8mm Forum: In Praise of the Ace

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Posted by Paul Adsett (Member # 25) on February 25, 2009, 02:06 PM:

Like many film buffs, my first movie projector was a hand -cranked 9.5mm Pathescope Ace. This little projector brought me so much pleasure, showing Disney and Popeye shorts, as well as many silent feature classics such as Metropolis, The Informer, The Ring and many others. It is easy to dismiss the Ace as a toy projector, but it is really a well designed and manufactured machine, capable of giving steady and really sharp pictures on a 24 inch screen.

All this came home to me in the past few days, when I have been modifying the little projector for Halogen lighting. First, the projector is a really solid and rugged little machine, the main body being a die-casting. The internal helical gears are very robust, being machined from brass and stainless steel, and the intermittent cam is a very clever and reliable design. For what it was designed to do, the ACE succeeds admirably. It's success can be measured by the fact that it was in production for over 30 years. The one bad point of the design is that sharp edge on the brake arm, which can severely scratch the film unless you cover it with a plastic tip. You have to wonder why Pathescope never corrected this problem.
The Ace today is still a really fun little projector to run, and is a real change of pace from the GS1200!

Posted by Dino Everette (Member # 1378) on February 25, 2009, 02:43 PM:

Paul were you in the US when you first got the ACE? This is one of the few pathescope silent ones I do not have (this and the kid)I keep thinking about it, but feel I need to wait until my wife and I get a bigger place someday since most of my collection is in storage anyway.

Posted by Graham Sinden (Member # 431) on February 25, 2009, 03:49 PM:

Paul, I agree with you that the Ace is a well designed engineered projector built to last. I would certaintly like one in my collection, particularly with the motor attachment.

But I know how much you dislike those Eumig's with the dual core design like the 926. Isnt this the same sort of thing [Big Grin]

. Is there a top sprocket in the Ace?

Graham S

Posted by Paul Adsett (Member # 25) on February 25, 2009, 04:12 PM:

Dino,
I bought my ACE in the UK. It was designed and manufactured by Pathescope in the UK, and was never sold in the USA. There must be thousands of them still lying around in the UK.

Graham,
I never thought of it that way, but you are correct - the Ace may be the original co-axial reel design projector! [Big Grin]

It is of course a totally sprocketless design.

Posted by Trevor Adams (Member # 42) on February 26, 2009, 05:11 AM:

The ACE had a mighty impact on me Paul.I earned the ten pounds to buy one when I was 12 but my father said I couldn't have it until I was 16!! [Frown]

.Every week I'd go to SLYS LTD(the Pathescope Agents in Auckland)and fondle an ACE on display.On my sixteenth birthday I bought one!And then a motor.I had but one film,a 60fter featuring Spitfires and Hurricanes.I made the old man watch this flick every night!Later in life I bought up most of SLYS 9.5mm film library.........it comes to you eventually eh? [Wink]

Trev

Posted by Paul Adsett (Member # 25) on February 26, 2009, 08:23 AM:

Similar to my story Trev. I was 16 when I got my Ace. My first film was a little 60 footer western titled ' Northwest Justice'.I worked in a garage on weekends, and used the money I earned to rent films from a photo shop in Cardiff. I would pick the films up on a Saturday morning and return them on Monday morning. Over a period of a couple of years I must have rented (and hand-cranked!) most of Pathescope's library, and got to see many memorable films. I would show the films to my parents and grandparents and to kids in the shed in our garden, for a small fee to help offset the rental costs. It was during those days that I would spend hours gazing at the other projectors on display in the window of the photo shops in the Cardiff arcades, projectors like the magnificent Bell and Howell 606H, or the Bolex M8R, which were totally out of reach for me at that time. What I really wanted was a motorized projector, so I swapped my Ace for a 9.5mm Dekko. Big Mistake - even though the Dekko was motorized and looked like a great machine, the picture from the Dekko was nowhere near as good as that from the little Ace.
So, just like you Trev, the Ace had more impact on me than any other projector I have ever owned. Pathescope must have done something right! [Wink]

Posted by Luigi Castellitto (Member # 3759) on October 06, 2014, 04:56 PM:

Hi ninefivers,
my Pathescope Ace have adaptation with halogen bulb 20w 12v (had already when I bought it), very very good, but I would try to have more brightness for the projections at greater distances. Is it possible?

Posted by Paul Adsett (Member # 25) on October 06, 2014, 07:21 PM:

Luigi, 20 watts is about as high as you can go if you do not want to a) blister the film on stills, and b) melt the plastic condenser lens housing that sits around the lamp.

Posted by Luigi Castellitto (Member # 3759) on October 07, 2014, 05:51 AM:

I figured that the plastic holder (original of Ace, I only changed the bulb) would support a maximum of 20 w. Thanks for the tip!
Maybe there are alternatives, without using the original plastic holder?

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on October 07, 2014, 09:14 AM:

I don't know this machine but maybe there is a better lense available (from another projector) than the original one ? I have a Dekko and my lense is 1.9. I hope to find a better one one day.

Posted by Luigi Castellitto (Member # 3759) on October 07, 2014, 06:33 PM:

The objective is original, a very basic, non-interchangeable, probably don't know the precisal exact brightness, but it's very good for distances not excessive and dark environments, in fact the Ace has a small image definition does not really bad! I had this curiosity to see if there were other tools to replace (for test only, preserving the original) the original plastic holder, that it be extracted, but I also fear of ruining a projector in excellent condition!

Posted by Paul Adsett (Member # 25) on October 07, 2014, 07:38 PM:

The Ace is intended for screen sizes up to about 24 ins wide. For that task it does a good job. Probably best not to try and modify it for bigger screens with higher power lamps as there is no easy way to provide the necessary forced air cooling.

Posted by Janice Glesser (Member # 2758) on October 07, 2014, 10:00 PM:

I just picked up on this thread Paul...love the ACE...very cool [Cool]

Since these were not sold in the U.S., you are probably one of the few to own one here.

Posted by Luigi Castellitto (Member # 3759) on October 08, 2014, 10:02 AM:

Right, Paul, is also considered cooling. I leave everything as it is, thank you! [Smile]

Janice, the Ace is small and cute as a Pathé Baby! However, it is quite available on ebay and similar, usually don't sell much, you could do a thought for the purchase! [Smile]

Posted by Paul Adsett (Member # 25) on October 08, 2014, 08:34 PM:

I have both the Ace and the Baby. In some repects the Ace is superior to the Baby. The film transport through the Ace with 300ft reels seems smoother and less fussy than the Baby with the super attachment, and IMO it is easier to thread. Unfortunately there is no framing adjustment on the Ace, although this is not a show stopper as the Pathescope prints are usually pretty well centered on the sprocket holes. Both projectors are really well made, solid all metal construction and great at what they were intended to do, just dont expect either one of them to go beyond a 30 inch screen width. These projectors come totally within their own, nostalgia wise, when hand cranking early silent prints from the pioneer days of the cinema.

Posted by Ken Finch (Member # 2768) on October 09, 2014, 04:34 AM:

Hi, There have been a number of threads in the forum about the ACE including conversion to Halogen lighting. Countless numbers of U.K. enthusiasts started off with one of these. The lighting was very efficient for its time. It did not damage film if used properly despite not having sprockets. It got a bad name with the film libraries because of the carelesness of the owners not the machine itself. Like any machine it has to be used with some practical common sense. The one illustrated appears to be the mark 111 model but does not appear to be complete as it does not show the feed spool or the "brake" arm. The mark 11 was black and had a different base. The original Mk1 used the closed cassettes like the Pathe Baby with a similar "take up" chamber, blanked off on the later models. I have a Mark 11 which I started with which my dad motorised with an ex Government 12 volt motor shortly before the Pathescope one became available. I also acquired a mark 111 with the motor, a few years ago. As mentioned previously, it is not a good idea to fit anything larger than the 20watt halogen bulb when converting. Ken Finch.

Posted by Luigi Castellitto (Member # 3759) on October 09, 2014, 07:05 AM:

Curiosity: requires g4 halogen lamp 12v, 20w max, OK. But maybe there are different types of this bulb or not? For example white light, hot light, etc.. With one that can go better than the other?

Posted by Paul Mason (Member # 4015) on October 10, 2014, 03:19 AM:

The heat produced is what limits the rating of the lamp in the Ace. Some lamps are slightly more efficient and produce more light and less heat but the differences are too small to go to say 30W or 50W.

Posted by Dominique De Bast (Member # 3798) on October 10, 2014, 05:17 AM:

Don't hesitate to check if you cannot improve the surface on which you project. A very white surface (a screen or in cas of a small picture a white sheet oh paper) may make a difference.

Posted by Luigi Castellitto (Member # 3759) on October 10, 2014, 07:30 AM:

True what is says Paul, in fact I have two light types of 20w Halogen 12v lamp, but I can not see the difference, the one that says Dom, in fact, in a very white area that I have in my room looks brightness much better than on a sheet that I use for projecting, because it's not perfectly white!

Posted by Paul Adsett (Member # 25) on October 10, 2014, 12:31 PM:

I used to use a 30 inch wide glass-beaded screen with my ACE.

Posted by Andrew Long (Member # 2134) on March 14, 2015, 06:35 AM:

Hi,

I have to agree, I think the Ace is a lovely little machine, apart from needing a plastic coating to prevent scratches to the film. I have 3 in my collection, in varying conditions, and recently got them out to have a go at frame by frame conversion using a transfer box and still camera. Took ages to do a few minutes, but loved doing it.

Posted by Ken Finch (Member # 2768) on March 15, 2015, 12:56 PM:

I think the Halogen lamp appears to give a brighter picture that the original. If my memory serves me right, I used to use a silver screen with a picture width of about 2ft 6in. when I was a lad. That was of course with the original 20watt tubular bulb. Pathescope type AD I think it was called. Ken Finch.

Posted by Dave Groves (Member # 4685) on March 28, 2015, 07:57 AM:

Used to love going into Birmingham and visiting Galloways camera shop where they had a drawer full of pathescope films. 30ft. 5/-, 60ft 9/6 (or 25p and 45p approx). I remember 'Brumas - Polar maid' as being one of my purchases. Used properly, the Ace didn't damage films. I then progressed to a 9.5/16mm Specto. Happy Days

Posted by Paul Adsett (Member # 25) on March 28, 2015, 09:35 AM:

Dave, my very first 9.5mm film purchase was the 60ft Pathescope print title Northwest Justice. I loved that little film and must have cranked it a 100 or more times through my Ace. This was quickly followed by the purchase of several 30ft and 60ft Pathescope titles which I spliced together on the 300ft reels.

Posted by Luigi Castellitto (Member # 3759) on March 06, 2016, 08:46 AM:

Boys, I start by saying that on my Ace Pathescope, as I said up, I have a modified for use halogen bulb 20 watts 12 volts.

For casuality I have a (12 volt! of course) LED bulb with cold light, 6500k, 2 watt, and I fit it in Ace Pathescope. It seems to improve the clarity of image, the "blue/white" of cold light seems clearer than "yellow/red" of hot light.
Maybe it's an impression, but I would try something else: this test bulb is a 2 watt LED, 12 volts (as required, to not burn everything). So... I can try to buy a Led 4 watt bulb cold 6500k light, considering that as 4 watts LED should be 20 watts of normal bulbs, and therefore no risk of exceeding the wattage suited for Ace projector?
Thank you.

Posted by Ken Finch (Member # 2768) on March 09, 2016, 12:15 PM:

Following on from my previous post, my Ace came from Wings Chemists in Powis St. Woolwich. It was £5. 10s in "old money". Had to save my paper round earnings of 6 shillings a week to the shopkeeper before I could take it home. The first film I bought was "Jog Along Joyride" A 60ft extract from the Mickey Mouse cartoon "Mickeys Taxicab". I still have it, and it is still in good condition. My original ACE went to a relative in South Africa but not before it was sent out to me by my Dad to Egypt where I was doing my National Service in 1952. I was able to show the Queens Coronation on the tent walls before the AKC screened the commercial colour film! It was replaced by a 200B Plus but I have identical one for nostalgic purposes in good working order and converted to 12volt 20 watt Halogen. I also have hand cranked many of the old Pathescope silents. My parents dining room was converted into a home cinema quite regularly with a 30inch wide silver screen built into a "Proscenium" with grey silk curtains and coloured dimming torch bulb lights. It sat on the top of the sideboard! Oh Happy days!! Ken Finch. [Smile]

Posted by Paul Adsett (Member # 25) on March 09, 2016, 03:44 PM:

Hi Ken,
I got my Ace around 1952, before anyone had TV. I worked at a garage every Saturday for ten shillings, which I used to rent 9.5mm silent films for showing on weekends to my mum and dad. I had to hand crank the Pathescope 300 footers by hand, and I used a 30 inch glass beaded screen. The memories of the smell of hot ceramic from the dropping resistor ( we only had DC mains at the time) and the flickering light from the coal fireplace, remain forever. Truly magical times which can never be again.

Posted by Ken Finch (Member # 2768) on March 10, 2016, 12:05 PM:

Hi Paul, My experience with the ACE is so similar to yours it is almost uncanny. I also hand cranked loads of 300ft and multi reel films. Usually on a Friday night, with an audience of Mum and Dad, plus any visiting relatives. We never had television either, and we did have the flickering coal fire as well. This was about 1947. No TV until 1953 when my parents had their first one. Rented from the Co-op. I did not see any of it at that time because I was away doing National Service. Luigi's LED conversion sounds interesting. Best wishes, Ken Finch.

Posted by Paul Adsett (Member # 25) on March 11, 2016, 11:36 PM:

Ken, our first TV was a 12 inch Bush. It took about 10 minutes to warm up and had a huge glass lens hung in front of it to magnify the picture! My parents quickly moved up to a 14 inch Phillips which was a pretty excellent picture for 405 line black and white television of the day. The BBC had one channel which started at 5pm with 'Bill and Ben the Flower Pot men and close down was at 11pm, but despite the few broadcast hours the quality of the programming was superb. Now we have 350 channels and most of it is garbage. I'd go back to that single BBC channel in a heartbeat!

Posted by Luigi Castellitto (Member # 3759) on March 12, 2016, 04:55 AM:

Great stories, that give luster to a small but great projector. Even today I use it for my 9.5 mm, and noted that it have more defined image of other projectors.
Ken, "Jog Along Joyride" it was also for me as my first film! I still have it!

@LED project on Ace: I'm waiting to come at home two cold light 6500k LEDs, one at 12 volts and 3 watts, the other Led 12 volt and 4 watt. Let's see how it goes!

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