8mm Forum: Chinon 2500GL questions

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Topic: Chinon 2500GL questions

Bill Vendasi
Film Handler

Posts: 45
From: Dover, NH, USA
Registered: Apr 2015

posted April 21, 2015 09:39 AM

Hi everyone, glad I found you.

I have a 2500GL that I want to use for digital transfers. I have about thirty 400' reels of both Reg 8 and Super 8, and I plan to use a Sony Digital 8 camcorder.

Ok, so the Chinon has not been kept very well but it does play films IF I baby-sit right next to it.

1. I notice that some films 'jump/jitter' frames a lot and I have to keep stopping. Sometimes it corrects itself, sometimes not. What can I do about this?

2. The variable speed works fine with some films but others
play way too fast no matter where the dial is. It seems as though the speed dial gets locked into super-fast mode. This only happens once in a while.

3. The reels remain loose and floppy and won't attach securely. The only exception is when I mount a Reg 8 feed-reel with the small hole. Super 8 reels flop around no matter what I do, and the take up reel ONLY fits a large hole Super 8 reel .. there's no way to use the smaller Reg 8 reel. And even then I need tape to keep it on. Am I missing some attachments?

4. To run films I usually have to quickly flip the knob into reverse then forward. If I just use forward nothing happens.

5. I just replaced the bulb which is only 50w - is that bright enough for transfers?

Plus, any advice on cleaning and maintenance is appreciated.

Sorry for the long post.
Thanks for reading.
Bill

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Janice Glesser
Film Goddess

Posts: 3468
From: Sunnyvale, CA USA
Registered: Sep 2011

posted April 21, 2015 12:55 PM

Hi Bill and welcome to the forum. You are starting with several strikes against you in trying to telecine with the projector you have. Telecine transfers are difficult to begin with...let alone trying to do it with a crippled projector. When I started transferring my films about 5 years ago I had a 8mm Keystone K-109 that my mom bought in the 1950's. It kept losing the bottom loop after running about 10 ft of film. I would stop it...roll the film back in the projector...make a new loop...and start again only to repeat the entire procedure in another 2 - 3 minutes. I quickly realized this projector was not going to do it for me.

The Chinon 2500GL when working well can be a nice machine for transfers. However, these projectors were not made very well and if they have been used alot parts start to misalign and wear out. Unfortunately your machine sounds like it fits into the worn-out category. That's not to say it can't be fixed...but it will take time to troubleshoot all the problems...make adjustments...and it probably will require new parts.

My recommendation is to search out another variable speed projector such as a Sankyo 1000 or Sankyo 2000H. These have held up well over the years.

--------------------
Janice

"I'm having a very good day!"
Richard Dreyfuss - Let It Ride (1989).

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Bill Vendasi
Film Handler

Posts: 45
From: Dover, NH, USA
Registered: Apr 2015

posted April 21, 2015 02:06 PM

Thanks, Janice,

That's exactly the kind of help I needed. I have been saving for another machine already so I will look at those models.

I assume basically, I need something in top running condition with variable speed, that has been tested.
Any brand names I need to stay away from?

Other than eBay, where is a good place to look/buy?

Thanks again,
Bill

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Barry Fritz
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1061
From: Burnsville, MN, USA
Registered: Dec 2009

posted April 21, 2015 03:10 PM

Did you just get this projector or have you had it for some time. If you have had it, has it been used regularly?
On many Dual 8 projectors, the take-up spindle is for Super 8 only. Use a Super 8 take-up reel and you will be fine, even for Standard 8. The feed reel spindle is for Standard 8, and needs an adapter for Super 8 reels. Sounds like you are missing that. Regarding the speed control, make certain the knob is not turning on the spindle. Jumpy or flickering film is a sign of a lost or improper lower loop. Check that when it starts to flicker. Also check to see that the film gate is clean. Control knobs that have not be used for a long time can become corroded at contact points. With the mains unplugged, exercise the knobs by switching them through their contact ranges. Options for purchases are thrift stores, Craigslist, Ebay. With ebay, ask if the projector has been tested with film. If you go to see a projector on Craigslist or in a thrift store, bring a roll of film and test it first.

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Bill Vendasi
Film Handler

Posts: 45
From: Dover, NH, USA
Registered: Apr 2015

posted April 21, 2015 05:55 PM

Hi Barry,

Thanks for the great info. This projector has been sitting for a very long time (years), so a lot of your comments probably apply.

Can you explain just a little bit about the lower loop?
I assume you mean the bend right after the gate? Should the top and bottom loops be even/equal, and when one is not that causes the jitter?

Thanks

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Barry Fritz
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1061
From: Burnsville, MN, USA
Registered: Dec 2009

posted April 21, 2015 06:21 PM

Bill:
You are correct. The upper loop is just before the film enters the gate and the lower loop is just as in exits the gate. The should be approximately the same. With many autothreaders, you cannot see those loops. They are automatically set during the auto-threading process, but the lower one in particular may change during operation of something is amiss in the operation of the projector. Most autot-hreaders have covers over the film path and it is not possible to see the lower loop in particular. You may need to remove a cover and run the machine and watch the lower loop when the picture starts getting funky. You'll notice the lower loop has gotten smaller and the film will not be moving smoothly through the loop.

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Bill Vendasi
Film Handler

Posts: 45
From: Dover, NH, USA
Registered: Apr 2015

posted April 21, 2015 06:41 PM

Ok, so how do you fix that issue when it happens .. rewind and start over again?

Thanks

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Barry Fritz
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1061
From: Burnsville, MN, USA
Registered: Dec 2009

posted April 21, 2015 08:20 PM

If you have access to the loop by removing the cover, and the machine is still running, you can put you finger in the loop and press downward to increase the size. That will usually work but there is a risk of ripping out a sprocket. Before we go any further, see if you can recreate the problem and see if it is indeed the loop.

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Janice Glesser
Film Goddess

Posts: 3468
From: Sunnyvale, CA USA
Registered: Sep 2011

posted April 21, 2015 08:45 PM

If the image starts jumping because it has lost a loop...try pressing the loop restorer button to see if that helps. It's marked F for Forward and R for reverse. If the picture is jumping for some other reason such as the claw being misaligned then the loop restorer won't help.

When transferring film...any interruption is frustrating and time-consuming. It also adds to the amount of post editing you will have to do on your computer.

--------------------
Janice

"I'm having a very good day!"
Richard Dreyfuss - Let It Ride (1989).

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Bill Vendasi
Film Handler

Posts: 45
From: Dover, NH, USA
Registered: Apr 2015

posted April 21, 2015 08:49 PM

Thanks,

That's what I've done a couple of times already so I guess I'm on the right track.

There were a couple of Reg 8 films I ran that didn't jump at all.
I'll just have to take them one at a time and see how far I get.

I'll be working with this again over the weekend and I'll post my results.

Thanks again, Barry.

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John Capazzo
Master Film Handler

Posts: 421
From: Hillside, NJ USA
Registered: Jan 2004

posted April 21, 2015 08:53 PM

If the machine has been sitting for years, the belt could be the culprit of a few problems. Remove the back cover and check for alot of play. The upper belt is probably a spring type belt and the motor belt is rubber. The upper belts on Chinon machines last indefinitely; the motor belts stretch and losses their elasticity over time.

--------------------
"the image is about 30 feet ahead of us."

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Barry Fritz
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1061
From: Burnsville, MN, USA
Registered: Dec 2009

posted April 21, 2015 10:06 PM

Cool. Didn't know it had a loop restorer. : [Big Grin]