8mm Forum: Anastasia 1997 on super 8

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Posted by Jeroen van Ooijen (Member # 1104) on January 07, 2010, 05:50 AM:

Hello everybody,how is it possible that such a great movie as Anastasia never released on super 8.
Does anyone know who i can mail for this release,i want this one so badly.
Why is it so difficult release this one? [Big Grin]

Jeroen

Posted by Osi Osgood (Member # 424) on January 07, 2010, 08:39 AM:

I agree! I'd love to see this released on Super 8 scope, and since it is a shorter film, it would easily fit onto a 3X600ft reel set-up!

See if those, with German Super 8 connections, know if this was released or if it will be!

I liked this film! This film proved that Don Bluth still had it as an animation director, and the love story was actually more touching than many I've seen in live action. Great story and very winning songs!

Posted by Jeroen van Ooijen (Member # 1104) on January 07, 2010, 09:33 AM:

You're right Osi,this is a real classic a great story,beautiful music and loveley characters.
Maby we must sign a petition or something else!
It would be great and a big wish to have this one on super8.
Is there someone that can make those prints is the question! [Big Grin]

Posted by Adrian Winchester (Member # 248) on January 07, 2010, 11:37 AM:

It won't be much consolation but I'm almost certain that the trailer was released on Super 8 - can anyone confirm this?

Posted by Gian Luca Mario Loncrini (Member # 1417) on January 07, 2010, 11:44 AM:

It was indeed, Winbert.
Issued by Derann, now discontinued [Frown]

.

Jeroen, I suppose the reason why this great cartoon has never been released in super 8 is the poor number of collectors interested in it (the same thing is happening with CARS).

Your idea about a petition is good, at least to know how many people could find the idea interesting. But I suppose it would be quite hard.

Posted by Gian Luca Mario Loncrini (Member # 1417) on January 07, 2010, 11:45 AM:

It was indeed, Winbert.
Issued by Derann, now discontinued [Frown]

Posted by Jeroen van Ooijen (Member # 1104) on January 07, 2010, 12:22 PM:

I have write CHC maby it helps,what else can we do!
also for cars i hope there is a release someday,i don't like cars but if i must sign for the collectors i will do it.
Is there anyone on the forum that can make prints? [Wink]

Posted by Jeroen van Ooijen (Member # 1104) on January 08, 2010, 08:29 AM:

The answer was:

THERE IS NO POSSIBILITY FOR S8 RELEASE WE MUST MAKE 100 COPIES AND THESE WILL NOT SELL. PLEASE ASK YOUR FRIENDS TO TELL US WHAT THEY WANT TO SEE AND WE WILL CONSIDERPS CHC

So wishes! [Big Grin]

Posted by Chip Gelmini (Member # 44) on January 08, 2010, 03:48 PM:

I know this is besides the point but I must recommend video projection. It clearly solves this kind of problem.

While I will ALWAYS be a super 8 film projectionist and collector - the ONLY way to solve the dilemma of your favorite films on super 8 - is to go this route.

If you can take the plunge, and spend for a video projector what would cost 2 super 8 features - then simply add the DVD player to your sound system....and I do not have to tell you what the titles will then cost and OH how many there are to select from as well as the ease of picking the movie up in your hands.

I have Anastasia on DVD for projection and it is brilliant.

Let me tell you that adding a video projector does NOT take away from the passion of super 8. It INCREASES IT. When I added mine, it reignited the spark that I had for wanting to spend time in my home cinema.

And for those of you who ask "why would the spark be put out?" - all I can say was I, like you, was wanting many titles on super 8 that have never been available. And they still aren't on super 8.

Well friends this changes everything if you take the VP plunge!

I do not know if I will go Blue Ray. I am consdering it and I have one of my best friends who is very knowledgeable on this format in general helping me decide. The main reason being it might not work in my setup given the fact I am pushing the footage throw and I am limited to 1:85 or 16 x 9 projection based on the throw distance and the lens of the Panny AX200U.

Currently I use standard DVD running S Video to the projector and it is a beautiful bright sharp image.

So please. Keep your super 8 ignited. But do also take the plunge for Video Projection.

You will NOT regret this.

-cg-

Posted by John Clancy (Member # 49) on January 09, 2010, 03:58 AM:

In case you've all missed it, Film Lab North was shut down a few months ago. So unless Derann can source a new lab that is affordable that's the end of new releases.

Now if anyone does know of any labs in the world capable of producing Super 8 prints (besides Andec who will be too expensive given the current exchange rate) please let me know or contact Derann directly.

Osi, was it you who was trying to get a 16mm reel of adverts printed on Super 8 in the USA?

Posted by Winbert Hutahaean (Member # 58) on January 09, 2010, 07:06 AM:

Hi John,

What is the Germany lab that we always discuss (which printed "Once upon the time" recently). Was that Andec too or another Lab?

And where CHC print their films?

ps: I heard that a Hong Kong lab can print super 8mm (for their toys projector)

rgds,

Posted by Gian Luca Mario Loncrini (Member # 1417) on January 09, 2010, 09:27 AM:

quote:
THERE IS NO POSSIBILITY FOR S8 RELEASE WE MUST MAKE 100 COPIES AND THESE WILL NOT SELL

100 ?????????????????????????????

Andec in the answer for both your questions, Winbert.
John, contact Guido Melis at

driveapples (at) dada (dot) it

He could have a couple of ideas [Wink]

Posted by Fabrizio Mosca (Member # 142) on January 09, 2010, 10:57 AM:

John, I think that Movie&Sound in Firenze has the machines to develop and print in super8.
Maybe it's one of the ideas that Gian suggested.

Posted by Gian Luca Mario Loncrini (Member # 1417) on January 09, 2010, 11:16 AM:

Hello Fabrizio, how are you? It was, indeed. But being not sure if they would do it, I suggested to contact Guido, living in Florence. Fingers crossed [Confused]

.
Ciao!

Posted by Jeroen van Ooijen (Member # 1104) on January 09, 2010, 01:01 PM:

O wowie,i hope so,fingers crossed for sure.
Gian do you know the quality of this movies?

[Razz]

Posted by Graham Sinden (Member # 431) on January 09, 2010, 01:03 PM:

quote:
WE MUST MAKE 100 COPIES AND THESE WILL NOT SELL

I actually thought CHC could print to order almost, just printing a few copies at a time if one customer ordered it. Obviously im talking about cases where the Super 8 negative has already been made and mabye Phil is referring to new films and the cost of taking it down from 35mm to S8 and he needs to make 100 copies to make it worthwhile.

Graham S

Posted by Gian Luca Mario Loncrini (Member # 1417) on January 09, 2010, 02:50 PM:

Hi Graham.

I did not mean to question Jeroen's quote.
But the very last time I contacted Mr. Ludwig (ANDEC) I'm quite sure I was told 20 orders would be enough to bear the cost for a new negative.

Let's suppose the final cost of the full feature would be 500 euro (more or less the price for a brand new movie supplied by CHC).

500x100 = 50.000 Euro. This would be £ 44958,2253 or $ 72025,3529.

I personally think there's something weird in Phil's answer to Jeroen.
But Jeroen has probably misunderstood [Wink]

. Or maybe I did.
Ciao.

[ January 09, 2010, 04:05 PM: Message edited by: Gian Luca Mario Loncrini ]

Posted by Jeroen van Ooijen (Member # 1104) on January 09, 2010, 05:05 PM:

Hellooooooow,i haved copied his replay that he send to me!
this was exactly what he say to me! [Frown]

Posted by Gian Luca Mario Loncrini (Member # 1417) on January 09, 2010, 05:23 PM:

[Wink]

So it was probably me who misunderstood, Jeroen [Wink]

......... And £ 44958,2253 for a new release means no new releases. Am I wrong?

Posted by Graham Sinden (Member # 431) on January 09, 2010, 05:46 PM:

Thanks Gian,

I know that Derann can just print a few copies at a time, particularly on shorts. I know this because I recently (last year) had 2 pathe pictorials printed as they didnt have any in stock. I think they order around 5 copies of each title.

But again like I said before, the negatives had already been done and it is just a simple job of making a copy. I think all the titles in Derann's catalogue have their negative made already so this is just a simple job to make a few more copies.

But making a new super 8 negaive from scratch is a very costly process and therefore the order numbers will change. Only Derann and CHC know the true costings of whats involved and how to get the best deal.

Funny thing about Phil is that he keeps telling me that super 8 dosent sell and there's no demand but then he brings out a title like 'The Magic Umbrella'. Surely he's not telling me that he has had a very high demand and pre orders for this animation which I (and probably most other collectors) have never heard of before! He also keeps asking for suggestions but how many titles does he bring out from those suggestions. At the end of the day Phil brings out what he wants and what he can get his hands on easily.

Graham S

Posted by Keith Ashfield (Member # 741) on January 09, 2010, 05:49 PM:

Gian - don't forget that the price of 500 Euros / £471.00 that you used in your formula was the "selling price" and not the "cost price". The cost price of printing the film would be less than 500 Euros. How much less, would depend on the dealers "profit margins".

Assuming a hypothetical profit margin of 33%, that would make the "cost" price around 330 Euros / £310.00 - you are still looking at an outlay of 33,000 Euro / £31,000. Also, would that price include the sound recording, or would that be an "extra" outlay?

It's not hard to see why "dealers" are reluctant to venture into the "NEW" feature market without "guaranteed sales".

There is nothing wrong with "dreaming of winning the lottery" is there?

Posted by Gian Luca Mario Loncrini (Member # 1417) on January 09, 2010, 06:00 PM:

quote:
At the end of the day Phil brings out what he wants and what he can get his hands on easily.

No doubt.
I simply wonder if we would ever see new titles released.

quote:
Gian - don't forget that the price of 500 Euros / £471.00 that you used in your formula was the "selling price" and not the "cost price".

Keith, you are definitely right. But each time I've had the possibility to discuss with collectors and/or dealers about new 8mm releases, the only data taken into consideration was THE SELLING PRICE.

e.g.: 'If we sell 20 copies, we can afford the cost for the negative'. That's why I used that formula.
Graham is right: we would never probably know anything about real 'extra' costs. But, once again, considering all seems depending on HOW MANY COPIES WILL 'WE' BE ABLE TO SELL TO BEAR THE COST, I had no other choices to weigh up pros and cons. [Wink]

I am the first one dreaming about new releases, guys. I do hope you won't misunderstand me.

Posted by Graham Sinden (Member # 431) on January 09, 2010, 06:13 PM:

What we really need is to tell these mega rich billionaires to stop buying english football clubs and instead invest money in Derann and CHC [Big Grin]

Graham S

Posted by Gian Luca Mario Loncrini (Member # 1417) on January 09, 2010, 06:19 PM:

My name will be on the top of the petition, Graham! That's for sure!

Posted by Jeroen van Ooijen (Member # 1104) on January 09, 2010, 06:22 PM:

me2 [Wink]

Posted by Keith Ashfield (Member # 741) on January 09, 2010, 06:49 PM:

Gian

quote:
each time I've had the possibility to discuss with someone about new 8mm releases, the only data taken into consideration was THE SELLING PRICE.

Is the "price" they are talking about the "printing labs selling price", or the "dealers selling price", in order to recover the negative costs?

Posted by Gian Luca Mario Loncrini (Member # 1417) on January 09, 2010, 06:51 PM:

Dealers selling price, Keith. I now feel like to have a cup of hot milk. I'll be back later [Big Grin]

Posted by John Clancy (Member # 49) on January 10, 2010, 04:49 AM:

The cost of producing Super 8 in the UK was less than producing the same in Germany. This is largely because of the exchange rate but I believe the UK rates were lower in the first case too.

So what we probably need to find is a lab in the USA, Switzerland, UK or some other independent nation, perhaps even the Far East.

I don't know what has happened to all the existing negatives but hopefully they are all safe and can be passed to a new lab if ever required. In the meantime just be thankful Classic are able to get the odd new release produced in Germany and support them as much as possible. Likewise once Derann get up and running again. And if there is anything on Derann's back catalogue you've been thinking about get in quick as they may have the print you want on the shelf.

Posted by Graham Sinden (Member # 431) on January 10, 2010, 05:26 AM:

John,
silly question but wouldnt Derann OWN all the super 8 negatives held at film lab north. If so surely the negatives will be sent back to them, or Derann may collect them personally.

Hopefully Derann already have a new lab in place and will announce it soon.

Graham S

Posted by Jeroen van Ooijen (Member # 1104) on January 10, 2010, 07:48 AM:

Over Anastasia [Wink]

yesterday someone sends me an mail that he knows someone with an 35mm print of Anastasia,i don't know of it helps,i don't know what to do,i have no intelligence of these things [Frown]

Posted by Gian Luca Mario Loncrini (Member # 1417) on January 10, 2010, 08:08 AM:

quote:
I don't know what has happened to all the existing negatives but hopefully they are all safe and can be passed to a new lab if ever required.

quote:
Hopefully Derann already have a new lab in place and will announce it soon.

John, Graham,
I know for sure all Derann's negatives are safe. And I'm also sure they have no laboratory in place [Frown]

Posted by Osi Osgood (Member # 424) on January 10, 2010, 02:22 PM:

John ...

Yes, I'm the one trying to get a 400ft reels worth of animated adverts out on Super 8. The tragedy of it was that the damned package got lost in transit from Idaho to California, and I personally blame myself for it getting lost. Me and my cheap shipping! I tell you, this time when I do this, I will ship by the best, reliable shipping in the world!

I am now currently readying a second collection of animated Tv commercials! Fortunately, I had duplicate copies of most (not all) of the commercials I wanted to copy, and most of them are of the same quality (color/condition) as the first bunch. I made sure that I bought multiples for just such an occasion. That and the wear and tear on one collection would leave the other for my private archives.

The curious thing is that the film lab equipment DOES EXIST! It's all over the place in america. Its just this equipment getting in the right, knowledgable hands, (Larry Arpin, for instance who, as we all know, has released his own theatrical trailer reels in the past!).

The only morte difficult part is coming up with ...

1. The raw stock: Personally, (if I had the funds) I would buy up an enormous quantity of it, as it could, of course, go into cold storage for years if necessary, for future releases.

2. Striping facilities: This equipment is available from many sources. It's just getting into the right, super 8 loving hands. While we have one quite capable company in the UK (I Believe), it would be best to have another in the US as well.

It's certianly a capable dream to come forth with, and I haven't died to it as well.

I will say, however, that time IS running out, and those who truly wish to see this hobby continue with brand new releases need to get off they're collective backsides and put they're money where they're mouth is, (hey, I was willing to shell out a thousand out of my own savings just to see this reel become a reality, knowing full well that most who say that they'd buy one would probably vanish, and I haven't worked in over a year! Can anybody else on this forum claim that dedication?)

I'm not meaning to sound harsh, but talk is cheap, (yep, even mine!). It's time for action.

Oh ... lastly, occasionally, Phil does use outside ideas. His release of the "Yellow Submarine" extra long trailer was at the giving of our own Dino Everette sending him the 35MM trailer in question.

Posted by John Clancy (Member # 49) on January 11, 2010, 03:31 AM:

Osi, perhaps you could pass the details of the lab in California to Derann as it could be a lifeline.

Good news that you have duplicates of most of those adverts Osi.

Posted by Adrian Winchester (Member # 248) on February 19, 2010, 09:41 PM:

On the subject of 'Anastasia', anyone that collects 16mm might be pleased to hear that I've just seen that Robbie's Reels still have new scope prints of the trailer available for the 'sale' price of only $18.99.

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