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Author
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Topic: Star Wars (Derann)
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Ernie Zahn
Jedi Master Film Handler
Posts: 540
From: Greenwich, CT, USA
Registered: Oct 2004
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posted October 28, 2013 09:18 AM
Thanks to Ron Douglas, I now have this fine print! He sold it to me in fantastic shape too!
Osi did a review of the Cinevision version, but I didn't see one about the Derann version in the index of reviews.
I typically don't write reviews of the film itself and focus, rather, on the specific print release. If you don't know what Star Wars is then I suggest you get the DVD before the more serious investment of a film print. That goes for most movies. I have movies that I enjoy, but it's only movies that I love, that I keep as S8 prints. Just a suggestion! Collect whichever way you like!
On to the review.
The packaging is pretty standard for Derann releases, particularly later ones. White boxes. The first box has cover art, though strangely enough, it's the artwork from Return of the Jedi, despite this being the first film. Really solid white reels. It's mounted on 4x600 ft reels.
This is my first Derann print and I'm pleased at how generous the leader and tails are. Usually when I load a film it takes several feet for it to catch and for some prints, it's already rolling when I switch it forward. Not the case here. I also noticed, what one member pointed out, that the beginning and end of each reel has a nice little audio and visual fade.
It's scope of course. The print is very sharp, which is no surprise since this was struck from a negative. The color is very nice and the print is very clean. Only a couple splices from the negative that I could see. The grain is really hard to detect in certain shots. Reel 3 on the Death Star is particularly clean. The only strange thing I noticed was that for the first 25 feet or so the contrast would get really strong then return to normal. Almost like a breathing effect. It passed after a short time and it looked great after that. It almost looks like it was in the chemical bath for a little longer at one part of a reel. This is pretty negligible though. he other visual note is that unlike the Cinevision print, this is slightly cropped. Some shots with Grand Moff Tarkin (Peter Cushing) are a bit cropped. Personally, it didn't bother me but if you want a purer form then the Cinevision is right for you.
The sound is brilliant. I ran this through my Yamaha RX-V373 with Dolby Pro Logic II. Really great experience. This is a Stereo print though I don't have a projector with proper stereo separation.
I wish this wasn't out of print, it's a must have for many Star Wars collectors. Super 8 or otherwise. For some die hard fans of Star Wars it would even be worth it to buy a projector just to own and run this film through it.
This is particularly valuable since Lucas made this point about the original release VS the special edition:
quote:
There will only be one [version of the films]. And it won't be what I would call the "rough cut", it'll be the "final cut". The other one will be some sort of interesting artifact that people will look at and say, "There was an earlier draft of this." The same thing happens with plays and earlier drafts of books. In essence, films never get finished, they get abandoned. At some point, you're dragged off the picture kicking and screaming while somebody says, "Okay, it's done." That isn't really the way it should work. Occasionally, [you can] go back and get your cut of the video out there, which I did on both American Graffiti and THX 1138; that's the place where it will live forever. So what ends up being important in my mind is what the DVD version is going to look like, because that's what everybody is going to remember. The other versions will disappear. Even the 35 million tapes of Star Wars out there won't last more than 30 or 40 years. A hundred years from now, the only version of the movie that anyone will remember will be the DVD version [of the Special Edition], and you'll be able to project it on a 20-foot-by-40-foot screen with perfect quality. I think it's the director's prerogative, not the studio's, to go back and reinvent a movie.
To all you collectors out there, I'd say take good care of this "artifact." If you'd had your run with it, then take care of it when you sell it to the next collector. Right now there are very few ways to watch this release.
1. The lesser formats: Laserdisc, VHS, videodisc, betamax. These formats don't come close to the same quality and most of them are pan and scan or simply letterbox and not true anamorphic.
2. DVD: A DVD was released of the theatrical cut but there is a lot of criticism about it. Mainly it was a rush job. The image is washed out, the color correction is off, wayy off. And there are a host of other issues with the quality. Also these too are not anamorphic but 4:3 letterbox like the laserdisc and VHS.
Lucasfilm released a statement [paraphrasing] saying that the '97 special editions were achieved by making permanent changes to the original negative. Therefore the DVD is an approximation of the theatrical cut. Not a fully restored edition. Derann's negative was destroyed per licensing agreements (at least that's what I've been told). So, these Derann and Cinevision prints are pretty crucial. With the exception of 35mm release prints floating out there, these are the last best methods to watch a great quality version of the Star Wars (pre-special edition) version.
To top it off, now that Disney owns Star Wars, you'd think that might be a chance to release the theatrical version? Sadly no. They have legal rights for subsequent Star Wars films, not the original ones. 20th Century holds distribution rights till 2020 and the 1977 film is permanently held by 20th Century. Here's an article about it.
These prints are the closest to theater quality we might ever have. On that note, I mentioned this in another thread. I do have the lossless version of the original 6 channel audio from the 70mm print. If someone is skilled enough they could re-record with the 70mm audio. It won't retain the 6 channels but it's a different mix and any good engineer will tell you that starting from the best source will always yield better results - no matter what medium the product is delivered on.
Osi and others, I will work to getting this to you guys soon! I was thinking of sending this off to Steve O too. As I recall he offers stereo re-records.
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Check out the trailer for my feature length Spaghetti-style Western:
Six and Bisti
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Bill Brandenstein
Phenomenal Film Handler
Posts: 1632
From: California
Registered: Aug 2007
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posted June 06, 2018 04:02 PM
OK, those of you with Derann "Star Wars" prints, some technical observations would be helpful. I'm trying to work an audio edit out for a friend for his print. My audio source is the Blu-ray in full 5.1, which I've already done quite a bit of editing on to de-specialize the audio back to the older form, at least so far as timings go. This is the first time I've handled a feature print of "Star Wars."
Unlike Ernie's print, my friend's print has no fades at the heads or tails of reels; there are also no shifts of contrast, which is great news. Except for a too-brief "Fox" logo at the start, and an annoying "U.K. Distributors" logo at the end (bright oranges & reds after those dim blue credits is quite jarring), this otherwise seems to be every frame of an unaltered theatrical print. Since it's on 1989 LPP stock, I wonder if that means it would be considered a "later" print, and perhaps that means it might be from a second, later negative as well? If so, my eventual sound edit might not fit all Derann prints.
The sound is only fair in quality, and sync is awful. More than half of the feature is off by 2 or more frames, owing to mismatches where the negative material had to be spliced. Has anyone else ever seen this? It was fun to crank it up loud, but the poor quality of the stereo track hardly works for Dolby Pro Logic, it's really fat around 200Hz, has no significant low bass, and rolls off going up into the treble range where it completely ends at 8Khz. Not much dynamic range either, which was obviously run through a compressor-limiter. The old VHS Hi-fi tracks sound profoundly better.
My goal is to take the top-quality Blu-Ray audio and conform it to this print in 5.1, from which a stereo folddown is also easily created. Re-records and double-system sound would then be possible. However, I have to correct all of Derann's sync errors first.
So if you have a Star Wars print and would care to contribute, please tell us:
1) What stock your print is on, and if LPP, the date code;
2) Are there fades at reel starts/ends or not;
3) If there are sync errors in the sound. The print I'm working with is glaringly bad in much of reel 2, and lesser errors in portions of the other 3 reels.
Thank you in advance!
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Tom Photiou
Film God
Posts: 4837
From: Plymouth U.K
Registered: Dec 2003
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posted June 08, 2018 04:30 PM
We have a stereo copy of this film, it is due for a screening soon so as soon as my Brother brings it up i will check the film stock if i remember. I can only add this,
This title had a number a print runs, if you were lucky to get an early copy you will almost certainly have one of the better ones, there were a lot of copies of this title sold by Derann. We are more than happy with the print we have but i would only describe it as a good print, nothing special at all. Colours are good, the image in some places, is rather grainy, the sound is also good, again nothing special. The obvious attraction is clearly the fact that it is the original 1977 cut, pre CGI trash.
Ours does not have any sound defects or sync problems. I do recall a number of odd parts sold as White box specials on a number of lists, they popped up frequently as well as good odd parts. we were extremely lucky with our feature, we purchased a second hand copy advertised on an old Derann sales list. when we got it we were horrified at the awful quality of three of the reels, i sent it back for the attention of Derek Simmons and within a week he sent a brand new sealed copy to us at no extra charge with a lovely letter apologising for the inconvenience. He explained that he suspected the one they sold us from the sales list was indeed, probably made up of odd parts sold separately. we were only expecting a refund not a brand new print. This was the sort of service Derann offered more than once.
Overall, it is a good scope print, rated as A-/B with the sound being B+/A-
For top notch prints i go with the fog, T2 or grease to name a few. The image on these knocks spots off the Star wars prints. ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
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Osi Osgood
Film God
Posts: 10204
From: Mountian Home, ID.
Registered: Jul 2005
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posted June 09, 2018 11:24 AM
Great insights Tom. "The Fog" is a very good scope print!
I really lucked out on my STAR WARS print. I bought mine, many years ago, from Paul Foster, who personally picked it up on the very first day of it's being available, and David Prowse (Darth Vader) was there to sign the box, (in silver ink). Now, I have no idea as to what number the print was, and how many were sold that first day, but it's bound to be fairly early in the run. ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
However, I did replace reel four of the feature with another copy of reel four. I wish I hadn't done that! ![[Frown]](frown.gif)
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"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "
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Bill Brandenstein
Phenomenal Film Handler
Posts: 1632
From: California
Registered: Aug 2007
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posted June 11, 2018 09:07 PM
Thanks for the comments and descriptions, guys, and please keep adding on!
The print I'm working with is clearly "matched" on all reels with a 1989 date code and identical look. It's A- visually, meaning the black level and sharpness could be a touch better, but overall very respectable. I'm sure it was printed from a 16mm negative on a reduction machine as the sharpest Super 8 prints typically were.
The sound is a wonder, though. Reel 1 is fine all the way. Reel 2, by contrast, starts sound ahead by about 3 frames, at the 10-minute negative splice is perfect for 3 minutes, then starts to shift ahead so that the final scenes of the reel have sound about a half second early! Reels 3 and 4 are also mostly off by a few frames.
[ June 16, 2018, 10:40 AM: Message edited by: Bill Brandenstein ]
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