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Author Topic: What is the print that your REALLY looking for?
John Clancy
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1954
From: Cornwall
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted June 18, 2007 03:29 AM      Profile for John Clancy   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Spot on Bazzer!

Osi, get yourself a print of Master and Commander. The best feature release we've seen for years!

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British Film Collectors Convention home page www.bfcc.biz. The site is for the whole of the film collecting hobby and not just the BFCC.

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Patrick Walsh
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 723
From: Christchurch, New Zealand
Registered: Jul 2006


 - posted June 18, 2007 04:30 AM      Profile for Patrick Walsh   Email Patrick Walsh   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
RAISE THE TITANIC in c/s feature
A NIGHT TO REMEMBER either feature or digest
SINK THE BISMARCK feature or digest
KING KONG mountain release feature
Thats my wish list, also keen to get these on 16mm.
Oh! and a copy of THE SMALLEST SHOW ON EARTH and DALEKS INVASION EARTH 2150AD a must have! [Smile]

I know they exist on either s8 or 16mm, so I am always searching, just sent away for Raise on 16mm but is pan/scan.

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"Raise The Titanic!", It would of been cheaper to lower the Atlantic!

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Osi Osgood
Film God

Posts: 10204
From: Mountian Home, ID.
Registered: Jul 2005


 - posted June 18, 2007 10:54 AM      Profile for Osi Osgood   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Good post Barry. While I wouldn't buy Master and Commander, (well, I might pick it up for the hell of it for a 100.00 dollars), I'm still happy to see it coming out, if for no other reason than that I can bitch about it, which is half the fun!

By the way, a must havce for me, (and I have at least heard rumors that prints were struck) is ...

BLADE RUNNER

My Gawd!! I'd love to have that one!!

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"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "

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Pablo Alvarez Roth
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 129
From: Chile
Registered: Aug 2006


 - posted June 18, 2007 01:10 PM      Profile for Pablo Alvarez Roth   Email Pablo Alvarez Roth   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I would really love to have a full print of night of the living dead and texas chainsaw massacre!!

cheers
pablo.

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Mark Norton
Master Film Handler

Posts: 330
From: Hampton Hill, Middlesex, U.K.
Registered: Feb 2004


 - posted June 18, 2007 02:13 PM      Profile for Mark Norton   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
How about a new super 8 print of 'An Occurance at Owl Creek' The 16mm print went down well at the BFCC Ealing, is anyone else interested in this title? Also what would be the chances of getting any of the old cutdowns re-released, I know Derann have reprinted ' The Creature from the Black Lagoon" but there are many of my favorites like one of the most popular super 8 releases; the 400ft version of Star Wars all these prints seem to have now faded.

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Kevin Faulkner
Film God

Posts: 4071
From: Essex UK
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted June 18, 2007 04:20 PM      Profile for Kevin Faulkner         Edit/Delete Post 
I'm with you on "An Occurance at Owl Creek" Mark. That was awesome and I for one didn't fall in till right at the end when it really sent a shiver down my back.

The trouble is that I know the labs wont make negs from 16mm origination....or will they?

What about it JC? [Wink] It was an excellent pin sharp print.

Kev.

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GS1200 Xenon with Elmo 1.0...great combo along with a 16-CL Xenon for that super bright white light.

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Frank Picaro
Film Handler

Posts: 63
From: Pine Beach, NJ,USA
Registered: Apr 2007


 - posted June 18, 2007 06:18 PM      Profile for Frank Picaro   Email Frank Picaro   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Patrick,
I noticed a listing on the classic Home Cinema site for KING KONG. Its a Mountain release, but on 4x400 reels. Is it complete? I'm not sure. Good luck.

Frank

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Seems? I know not seems!!

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Paul Spinks
Master Film Handler

Posts: 453
From: Barking, Essex, UK
Registered: Mar 2006


 - posted June 18, 2007 08:06 PM      Profile for Paul Spinks   Email Paul Spinks   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Mountain released "King Kong" as a feature in two versions. The 6 x 400ft release was the full length print from the RKO re-release negative. Sadly the reconstucted version with all the good bits that were cut out would not be released for many decades. And a 4 x 400ft version that starts with Ann Darrow being offered to Kong by the islanders and plays through to the end on the Empire State Building as normal.

Paul.

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Barry Attwood
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1411
From: Enfield, U.K.
Registered: Aug 2003


 - posted June 19, 2007 02:54 AM      Profile for Barry Attwood   Email Barry Attwood   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Kev,

Negs can still be made from a 16mm positive, but it's the soundtrack that's the problem, as the machines no longer are around to transfer to 16mm fullcoat, although there are suggested ways around it. The trouble is unless it's a title that the 8mm buying public will buy without minding the slight drop in class i.e. coming from a 16mm master and not a 35mm master, then in theory it is still posible, but when some of the Forum members are talking B/W titles, then that throws up another set of problems.

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John Clancy
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1954
From: Cornwall
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted June 19, 2007 04:11 AM      Profile for John Clancy   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I'm with Bazzer on this Kevo. The labs must be able to strike a negative from 16mm. After all, where would the 3D re-releases have come from. Had to be Universal 8 16mm prints.

--------------------
British Film Collectors Convention home page www.bfcc.biz. The site is for the whole of the film collecting hobby and not just the BFCC.

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Patrick Walsh
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 723
From: Christchurch, New Zealand
Registered: Jul 2006


 - posted June 19, 2007 04:38 AM      Profile for Patrick Walsh   Email Patrick Walsh   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hi Frank
Thanks for the info re KONG, I would prefur the full feature than a edited version.
Cheers
Pat

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"Raise The Titanic!", It would of been cheaper to lower the Atlantic!

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Dave Cragg
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 166
From: Merseyside, Great Britain
Registered: Jun 2005


 - posted June 19, 2007 07:57 AM      Profile for Dave Cragg   Email Dave Cragg   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hi Osi,
thanx for the info re "Deliverance".
If it's optical sound though, presumably the "squeal like a pig" scene is heavily cut?

Dave

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Wide eyed novice.

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Gary Crawford
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 979
From: Manassas, VA. USA
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted June 19, 2007 08:17 AM      Profile for Gary Crawford     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
In Super 8mm I'm still looking for Alien scope feature. I've missed it every time it's been up on ebay.
In 16mm....the original Godzilla, which brought a huge , out of my league , price this weekend on Ebay.....and You'll find Out, the Kay Kyser /Karloff/Lugosi/Lorre musical mystery. Those are on my want list.

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Osi Osgood
Film God

Posts: 10204
From: Mountian Home, ID.
Registered: Jul 2005


 - posted June 19, 2007 10:21 AM      Profile for Osi Osgood   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Dave ...

That's the fact with Optical sound super 8mm. If it was rated R in the theaters, it will be PG for the sirlines, just for the fact that children could very well be watching the film on the airline. Therefore, PG. Still, to have it on Optical would be awesome!

The other problem with optical sound super 8 is that it's pretty much Hit or miss with optical, as these were never meant to be sold, (except in select cases) to the public, so the fact that I have the 35 optical features that I have, is pure luck. I'm not saying for a fact that "Deliverance" actually exists, I am betting that such a sucessful film would most definitely be released on Super 8. Whether it made it out to collectors at some point is another matter altogether. One thing is for certian, the print quality will undoubtably be better than the average super 8 print.

"Alien", scope, is defintely worth picking up if and when you can find it. It's a very nice print. It's one of those films that you really wouldn't want to see in a modern movie theater, as it's a largely "quiet" film that has subtle sounds going on around you, and not the kind of film to be distracted from by rotten ill mannered brats running around the movie theater!

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"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "

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Lars Pettersson
Master Film Handler

Posts: 282
From: Stockholm, Sweden
Registered: Jan 2007


 - posted June 20, 2007 02:31 AM      Profile for Lars Pettersson   Email Lars Pettersson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Barry,
Just curious, you wrote "The big factor these days is the cost of the negative, it's this cost that must be recovered before anything, and if it is thought that not enough prints will be sold to cover the cost"

What kind of money are we talking for the negative, and how many prints would be required for break even?

I´m thinking, if enough collectors could agree on some title everyone wants, and even would be willing to pay a premium prize for it to happen...? [Roll Eyes]

Cheers,
Lars

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Barry Attwood
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1411
From: Enfield, U.K.
Registered: Aug 2003


 - posted June 20, 2007 02:40 AM      Profile for Barry Attwood   Email Barry Attwood   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Lars,

The last time I released anything on 8mm (about 6-7 years ago now), a 2 minute trailer was costing me about £90 plus VAT, and this is before striping, buying the reels and the prints being sounded. Now I know for a fact that the negative prices have risen quite a bit since then, and I don't want to speculate, but if your talking about £100-120 for a 2 minute trailer, you've only got to do the maths how much a 90 minute film would cost. It doesn't sound to bad for a trailer release, but after all costs, you've got to sell about 20-25 trailers to just get your moeny back, and that is really hard these days.

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Osi Osgood
Film God

Posts: 10204
From: Mountian Home, ID.
Registered: Jul 2005


 - posted June 20, 2007 10:59 AM      Profile for Osi Osgood   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
My Gawd Barry!!

A lot O money that is. I have often thought that if a Super 8 collector had a print of, lets say "Blade Runner" on 16MM, it would be great if the super 8mm collector could then all get together to come up with the money to get the negative made ....

and then we could happily print away!

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"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "

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John Clancy
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1954
From: Cornwall
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted June 21, 2007 03:26 AM      Profile for John Clancy   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
And hope we don't get sued!!!

--------------------
British Film Collectors Convention home page www.bfcc.biz. The site is for the whole of the film collecting hobby and not just the BFCC.

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Jean-Marc Toussaint
Film God

Posts: 2392
From: France
Registered: Oct 2004


 - posted June 21, 2007 04:45 AM      Profile for Jean-Marc Toussaint   Author's Homepage   Email Jean-Marc Toussaint   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
[Big Grin]

Thank you Barry for the inside tips. This was confirmed to me last year by Phil at CHC. The sale ratio of 20 to 25 prints is the same for features. Some of his releases/imports have sold only 5. As Mr Independent 8 said, do the maths.

I am not sure we can find 25 persons who would agree on one title to release (without even speaking of finding the material for said release).

Although I adore super 8, if I were to spend several hundred pounds/dollars/euros on one feature, I'd rather do it on a 16 or 35 mil print. Needless to say that not all collectors have that level of wealth.

Super 8, IMHO, is an ideal format for trailers, short subjects, extracts and cut-downs.
Kudos to Derann and CHC for releasing material like Chub-Chubs, the Madagascar Penguins, The Bond or Matrix extracts. I'm convinced this is the way to go to keep all the collectors (particularly those with smaller budgets) happy.

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The Grindcave Cinema Website

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Kevin Faulkner
Film God

Posts: 4071
From: Essex UK
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted June 21, 2007 07:53 AM      Profile for Kevin Faulkner         Edit/Delete Post 
Or the equipment JM. I agree that the quality on 16mm of a new print would be blinding but of course with super 8 you can then have the added benefit of Stereo Sound and lower costs.

I for one would prefer to spend on a decent repeatable feature than a number of shorts or trailers.

Surely if some of the distributors here in the UK are still releasing material then it would make sense to come to this forum and ask what we want or give a us a list of possible titles. This way they could gauge what numbers will sell or even ask for a small deposit to ensure our support. Yes I have heard it said before that a dealer has listened to collectors and released what they wanted only to have no or very few sales of that title.

Without our support the hobby as we know it will die a death.

I know also that people like Gary from Derann has asked before for our wants and it was the support from a group of us here on the forum that got M&C released, fortunately that title sold over 30 copies so was a success story for Derann.
We need to come up with likely titles for release where origination is probably available....obscure titles that only one or two would like is really a no no especially from getting hold of the origination is concerned.

I hear all that Barry says with regard to costs but having been involved with M&C I know it's possible.

I heard many people say at the BFCC "Why cant we have Occurance at Owl Creek" on super 8" well we probably could if the right people got involved and the tech issues sorted but how many would actually cough up at the end of the day when crunch comes to crunch.

Anyway I will stop waffling on and just ask What do we really want to see? but it has to be titles which are in with a chance and that we would be prepared to support the dealer(s) with once released.

Kev.

--------------------
GS1200 Xenon with Elmo 1.0...great combo along with a 16-CL Xenon for that super bright white light.

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Lars Pettersson
Master Film Handler

Posts: 282
From: Stockholm, Sweden
Registered: Jan 2007


 - posted June 21, 2007 09:17 AM      Profile for Lars Pettersson   Email Lars Pettersson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Osi already mentioned Blade Runner -I for one would buy it if it were a very nice quality scope print with good magstripes. Does it take about 20 orders for break even? Perhaps it could be released "silent" and collectors could help eachother out to rerecord it, if that would cut costs?
Cheers,
Lars

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Osi Osgood
Film God

Posts: 10204
From: Mountian Home, ID.
Registered: Jul 2005


 - posted June 21, 2007 09:52 AM      Profile for Osi Osgood   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
It would cut costs, but not by much. At least over here, in the states, it only costs about 50 dollars more to rerecord in stereo. Now striping the film after being printed, I have no idea as to the cost right there.

Wanna weigh in on that Barry?

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"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "

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Dave Alligan
Film Handler

Posts: 47
From: Suffolk
Registered: Mar 2007


 - posted June 21, 2007 10:04 AM      Profile for Dave Alligan   Email Dave Alligan   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
As I suggestion why dont you all get together and come up with a title, you would need to get the legal stuff done in that I mean get coipyright clearance, you just cant print 8mm film without getting the proper rights, then you could get in touch with Derann and ask them how much they would charge to get how ever many prints you deceide, it would have to be a even number as you all are aware they are printed in pairs, once you have got a price for the completed batch you would have to cough up the money up front but you would have a film at the end of the day.

As to getting the sound rerecoded on machines at home, trust me you really dont want to go their not unless you really want to bugger up your projectors and I know that for a fact as I have done it.

Dave

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Barry Attwood
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1411
From: Enfield, U.K.
Registered: Aug 2003


 - posted June 21, 2007 11:07 AM      Profile for Barry Attwood   Email Barry Attwood   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Lars,

It's not the cost of sounding the prints thats the trouble, it's just finding FIRST "A title that will sell" then the most important thing is Finding the source print/negative , we all know the cost of a feature print, and the collector wants quality (naturally!), so it must either come off a 16mm interneg or a 16mm interneg made from a 35mm positive print, no other way around it I'm afraid. Considering the last feature from Derann "M&C" is about 2 years ago now, you can guess how easy it is to find suitable pre-print material. Shorts and trailers are a lot easier to come by, but as Kevin said he would prefer a decent F/L print, but it is bloody hard come up with something these days, so if anyone has any ideas?

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Osi Osgood
Film God

Posts: 10204
From: Mountian Home, ID.
Registered: Jul 2005


 - posted June 21, 2007 03:18 PM      Profile for Osi Osgood   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
One thing we can do as collectors, is that occasionally internegs, (are all negatives called "inter-negs"?) pop up on ebay, (for instance, believe it or not, I believe the Ken Films Star Wars 200ft neg on 16mm showed up on ebay, or at least, one of them). Negatives of various titles do pop up. Now, ending up getting a negative that's a film you want to print is another thing.

I would REALLY love to find out where the various super 8 film lab materials in america dis-appeared to?

HEY!!! I just entered the 1000 posts club!!! YAY!! (though I liked being called a "Jedi-master film handler")

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"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "

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