This is topic Some ebay sellers don't really want to sell? in forum General Yak at 8mm Forum.
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Posted by Mathew James (Member # 4581) on December 15, 2016, 08:42 AM:
Hi All,
A bit of a rant...
But seriously, to some US Sellers...why do some sellers truly NOT want to sell their films, yet list them on ebay.
What i mean is, i have been buying things on ebay for 20+ years...I know how much shipping is, worldwide. $20-25$US will get 1-4 films(400-800') to me here, tracked and beautifully cared for...
I recently bought some films from OSI who does NOT overcharge(thanx Osi)!! Very simple, and easy transaction,and packages nice(OSI draws pictures on the packages as an extra as well- he hee)
Yet, all i see on the ebay is the SAME ol' films cycling over and over again, and why? Simple, they sell the product for an okay price maybe but then have shipping of 40-50$ to Canada.
Why not just list to the US only if they don't want to sell it. I mean seriously.
To US sellers who list their prices like this, This is EXACTLY why you are NOT selling your films, in case you were wondering!!
Some on the forum are shipping a bit high imo, and so i have unfortunately had to stop buying!
I cannot pay over $25 to ship, even if it means missing a good film. I will rather wait until Cinesea or other....
Makes me bitter some days ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
ps: I only experience this with some US sellers. I find UK is always fair, even though the pound is heavy!
[ December 15, 2016, 09:46 AM: Message edited by: Mathew James ]
Posted by Tom Spielman (Member # 5352) on December 15, 2016, 10:29 AM:
I only use eBay to sell things on rare occasions anymore but I thought as a seller you had the option to let eBay calculate the shipping prices for you, and you could add a handling fee if you wanted.
Is is your experience that people aren't using eBay's shipping calculator or are just adding on an unreasonable handling fee?
Or does eBay's calculator use more expensive options than are necessary?
One reason I don't sell much on eBay anymore is that I'd rather not deal with packing and shipping something if I can find a local buyer. I sold something on eBay a few years ago that was fine when I packed it but was no longer working correctly when the buyer received it. I don't think they were binging dishonest and I did pack it well so I presume it was damaged during shipping or it it was a fluke that it picked that time to quit functioning. So I was out some money and it made me more skittish about selling things that way.
Anyway, I would assume that there are some sellers that are reticent to ship internationally because they're not sure what's involved and worried about hidden costs. Those that are experienced with it, are likely the ones charging more reasonable prices.
I'm definitely rambling at this point but for me there is a price below which I don't consider selling something on eBay worthwhile. There must be others who are very efficient at packing and shipping because I bought a camera for parts at a "buy it now" price of $1.99 with shipping costs of $6.00. I would never go to all that trouble for $2.00. At that point I'd be more inclined to give it away, which is what I did with that camera once I got the part I needed.
[ December 15, 2016, 11:34 AM: Message edited by: Tom Spielman ]
Posted by Maurice Leakey (Member # 916) on December 15, 2016, 10:45 AM:
A member of my family recently sold an item on eBay and the eBay calculator gave £16.28 for postage.
When an eventual sale was concluded, the actual cost at a local post office was £12.00 for recorded delivery.
As I do not sell on eBay, I don't know the answer to the following question to members.
Can you put on your own postage rate, or are you forced to use what eBay say?
Posted by Mathew James (Member # 4581) on December 15, 2016, 11:24 AM:
I think many of us strive to keep the shipping exactly as we are charged. That has been my experience with many here...we are just trying to get films back and forth...
But it seems to me that some on ebay try to make a little extra. I agree Tom, that there is a way to let ebay do the calculating, and that is when i believe it comes out to the 20-30$ mark...
I believe when i see more than that, it is the seller who has locked in a firm price.
Let me give 2 random examples:
1: http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Th e-Wizard-Of-Oz-Judy-Garland-MGM-18-Minutes-8MM-Movie-Film-Super-8-Sound-/201750330197?hash=item2ef941bb55:g:6GwAAOSwo4pYSIr3
2: http://www.ebay.ca/itm/HELPMATES-LAUREL -HARDY-SUPER-8MM-MAGNETIC-SOUND-BLACK-WHITE-/232175070136?hash=item360eb66bb8:g:mSsAAOSwJ7RYUilV
I think these are fair examples as they are both from california. There are no hidden costs. Any costs are always forwarded to the buyer! This is why i am so puzzled.
Maurice, I am pretty certain you can put your own rate as well...You can also put proper multiple rates that offer the buyer options in case they want more insurance or protection.
I have both a buyer and seller account. I buy WAY more than i sell but i still do sell, sometimes
Posted by Osi Osgood (Member # 424) on December 15, 2016, 11:56 AM:
Ebay, the strange bedfellow that we wish we didn't have, but is needful in some way.
One of the problems with shipping is that ...
1. Ebay takes a cut of you're shipping charge (read the fine print, YES they do, why? Explain it to me.
2. Paypal takes they're cut of the paypal payment, though not specifically of the shipping charge ...
Therefore, as a sucessful seller, though you would like to keep you're shipping charges as low as possible, it becomes necessary to charge just slightly more than what is actually needed to get it to you're customer, just so that you actually make what you have had you're auction sell for or, at least close to that amount. Depending on how much you sell it for, always remember that ebay takes ten percent right off the top, so, say, you want a hundred for you're item, actually make you're starting bid 110.00 dollars, and in the shipping, just slightly more than what is needed.
Always remember that ebay is NOT there to make you money, ebay is there to make EBAY MONEY. Plain and simple, but true.
Posted by Mathew James (Member # 4581) on December 15, 2016, 12:18 PM:
This is true Osi, but it can be worked around.
When you print the shipping label via ebay, you are charged an extra ebay % fee.If you bring your item to a post office however, and print the shipping information on the item, you can save that additional fee.
This is why i am puzzled..maybe it is just me, but, first off, i never sell anything that i know wont sell, therefore, i can package it up in a proper sized package from the post office BEFORE i even list my item.. Then i know exactly what it will cost to ship and list accordingly. i have never had any issue this way and 100% happy buyers to date!
Here i a good read here: http://www.ebay.com/gds/EXCESSIVE-SHIPPING-COSTS-THAT-IS-A-BIG-NO-NO-/1000000000 8351303/g.html
Posted by Tom Spielman (Member # 5352) on December 15, 2016, 12:31 PM:
And OSI reminded me of another reason why I avoid selling on eBay, - the fees. eBay and PayPal are providing a service so I don't think fees are unreasonable, but again, selling something has to be worth the time for me to do it.
I'm sensitive to the fact that my hobbies compete for time and money with other important things in my life. So I want to limit the time and money spent to those aspects of the hobby I actually enjoy.
If I had to guess OSI, I think eBay takes a cut of your shipping charges because some sellers have tried to get around the other eBay fees by listing the item at a low price and making it up on the shipping.
Posted by Tony Milman (Member # 7) on December 15, 2016, 05:13 PM:
Exactly that Tom!
Personally I try to keep costs to the minimum and recycle amazon packaging where I can. The trouble is estimating combined postage costs especially overseas
Posted by David C. Lucidi (Member # 4020) on December 17, 2016, 10:56 AM:
Matt, I feel your pain as I have a close friend in Canada. Here's my take:
1.) My company has UPS worldship. I can figure out costs in a few clicks, and if it sells, generate a label and all customs forms in a few clicks. Problem is, then YOU (Canada) gets royally screwed due to 'brokerage fees'. So you generally don't want UPS used. Fine.
2.) Ebay Worldwide ship. After Paypal takes a cut of the sale, Ebay taking a cut of the sale, Ebay taking a cut of the shipping, NOW Ebay wants to charge you for this 'convenience'. Sorry, not looking to lose more money. Which leads to Option three:
3.) I go to the post office. I wait in line (which sometimes can take as long as 5 minutes) to get the proper customs form, as there are 2 different types -- I forget it it's a difference of contents, value, or size of box. (And I say that because I have filled out the wrong one more than once when I tried to 'guess' on my own). After that, I have to hand fill out the form with these little 'box spaces' for everything. Sorry, but that can get to be a real pain in the butt, to be honest.
So if I have to go through extra steps to avoid Ebay charging me for a shipping convenience (and all of the money previously deducted), sorry, I'm going to charge more for shipping. The alternative (for me) to avoid hassle is UPS, but then you'd still complain of getting screwed.
Bottom line is no one wants to get 'more screwed' then they already are. Which is why the alternative (buying outside of Ebay, such as this forum) is usually a better bet.
Posted by David Guest (Member # 2791) on December 17, 2016, 11:03 AM:
you can put your own postage charges on I will do a cheep postage if they send a cheque as paypal is a rip off and they even take commission out of the postage
Posted by Evan Samaras (Member # 5070) on December 17, 2016, 12:41 PM:
I also try to charge for shipping what I will be charged, taking into consideration the fees. I think understanding that you will probably lose about 15% of your sale to ebay and paypal is something you should always take into account.
An odd thing that I have noticed, ebay will tell you, you are getting a "discount" but it many times tends to be the same price the post office will charge.
On other accounts, I have brought a package to the post office only to have them quote me a MUCH HIGHER price than I would have paid if I printed out the shipping label online. Not sure If I am doing anything wrong. It has just been easier for me to print the label at home and drop it off at the post office, even considering the fact that the post office is on the block of my home!
As for overseas shipping quotes on e-bay, I never rely on them. I always contact the sellers directly to learn about the charges. They tend to be a lot more reasonable than what e-bay may state. However, if they are using "Global shipping program" there may be no way for them to get out of it. I stay away from those!
Posted by Mathew James (Member # 4581) on December 17, 2016, 01:12 PM:
I've never once paid broker fees on a film.
Here is another fair listing from US to Canada. Notice, 4 films to Canada for 23$, perfect. No global shipping, no brokerage fees, just simple post to my door.
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Castle-Disney-Blackhawk-8mm-Movie-Fi lms-/252682415286?hash=item3ad50bacb6:g:aOcAAOSw5cNYUdw1
or another : auction
...not films i am interest in, but just examples of what i feel is fair shipping.
I bought a super 8 400' from Greece last month, shipping was 12$US and the film came beautifully packaged in a safe thick bubble wrapped envelope.
I don't understand what i am missing here? Maybe it works different in US, but all listings should include the lowest safely package,tracked,insured price...and it should be 20-30$US max for up to 5 films in my experience. If it is listed more than that, something is wrong, and like i say, the films cycle endlessly as a result imo.
Posted by David C. Lucidi (Member # 4020) on December 17, 2016, 01:51 PM:
Matt,
Am I to understand you never paid brokerage fees when receiving items via UPS, from the states? My friend lives in Milton which is less than 30 minutes from you, and he said he's ALWAYS had a brokerage fee levied when it was something coming via UPS. Additionally, everything that ships from my company to Canada gets a brokerage fee levied to my clients as well.
USPS gets handed over to Canada Post and then gets delivered to you. UPS gets handed over to...UPS, and from what I have always been told, gets levied with a brokerage fee that Canadians hate.
And with respect to the links you posted, both of them were coming via the USPS, so there wouldn't be brokerage fees in those cases (never are with USPS/Canada Post). Those sellers may not mind getting robbed six ways from Sunday by using Ebay's Global Shipping option to save time at the post office. Others (like myself) just don't want to deal with the additional hassle I mentioned above after losing money 3x beforehand (Ebay, Ebay shipping, Paypal), without charging more for the trouble. I know, it sucks ![[Frown]](frown.gif)
As I said, my solution to avoid hassle (and avoid charging extra fees) is to opt to ship UPS for Canada, but we're back at the brokerage fees debacle again for the buyer...so it's six of one, half dozen of the other.
That said, I would gladly charge "actual shipping costs" (plus any boxing fees, if needed) if I was selling something directly on a forum to someone (and having to use USPS along with filling out the forms). Did that many times in the past with car parts off Ebay through a car forum.
Posted by Mathew James (Member # 4581) on December 17, 2016, 02:05 PM:
Hi David,
I have never had films from the US shipped to me via UPS, so no i have never paid brokerage fees on a film. I have only bought off sellers that sell in the 20-20$ shipping range, ...so maybe UPS was never an option for me in the listings.
From forum members, i believe they just have used USPS to Can Post. I have never had issue with USPS, so for me there was never a need for another option i guess.
Posted by David C. Lucidi (Member # 4020) on December 17, 2016, 02:48 PM:
Hey Matt,
I was going to say, if you found a way to bypass the UPS brokerage fees I'd love to hear it (as would many of my clients, and my friend in Milton!! ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
All in all it's a lousy situation, but part of it is Ebay's doing. Years ago before Paypal, you waited for payment, and lost nothing (compared to the 2.9%, PLUS .30¢ fee, with Paypal). Ebay didn't take as much on the sale, nor did they take from the shipping cost (now 10% of the total sale including shipping). When you keep getting nickled and dimed to death via Ebay/Paypal, you want to either try to slightly make up for it, or just sell it as easily as possible.
Another thing is that (in my personal experience) USPS Media Mail is HORRIBLE (cheapest way to ship film). It can take weeks, in some cases, months. And with Ebay's buyer protection, the buyer can file a complaint, and Ebay TAKES the money back from you until the item arrives -- even if the delay is NOT your fault (i.e., package hung up in transit via post office, customs, etc.). Just a lot of hassle and aggravation to deal with.
Posted by Winbert Hutahaean (Member # 58) on December 17, 2016, 05:01 PM:
Matt, I share your feeling as I used to live in Toronto and shipped a lot of films from the States. I will give you some tricks but before doing that please be understood that since 3-4 years ago, Ebay also took the portion from the shipping charge.
For example, the cost of shipping from the USA to Canada is $23, if the seller charge the actual cost, Ebay will take a portion from this amount. I forgot the actual percentage, but they call "Final Value fees".
Moreover if the buyer pay with paypal, more fee will be applied.
So with these 2 fees, it is impossible to put the amount exactly what the Post Office charges the seller. Sellers have to mark up a bit (about 2-3%) of the actual postal charge if they don't want to loose money on shipping.
Now about the shipping tricks, there are several you can do:
1. Ask the seller to do simple packing (I am not worried with this since films are usually inside a cardboard)
2. Go to USPS.com, and find Postage Calculator: https://postcalc.usps.com/. Put all the box and select "package". Click continue and find "First-Class Package International Service". This is the cheapest for internasional shipping, but reliable. For 1kg (= 3 * 400' or 6 * 200' in simple packing) will cost $15.50 to Canada. Give this option to the sellers since most of them DO NOT know about this option.
3. Alternatively, find your friends/relatives in the USA to collect your films and shipped them in one time. Warning: Import duty may apply, depend on the item value!.
4. Or, use the professional service to do no. 3. I have googled this long time ago, and found some companies. They were based on the US border. They crossed the border every week and shipped the items collected to Canada through the Canada Post on the border. No import duty will be applied, but certainly service fees applied ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
Now is your choice.
Good luck!
Posted by Mathew James (Member # 4581) on December 18, 2016, 07:55 AM:
Thanx everyone for their feedback.
Winbert, i can totally agree with a 2-3% increase...I can live with this. It is the doubling that bugs me.
I think people forget that out-of-State buyers have a different exchange rate as well.
When it reads 25$US for shipping, we read it as 35$Can which is about what it is... It take us Canadians the same amount of effort to make 25$Can as it does to make 25$US, which means we are paying more on shipping on average, evry single time,...Plus every sale price is inflated as well. Buying from the UK is worse on the pricing since a $25P shipping would be more like $40Can for us...etc....
If shipping were equalized, we would have a good amount of film moving i believe...much more anyways
To resolve this issue is easy..You folks need to package your 2 best Laurel and Hardy super 8 Sound prints and send them to me for the holidays with a big ribbon on top ha ha!
Seriously though...I think buying directly from forum sales in the best way for me going forward...else i fear i will not be able to enjoy this hobby like i want to... I have 4 elmos sitting here that could use more use
Posted by Mike Newell (Member # 23) on December 27, 2016, 11:09 AM:
Excessive postal rates and greedy sellers who think they have found the holy grail by getting a super 8 film have killed ebay.
The fact that they have offered 100 free listing every day for the last 7-8 months says it all. If they were being charged for listing they might have realistic prices.
Posted by Mathew James (Member # 4581) on January 12, 2017, 11:55 AM:
Many of you with ebay accounts in Canada should receive a message from ebay. To be honest, I am thankful for the letter as it explains a couple of things to me.
1. There is a reason for the high shipping due to customs fees explained in the letter and
2. Ebay is not happy with high shipping to Canada either.
It seems to me if ebay was truly wanting to make money from shipping, they would not put this letter out. I still like ebay personally. It has been helpful to me over the years...
At any rate, I am happy to know why there is this apparent shipping issue!
___________________
From Ebay:
"...Unfortunately, Canada’s customs laws make it difficult for eBay users to buy and sell across borders. Our “de minimis threshold” is set at $20, which means we’re responsible for paying duties and taxes on international purchases worth more than $20. Our threshold -- set in the 1980’s -- is out of step internationally: the US threshold is US$800!
Canada’s low de minimis threshold makes shopping more expensive and creates red tape for entrepreneurs. It also costs taxpayers money because the government spends more to enforce the law than it actually collects at the border. Learn more.
eBay Canada believes that our laws should reduce burdens on consumers, entrepreneurs, and taxpayers. If you agree, please sign our letter to Finance Minister Bill Morneau..."
Posted by Osi Osgood (Member # 424) on January 12, 2017, 12:42 PM:
Ebay is certainly the "necessary evil" to collecting super 8 these days, and while I don't like much of what goes on with it and have my own rants (mostly privately), I am thankful for it, just the same.
I mean, i live in Mountain Home, Idaho, and this is certainly NOT any kind of Hub for super 8, (well, is there anywhere, come to think of it?)
Posted by Tom Spielman (Member # 5352) on January 12, 2017, 03:01 PM:
That's something I vaguely remember from the last time I shipped something to Canada on my own. It was an eBay purchase and was probably a decade ago. I shipped UPS at the time since USPS package tracking wasn't very sophisticated back then. I remember having to fill out an additional form and I had to declare the value of the item.
I had been given explicit instructions from the buyer not to state the value to be more than xx.xx (can't remember what it was) or it would cause a delay in shipping and cost him a small fortune in fees.
Was never quite comfortable with understating the value so encouraging international sales is not something I've really done since.
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