8mm Forum: Film starting to smell

This is topic Film starting to smell in forum General Yak at 8mm Forum.

To visit this topic, use this URL:
https://8mmforum.film-tech.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=8;t=004225

Posted by Ronald Green (Member # 5655) on December 29, 2016, 09:34 AM:

I am not an expert on Vinegar smells on film, but my films are starting to have an odor. A lot of them are in cans. Someone once told me to drill holes in the cans. Please give me any suggestions. Deeply appreciated.

Posted by Maurice Leakey (Member # 916) on December 29, 2016, 10:02 AM:

Ronald
Not all smells on films are vinegar syndrome. Films may have been treated with various film cleaners and/or lubrication fluids, then there is just a general old "dusty" smell usually on vintage black and white 16mm prints.
Also on 16mm, films printed on Agfa stock have a smell of their own, I can always know a film is on Agfa the second I take it from its can or csrton.
As regards, vinegar syndrome, the smell here often can be almost overpowering, and can usually be acknowledged as a vinegar smell like none other!

Posted by Clinton Hunt (Member # 2072) on December 29, 2016, 08:30 PM:

That's the problem Ronald in the fact that some films smell - but is it VS?
I have some that smell funny but then I had a 16mm that had a strong vinegar smell plus the film had become out of shape , so I knew that was no good!
It's a tricky one to diagnose so if not sure then put them away from others and check back after a long period of time.

Posted by Steve Klare (Member # 12) on December 29, 2016, 09:58 PM:

I once walked into a room where some films had VS: think of a salad bar with a couple of bowls of dressing open to the air.

-it's a pretty blatant odor: maybe "pungent" is the best word.

There are a lot of subtle film smells that are kind of funky, and I guess it's only natural that an acetate based film has a little acetic acid going on.

Absolutely get them out of the sealed cans, hopefully what odor there is will air out and all will be well.

It's sad to say that as a Super-8 guy, the vast majority of acetate based films I have are the ones I made myself: most everything commercially produced is polyester based and therefore immune!

Posted by Joe Caruso (Member # 11) on December 30, 2016, 11:18 AM:

Bought (knowingly), a Chaplin silent with VS - 8mm I'm speaking of - It was storage (musty-dusty cellar) which aided this problem - I've never had a problem with any deteriorative odor from any Super 8 or Std 8 print (acetate, of course) - Adding baking soda to a can, leaving it exposed for near a week does diminish some of the problem - The film itself (16mm as example), unless it's a rare title, try and locate another that is a Dupont or Kodak - Shorty

Posted by Evan Samaras (Member # 5070) on December 30, 2016, 01:50 PM:

I split an order of A-D Strips with 3 other individuals on the 16mmfilmtalk. I usually cut the strips in half to double my quantity. Normal room temperature can take 24 hours to diagnose. Colder environments can use a week or more.

https://www.imagepermanenceinstitute.org/imaging/ad-strips

They have been helpful in determining VS Syndrome. Like you mentioned, sometime I question whether a print is emitting a smell of vinegar, or perhaps something else. Mentioned above, sometimes certain cleaners or film stocks can have unique smells. Other times I have walked into someone's collection, and as soon as I pop the lid on a can, instant vinegar, no mistaking it. I have been told to keep the lids off during the summer if it's not in a controlled environment. I guess this makes as much sense as drilling a hole or buying archival cans.

If you want to implement some protective action and don't want to drill holes in cans or leave them open, you can always buy some sieves which apparently absorb what is being emitted (from my understanding). I picked up a pack from Steve Osbourne at the Reel Image.

Hope this helped!

[ December 30, 2016, 04:37 PM: Message edited by: Evan Samaras ]

Posted by Steve Klare (Member # 12) on December 30, 2016, 03:55 PM:

He should call them "Stieves"!

-with marketing like this!...

UBB.classic^TM 6.3.1.2