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Author
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Topic: Choosing a Video Projector
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Rob Young.
Phenomenal Film Handler
Posts: 1633
From: Cheshire, U.K.
Registered: Dec 2003
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posted November 06, 2009 03:00 PM
Mark, with the greatest respect, I simply cannot agree.
For example, it is irrelevent how many pixels you have on LCD if one or more of them fails, especially common on cheaper machines, then you just have a persistent blemish on the image...check CAREFULLY before buying. Let's not even get into "dust ingression".
Contrast ratios aside (which means very little), most VP's (especially LCD) will NOT produce anything like decent black levels. This is so important if you want to use them for watching movies.
And as for DVD "blowing away 16mm"? Again, I don't want to get into a row here, but there are so many variables...
With the best print, equipment etc, 16mm will simply dump on DVD. Now this isn't to say that you can't get really good results with DVD, but there are so many factors to consider...
Blu-ray / HD is different...own set of problems and advantages.
Can I just say that this is a great discussion and I don't want to upset anyone...quite the opposite...it's great that we can discuss all this so openly.
I'm sure I'll have some disagreement with my views and be glad to continue... ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
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John Hermes
Expert Film Handler
Posts: 139
From: La Mesa, CA, USA
Registered: Nov 2008
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posted November 06, 2009 03:45 PM
I prefer DLP myself, as I think it looks more "filmlike", after coming over from LCD. I started out with Super 8 film, then to 16mm, then to 35mm, so I have seen a lot of film over the years. My DLP projector has a 6x wheel and have shown DVDs, HD DVDs, and Blu-ray to at least 30 people and no one has ever complained of headaches or other problems. A 6x wheel does cut rainbows way down compared to a 4x. I essentially never see them anymore.
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John Hermes
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Mark Todd
Film God
Posts: 3846
From: UK
Registered: Aug 2003
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posted November 06, 2009 04:36 PM
Hi Rob well maybe I am just lucky with my Philips as it easily blows much 16mm away in the home, and for quite a few reasons.
Also you can actually sit nearer too it and still have great focus etc so can have a larger big screen experiance.
Many of the Office based VP,s now are very well geared towards DVD projection and do a superb job.
On my XGA no screen door at all on a 5-6 feet wide picture sitting 6-10 feet away, and an awesome picture.
These machines and the like are a superb easy way in to the dvd projecting and watching side of things.
I paid £65 delivered for mine with only a few hours watched and have now racked up around 550 hrs myself, though around £125/150 delivered for one as good as that is more the mark.
The chap who sold me mine was into AV and was interested in my cine hobby so wanted to know my thoughts on the B,Sure from the cine point of view so actually sent it to me free, waited to hear my review ( SUPERB !!!!!! ) and then said £65 posted. Very kind and the best £65 I ever spent on the big screen.
Also get a nice budget machine to sneak in to VP, and you then have a handy cheap back up machine once you dive full in or a great one for the kids cartoons etc.
Disney on my VP for instance is awesome but the philips is a great performer.
I have to dissagree reagrding 16mm, good VP beats it and Blu Ray projected 1080p is like 35mm in the home I hear, well I ahve been told its better really.
Best Mark.
PS I love my super 8 films, but VP is another thing in itself.
PPS just seen your post Steve on my VP I`ve never seen smear or even jaggies, well not noticed any, I can`t even see edge enhancement though its maybe there sometimes. I think its all down to hitting lucky with a right on but still super affordable machine.
Epson 4/3 office jobs are often very cheap 2nd hand and look good. I mentioned the philips like mine as its got such a good long zoom.
The epson I might go for for 720p in the UK would be the TW680, a lovely looking machine and I believe 3 years cover including the lamp in the UK.
Anyone can knock this and that on various VP`s, but just get one, bung it on and sit back and enjoy the films up there and you won`t ever look back Steve or anyone.
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Rob Young.
Phenomenal Film Handler
Posts: 1633
From: Cheshire, U.K.
Registered: Dec 2003
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posted November 07, 2009 04:51 AM
Hi Mark, I'm glad that in the case of your projector you got yourself a gud 'un!
All I'm trying to point out is that there are a lot of potential pit-falls with VP's to watch out for before comitting any level of hard-earned cash; for all the good ones out there, there are plenty of "duffers".
As for 16mm vs. DVD, lets leave that old chesnut; we'll have to agree to differ and the more time spent discussing it leaves less time for actually watching movies ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif) .
Steve, smear isn't an issue on LCD projectors, but the inherent lag of liquid crystal technology (and this includes my beloved LCOS) can produce slightly undesirable effects on fast moving objects. Now this is being HYPER critical and isn't REALLY a problem, but it does exist and all I'm saying is that DLP performs better in this respect, but, in it's single chip form has other issues...nothings perfect ![[Razz]](tongue.gif) . Maybe best not to worry about it...
For me, 3 chip DLP would be the dream because of all the technologies it really, really works the best...but of course it is just far too expensive and unrealistic to consider.
As for really expensive VP's eroding the notion of cheap media, well I don't know...true the discs are relatively cheap, but then most people I guess are taking advantage of the improved quality on TV screens, not VPs, so once you enter the VP market it's a whole different ball game.
You've got to ask yourself what sort of big screen TV you could get yourself these days for £500-£1000. I think you could get a darn good one and (oh dear, I'm gonna be all controvertial here again ) one that picture quality wise, would be far better than a VP at the same cost...albeit with a smaller image.
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Paul Adsett
Film God
Posts: 5003
From: USA
Registered: Jun 2003
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posted November 11, 2009 11:47 AM
Hi Chris,
The LED sets are getting very good reviews here in the US. The main advantages of LED over LCD are better contrast, much lower power consumption, and 20,000 plus hour lamp life. LED TV sets are also extremely thin, only 1.0 ins thick. LED home projectors are just around the corner. Imagine that, no need to ever have to replace a $400.00 lamp!
Also in the works are home projectors using laser light sources.
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The best of all worlds- 8mm, super 8mm, 9.5mm, and HD Digital Projection,
Elmo GS1200 f1.0 2-blade
Eumig S938 Stereo f1.0 Ektar
Panasonic PT-AE4000U digital pj
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Rob Young.
Phenomenal Film Handler
Posts: 1633
From: Cheshire, U.K.
Registered: Dec 2003
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posted November 13, 2009 02:14 AM
The first "domestic" DLP video projector to use LED as a light source, and now available, is the Vivitek H9080FD. Sadly, the cost is £11.000 ![[Eek!]](eek.gif) !
Also, light output is rather poor at 800 lumens. The big advantage is no rainbow from it's single chip DLP because it doesn't use a colour wheel. Although the price rather negates that advantage at the moment. Expected life is 20,000 hours.
LCD TVs that uses the full-array LED system do offer much better black level than previous LCD displays. Some sets use edge-lighting LED however and are still advertised under the banner LED. These do not offer the same improvement as full-array displays.
OLED (organic LED) was seen as the potential future of TV, with better imagery than LCD or Plasma. Sony managed to get the XEL-1 11 inch display produced but at a ridiculous price. It did, however, show the potential of the format...then the credit crunch hit and development of new TV technology took a back seat.
It seems that now both Samsung and LG are interested in developing OLED again, with LG set to introduce a 15 inch monitor and Samsung potentially investing massively in the production of screens 30 inches and upwards.
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Richard C Patchett
Master Film Handler
Posts: 424
From: Flint Mi 48506
Registered: Dec 2007
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posted November 13, 2009 11:19 AM
Greetings
I have 2 of theses for the wife's Business for her presentation
Great LCD for the money
I can get you a deal on one of these new They list for retail $995.00 US funds
Forum members price $800.00 Plus Mailing
Contact me at patchetts@ameritech.net
Or if you see something else
EIKI LC-XA20 3LCD Projector Information
Manufacturer EIKI
Manufacturer Part # LC-XA20
MSRP $995.00
Production Status Shipping
Release Date NOV 2006
EIKI LC-XA20 3LCD Projector Specifications
General Aspect Ratio 4:3 (Native), 5:4, 16:9
Brightness (ANSI Lumens) 2000 ANSI Lumens
Contrast Ratio 400:1
Display Type 0.6" Polysilicon LCD x 3
Resolution (Native / Max) XGA (1024 x 768)
UXGA (1600 x 1200)
Video Compatibility NTSC, PAL, SECAM, NTSC 4.43, PAL-M, PAL-N, HDTV (480i/p, 575i/p, 720p, 1035i, 1080i)
Projection Lens F = 1.7
f = 20.06mm
Number of Colors 16.7 Million Colors
Size Dimensions (WxHxD) 3.15in. x 13.00in. x 9.33in.
(8cm x 33.02cm x 23.7cm)
Weight 6.4 lbs. (2.9 kg)
Connectivity Inputs 1 x D-Sub 15 Pin
1 x Composite RCA
1 x Ministereo
1 x Audio RCA (L/R)
Control 1 x RS232
Operation Power Supply 100 ~ 240 V / 50 ~ 60 Hz
Power Consumption 250W (Standard)
205W (ECO)
Approvals UL, cUL, IEC
Audible Noise 25 dB
Operating Temperature 41°F ~ 95°F (5°C ~ 35°C)
Projection Lens Lamp Type 200W UHP
Lamp Life 3000 hrs
Projection Mode Front, Rear, Ceiling
Projection Screen Size (Diagonal) 40in. ~ 300in. (101.6cm ~ 762cm)
Throw Distance 4.27ft. ~ 32.48ft. (1.3m ~ 9.9m)
Throw Ratio 1.62:1
Vertical Keystone Correction +/- 20 Degrees
Brightness Uniformity 85%
Other Dot Clock 140 MHz
H-Sync Range 15 ~ 100 kHz
V-Sync Range 50 ~ 100 Hz
In The Box Items Quick Start Guide
Owner's Manual on CD-ROM
AC Power Cord
VGA type Computer Input Cable (HD15 ~ HD15)
Wireless Remote Control & Batteries (AA x 2)
Warranty Projector 3 Year Warranty
Lamp 90 Day Warranty
EIKI LC-XA20 3LCD Projector Accessories
Description MfPN MSRP
0183-5004 Case 0183-5004 $49.00
__________________
Richard C Patchett
RC's Classic Collections On 16mm
Parts & Service Forum members price $800.00 Plus Mailing
Something often misunderstood for video projectors is the relation of the distance of the screen from the projector and the width horizontal of the screen. 16mm film proctors using a 2-inch lens have a picture width of 4'-8" at the screen. With a 1-inch lens the screen image is 9'-4". A video projector having a throw ratio of 1.62 will be at 75-inches from the screen with 120-inch width. You might want to consider if this is acceptable for your outdoor movie showings. If you like your equipment further from the screen the projector may need to have more lumens and a variable focal length lens (throw ratio) for best screen image in your situation.
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RC’s Classic Collection
16 mm Parts & Service
Elmo, Eiki, Bell & Howell +
http://www.rcsclassic16mm.com/
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Steve Klare
Film Guy
Posts: 7016
From: Long Island, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003
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posted November 17, 2009 05:34 PM
I thought you'd like to know I've made a decision here:
Epson, Panasonic, Epson, Panasonic, Epson, Panasonic...
and the Winner is:
ELMO (ST-1200HD)
(Old dogs, new tricks, I guess!)
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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...
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