they make excellent microwave ovens and breadmakers!

Kevin

Posted by Andrew Woodcock (Member # 3260) on September 16, 2015, 07:24 PM:

Yep, fair enough Kevin...you are an extremely discernable user of all things filmic so I take your expert opinion as gospel.
I personally, have always been happy since my first taste with Panasonic (ae 900) but I know the JVC tech is outstanding and if Rob Young both uses one and recommends one, well that's good enough for me!
All anyone can ever recommend in these circumstances is to audition both and see which justifies its price tag best for that particular individual...in this case, Mark.

Posted by Lee Mannering (Member # 728) on September 17, 2015, 04:08 AM:

Hi Mark. A pal of mine has a up market Panasonic in his home cinema and I find the rainbow horrendous. Even so when I upgraded my own proj I went for a Benq W1070 dlp which has now seen a good 100 hours soak test here. I was wary of going for a dlp but having tested it out prior it is fine and sits nicely next to the cine kit and a decent 3D projector for fairly little money.
I did a video presentation with it over at the coast to a large audience and it did a smashing job.

Posted by Andrew Woodcock (Member # 3260) on September 17, 2015, 05:02 AM:

Yes Lee, Panasonic are not renowned for any expertise in DLP projection but their LCD models especially the one Paul mentioned earlier, is top notch.

Posted by Kevin Clark (Member # 211) on September 17, 2015, 06:15 AM:

Probably the best way forward is to work out a maximum budget then check online reviews (they are everywhere 'Google is your Friend') of recent LCD / DLP 3d projectors and whittle it down to a couple to see demo'd at a hi-fi or home cinema supplier - down here we have Sevenoaks Hi-fi & Richer Sounds Maidstone for such demos so hopefully similar shops exist in Mark's area.

I think BenQ / Optoma DLP 3d models will be available around £500, then Panasonic 3d LCD's from £1000 to £2000?

Kevin

Posted by Andrew Woodcock (Member # 3260) on September 17, 2015, 06:26 AM:

Sevenoaks is particularly good I've found for demo's. Not the cheapest establishment to buy from though.

Posted by Paul Adsett (Member # 25) on September 17, 2015, 11:13 AM:

In addition to the stunning picture quality, the great thing about the Panasonic AE8000 is the lens memory feature, which allows you to program the zoom, focus, and vertical position , for all the various film aspect ratios. This enables you to instantly zoom the projector wider for Cinemascope and Todd-AO films in a constant screen height system. This is the way it should be done, rather than zooming in for cinemascope as in a constant width set up (which is obviously the only way to do it on a flat panel TV).

Posted by Mark Silvester (Member # 929) on September 17, 2015, 12:28 PM:

Hi Guys

and thanks for all the great advice.

Hmmm...I am seriously tempted by an Optoma I have seen - but, it is that dreaded "rainbow" effect...I had a beautiful DLP projector a couple of years ago - stunning picture! The problem was every-time I moved my eyes or head...I got this almost "nauseas" feeling and a strange flash of colour ..which I now know was the "rainbow"..I think it was just me who saw it? I had to get rid of the machine..it just ruined my viewing.

I have always liked Epson machines - and that is another machine I am looking at..both the DLP machine and the Epson come in just under £500...so both great value. What to do...what to do???Lol

I am definitely getting a new machine before December... [Smile]

Posted by Rob Young. (Member # 131) on September 17, 2015, 02:23 PM:

Mark, if you can see rainbow, no single chip DLP will really improve matters.

Even those with 6x speed colour wheels (faster than some and designed to reduce rainbow effect) will exhibit it if you are prone to seeing it.

I always saw it, but compromised because DLP had other advantages at the time.

Single chip DLP machines with LED light sources shouldn't have as much rainbow effect.

Have a glance at this;

http://hometheaterreview.com/rainbow-effect/

But note this quote;

"Most modern single-chip DLP projectors have fast enough color wheels that the rainbow effect is largely a thing of the past."

Simply not true.

And also this,

"Using LED lighting all but eliminates it."

In theory, LED light sources shouldn't display as much rainbow with single chip DLP as they eliminate the spinning colour wheel, however, they still employ strobing of each colour to the single chip.

I don't like the sound of "all but eliminates..." Hmmm...

I think, as has been suggested, some demos from a good retailer is the way to go, but if rainbow annoys you, I think you can rule it out.

Posted by Ken Finch (Member # 2768) on September 19, 2015, 08:09 AM:

Hello Mark. I am now onto my third video projector and they have all been LCD models. The downside of these used to be a the "net curtain" effect when projecting a large picture and also limited contrast range. Both are now largely eliminated due to the progress of the technology. One thing I needed to consider in my home cinema was the length of throw compared to that of the cine projectors to match the screen size from academy to scope. Most video projectors have very short throw lenses and limited zoom ratios. I have found Epsons to be the best zoom range and have been very happy with them. I checked out various Test reports in "What Hi Fi" and other magazines before I bought my last one and it cost me £800. It does not have 3D at this price but has inputs for older video technology as well as Full high definition. I think the current model with 3D is about £1900, but it pays to shop around. Very often the one that it supersedes but with the same specs can be found for less. I have never considered Panasonic because they are beyond my price range. However I have always prefered their TVs and video recorders and players etc.
Hope this helps. Ken Finch.

Posted by Dave Groves (Member # 4685) on September 19, 2015, 11:41 AM:

When I retired I bought a new inexpensive Infocus DLP projector and discovered the rainbow effect. It drove me mad. I wrote a letter to their MD in the USA to the effect that I felt I'd been conned. Got a very nice letter back explaining that not everyone sees it. Apparently, the faster your brain processes information the more you see the effect!! He explained that it was not a fault with the system but simply one of the effects of the design. Eventually replaced it with a Panasonic 'and lived happily ever after'.

Posted by Paul Adsett (Member # 25) on September 19, 2015, 03:52 PM:

Well Dave, at least you now know that you have a fast brain! [Big Grin]

The Panasonics also have large zoom ranges so that you can place the video projector at the back of the room on a shelf in the same location as your film projector. They also have large vertical and horizontal lens shift capability which makes centering the image on the screen very easy.

Posted by Kevin Clark (Member # 211) on September 22, 2015, 05:50 AM:

Reading all the good comments regarding the latest Panasonic LCD projectors on here has tempted me into considering an upgrade - I searched around and found the PT AE6000E on Amazon UK - used Flubit to get a better deal and they have quoted me £1220 including delivery - is this price too good to be true? (nearly half the Richer Sounds price).

I suspect it may be an imported model so will I have problems getting service from Panasonic UK if it becomes faulty?

Kevin

Posted by Jean-Marc Toussaint (Member # 270) on September 22, 2015, 06:44 AM:

Kevin, yes, the SRP for this projector has dropped significantly over the last few months. I paid much more for it a couple of years ago.
Just so you know, the current 6000 model sold in Europe is the same machine as the 8000 model sold in the US.

Posted by Mark Silvester (Member # 929) on September 22, 2015, 12:52 PM:

Hi all

and thanks for the info - VERY much appreciated all.

I will be going for an LCD...and I have my eye on a nice Epson. Not in a rush as I have one that gets me by until then...but will certainly have one in time for the dark nights of December. Thanks again.

Mark [Smile]

Posted by Kevin Clark (Member # 211) on September 25, 2015, 01:01 AM:

Thank you for the info Jean-Marc - I wondered about the model number differences so that confirms the AE6000 is the one I will likely go for. It has dropped in price again on Amazon today - from what looks like import dealers so I will need to find out if the Panasonic UK warranty applies or not. Still saving up for one slowly but surely as moving from the trusty Optoma 720p to the Panasonic 1080p resolution will be well worth it.

Kevin

Posted by Martin Jones (Member # 1163) on September 25, 2015, 02:28 AM:

Kevin, if it is coming from the EU the Panasonic Pan-Europeon Warranty covers it. Just register it with Panasonic UK. Mine came from Germany. I paid £1325, including delivery, in April 2015.
If it is the US version, from the US, it will have to be returned to US for Warranty purposes.

Posted by Andrew Woodcock (Member # 3260) on September 25, 2015, 04:20 AM:

Martin has got this marvel of a machine at a great price there.

When I was looking a few years back, I could not find one anywhere for less than £2k

Posted by Martin Jones (Member # 1163) on September 25, 2015, 05:15 AM:

Amazon are currently offering (from one of their merchants) at some £200 less, UK sourced. But make sure WHOEVER is actually selling it is an Authourised Panasonic Dealer, or you may find Warranty issues.

Posted by Kevin Clark (Member # 211) on September 27, 2015, 03:42 AM:

Thank you for the info regarding Panasonic warranty and to be aware of third party sellers Martin - when I do take the plunge I will check with Panasonic themselves to ensure the seller is registered with them.

Kevin

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