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Topic: Super 8mm options at reasonable cost

Martin Steen
Junior
Posts: 13
From: New Brunswick, Canada
Registered: Jan 2014

posted March 03, 2014 06:18 PM

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Okay, so I've now been on this site for about a couple of months and I need some serious guidance.
Having recently acquired a Sears Sound-stage projector as a gift and a 1957 Bolex M8 for $35 that works and looks great, I have now become hooked (not the only one I see judging by this forum)
I'm now looking for a good super 8mm projector. Money is an object :-(
I do love the look of the Bolex 18-5 super and I'm sure it would compliment the M8 nicely however I fear that down the road, I will also want sound.
I've read countless threads and to be honest, I'm no further a head, in fact I may be further behind. I know that every one on this board has a preference, however is there a common consensus about a decent super 8mm projector that works well and does a good job.
I love the vintage projectors and that may be something that I will indulge in at a later time however I would like to pick everyone's' brain to see if they can give a fella a hand and steer him in a certain direction.
Also a big thanks to everyone who contributes to this forum.
Martin.

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

Posts: 7016
From: Long Island, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted March 03, 2014 07:07 PM

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Hi Martin, and Welcome!

Basically if you go with the Elmo ST's or the Eumig 800 series, you'll probably be happy with the results.

These machines aren't perfect, but they are simple enough to be reliable and you can get a decent one without spending a ton of money. They are also common enough it's not hard to find dead ones to use for parts

Going into sound is the single best step I ever made as far as collecting films goes. I still enjoy my silents, but sound opens up all sorts of new possibilities. If nothing else, you'd be pretty hard pressed to find a theatrical film much after 1930 that is silent.

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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Maurizio Di Cintio
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 977
From: Ortona, Italy
Registered: Jan 2004

posted March 03, 2014 07:39 PM

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Hi!
I'd also suggest Sankyo's, for example model S 700 or 702 and its Bell & Howell (semi-) equivalent, DCT: sturdy, reliable yet simple, and with very good/execellent performance.

--------------------
Maurizio

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Martin Steen
Junior
Posts: 13
From: New Brunswick, Canada
Registered: Jan 2014

posted March 03, 2014 07:40 PM

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Thanks Steve for the reply.

Are we really looking at $300+ for the Elmo's? (as per eBay). This is quite a bit higher than I'd expected. I'm almost embarrassed to say that my budget runs to about $100-$125 max.

Maybe someone out there has had experiences with lower cost, decent quality alternative which they'd like to share with me.

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

Posts: 7016
From: Long Island, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted March 03, 2014 07:50 PM

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There are many flavors of Elmos. $300 is in the high range of an ST-1200. Great machine, but you can be happy with an ST-180, ST-600 or ST-800 for much less.

I paid $150 for either of the two ST-800s I have.

The money you spend on a projector is kind of an investment, because how well they treat your films will determine their useful lifetime. You will spend much more on films than projectors so it's worth a little extra money to have good machines.

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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Martin Steen
Junior
Posts: 13
From: New Brunswick, Canada
Registered: Jan 2014

posted March 03, 2014 08:12 PM

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Thanks Steve, good to see that the $300+ was on the high end.
You make some good points in terms of considering the projector as an investment. Is belt life am issue with any of the Elmo's and as for bulbs, does the price run the gamut based on the model you select?

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

Posts: 7016
From: Long Island, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted March 03, 2014 08:26 PM

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I run a couple of times a week and probably get 5 years on a set of belts.

The internet is the place to get bulbs. All of the machines I've mentioned use the EFP lamp. At a local photo shop (if you can still find one..) you can easily drop $25 a pop on these and wait a week for them to show up. There are many places on the internet you can get them well under $10. It's cheap enough that every couple of years I buy a stash of them.

...about 1987 I spent a week in New Brunswick, nice place! We were at a campground near St. John. There was a beach there and the difference in high and low tide on the Bay of Fundy was spectacular!

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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Bill Phelps
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1482
From: USA
Registered: Jan 2009

posted March 04, 2014 12:50 AM

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The Elmo/Eumig debates are very much like the Ford/Chevy debates...in both cases they will deliver the goods they just have their diehard followers.

I'm in the Elmo camp only because that is what I have and I have never had a Eumig. I have to agree with Steve in that it is worth it to invest in a good projector because film is expensive and you want to treat it as good as possible. Enjoy the silents and save for a sound!

Bill [Smile]

[Smile]

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David Ollerearnshaw
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1373
From: Penistone Sheffield UK
Registered: Oct 2012

posted March 04, 2014 05:06 AM

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Me too ELMO camp, this was mainly because the ST1200 took 1200ft reels & had optical sound. Moved to a GS1200 for stereo sound, also have Fumeo 9139 and just bought a ST1200HD and compired to the other two a light weight.

I believe at one time a complaint about Eumig's was 'Hum' I seem to recall reviews mentioning this.

Also one thing to bear in mind, a lot of OEM was about. Look at some of the old advertisements from the mid to late 70's early 80's many projectors were made by just a few factories.

There was some crap made though at the cheaper end of the market avoid that.

Take a look at my website The Reel Image (UK) Some test reports from the UK magazine Movie Maker. Mike Peckham kindly sent me the scans. They are in rar archive format.

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I love the smell of film in the morning.

http://www.thereelimage.co.uk/

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Paul Mason
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 540
From: Aldershot, Hampshire, UK
Registered: Nov 2013

posted March 04, 2014 05:51 AM

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Bolex Super 8 sound projectors were rebadged Eumigs and made in the Eumig factories so have the same strengths and weaknesses. Chinon are worth considering as they offer good engineering at a cheaper price.

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Paul.

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Zechariah Sporre
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 557
From: Ladysmith, WI U.S.A.
Registered: Dec 2010

posted March 04, 2014 09:20 AM

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I have had both Eumig 800 series and Elmo ST-1200 projectors. They definitely both have some seperate good points. I personally prefer the Eumig projectors. Also depends a little on what is important to you. On the Elmo it is nice that you can run 1200' reels. They seem quite dependable , although they seem to need a more regular cleaning to keep your film from getting scratched. The thing I like about the Eumig is you can get the dual sound ones so it really opens up what you can buy and you can run both super 8 and standard 8mm films. If you keep looking on Ebay I have bought them as cheap as $50 but more regularly they sell for $100-200.

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There is a fine line between a hobby and a mental illness

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Martin Steen
Junior
Posts: 13
From: New Brunswick, Canada
Registered: Jan 2014

posted March 04, 2014 06:50 PM

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Thank you all for your input as it does help me when it comes down to narrowing my search. I love the look of the old Bolex projectors however as Steve mentioned, spending money on a decent sound projector opens up more options for viewing.

I see as usual there are "camps" that lean towards certain brands and for that I appreciate those comments who spoke well of the "other camp".

While the search continues, at least I can hone my search a little narrower.
If only shipping wasn't so damn expensive :-(
Thanks again to all.
Martin

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

Posts: 7016
From: Long Island, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted March 04, 2014 07:02 PM

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An old friend of mine was a heavy-duty Eumig man, and would have called me an "Elmoaner" for the way I've turned in recent years.

I have a Eumig 800 series machine. It is compact, reliable and pretty quiet in operation. Only two things really bug me about it:

1) To clean the gate you need to retract the claw. If you forget, you can damage the claw and basically kill the machine.

2) The sound head is fully enclosed and it's a minor surgery to clean it.

Those two things aside, they are great machines.

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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Maurice Leakey
Film God

Posts: 5895
From: Bristol. United Kingdom
Registered: Oct 2007

posted March 05, 2014 04:04 AM

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Martin
If you buy from eBay make sure the projector has a power cord. I have just looked at Canadian eBay and see at least two prospective sellers say "No Power Cord".
Some projectors used power cords with a socket/plug which was peculiar to that make, if not included you will find it near impossible to locate a replacement cord.

--------------------
Maurice

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Paul Mason
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 540
From: Aldershot, Hampshire, UK
Registered: Nov 2013

posted March 05, 2014 05:08 AM

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Also as mentioned previously on this forum, "no power cord" is often code for "not tested and hence may not work."

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Paul.

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Mark Todd
Film God

Posts: 3846
From: UK
Registered: Aug 2003

posted March 05, 2014 11:40 AM

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Hi Steve so have I got this right, the advance knob on the back of the Eumig/Bolex has a small dot on. Goes this need to be at the top to remove the gate.

Thanks

Best Mark.

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Osi Osgood
Film God

Posts: 10204
From: Mountian Home, ID.
Registered: Jul 2005

posted March 05, 2014 12:33 PM

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Get another projector as soon as possible! Those "Sears" brand projectors are Gawd-awful on films!!!

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"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "

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Maurice Leakey
Film God

Posts: 5895
From: Bristol. United Kingdom
Registered: Oct 2007

posted March 05, 2014 02:34 PM

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Mark
Yes.
If the dot is at the "12 o'clock" position the claw is retracted allowing the gate to be removed.
If the gate is removed with the inching knob in any other position you run the risk of breaking off the claw.

--------------------
Maurice

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Mark Todd
Film God

Posts: 3846
From: UK
Registered: Aug 2003

posted March 06, 2014 01:43 PM

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Thanks for the confirmation Maurice.

Must admit I do like/rate the just super 8 Eumig Bolex`s now.

Best Mark.

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