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Posted by Gary Brocklehurst (Member # 606) on June 25, 2009, 09:51 AM:
 
Our website has been updated today

www.derann.co.uk

Thank you
 

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Posted by Flavio Stabile (Member # 357) on June 30, 2009, 01:51 PM:
 
Hi Gary!

Sorry to say that since months so far, the shipping costs outside UK, in my opinion, have become prohibitive!

I ask you here to review your position to ship ONLY via UPS and consider to ship AGAIN (as you did in the past) also using Signed Royal Air Mail.

Kindest Regards
Flavio

[ June 30, 2009, 03:27 PM: Message edited by: Flavio Stabile ]
 

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Posted by Gary Brocklehurst (Member # 606) on July 01, 2009, 08:27 AM:
 
Hi Flavio

Packages of more than two kilogrammes in weight can not be sent via air mail letter post. Such heavier packages are therefore sent via UPS, from whom we receive excellent discount rates, which are passed on to our customers. I would suggest that our UPS rates are comparable with air mail parcel rates and for a far superior service. We have not used the air mail parcel service for more than ten years and have never lost a UPS parcel

Kindest Regards

Gary
 

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Posted by Jeroen van Ooijen (Member # 1104) on July 01, 2009, 09:08 AM:
 
Gary,why is the only way to pay you by creditcard?
or bankdraft,i hope the company will think about
paypal,it's easier and save.
And better for people from overseas that don't have
a creditcard
 

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Posted by Gary Brocklehurst (Member # 606) on July 01, 2009, 10:09 AM:
 
Hi Joeren

We simply feel that we do not need to accept Paypal, as we usually sell the majority of items listed

Kindest Regards

Gary
 

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Posted by Jeroen van Ooijen (Member # 1104) on July 01, 2009, 03:55 PM:
 
Strange!
 

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Posted by Tony Milman (Member # 7) on July 01, 2009, 05:01 PM:
 
not strange...the customer is always right unless they don't need you as a customer
 

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Posted by Dan Lail (Member # 18) on July 01, 2009, 06:23 PM:
 
Jeroen van Ooijen wrote........

quote:

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Strange! [Confused]

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I agree , Jeroen, I contacted Derann awhile back about offering Paypal and got the same answer. I do not use credit cards or send cash either. I got the same answer from CHC also. Hence, no purchases from me.
 

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Posted by Winbert Hutahaean (Member # 58) on July 01, 2009, 07:25 PM:
 
But guys,

If you seethat people who receive money from paypal will get cut twice by Paypal and Bank from the total money they receive.

First, when you pay $10 film, Gary will receive around $9 because paypal asks fees from the seller (money recipient).

When Gary goes to bank to cash the $9, Bank will take some money for fees. So Gary will end up to receive around $8.

If these involving thousands dollars transaction you can see big money will loose to such silly transactions.

That is my opinion, I don't know if Derann or CHC have other consideration.
 

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Posted by Osi Osgood (Member # 424) on July 01, 2009, 11:03 PM:
 
You make a good point Winbert. In fact, being overseas, if Gary and his fellas there were to recieve a paypal payment, there is an additional overas transaction charge they'd have to eat.

They always take my credit card no problem, so I can understand Derann's position.
 

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Posted by Dan Lail (Member # 18) on July 02, 2009, 12:29 AM:
 
Osi,

When I contacted these two companies I offered to pay the Paypal transaction fees when purchasing films.
 

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Posted by Roy Neil (Member # 913) on July 02, 2009, 01:54 AM:
 
PayPal adds another layer of indirection and can result in erroneous chargebacks which are almost impossible to deal with - the customer is usually assumed to be 'innocent' while the business is held accountable for whatever claims the customer has made - guilty until proven innocent - this makes it too easy for unscrupulous people to take advantage.

This is my main 'issue' with PayPal - not to mention the extra expense of hiring a middleman to process the payment ( e.g. PayPal fees )
 

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Posted by Jeroen van Ooijen (Member # 1104) on July 02, 2009, 06:04 AM:
 
If they do it example from 2 cartoons or 1 feature,i don't see the problem.
I don't like creditcards,there are many problems with it.
Why they do so difficult if you are a good shop and you have customers that buy a lot from you,then i find there must be a possibility that everyone can buy.
And don't give strange suggestions,the most webshops accept paypal,and here in the Netherlands all webshops,and they advice it for safety.
It seems like they are very old and have there traditions,and they don't want changes like the UPS story.
If i want a movie from them i only can buy second hand or i must to David Thomas,that's strange and he has not all the movies i want.
I would save cartoons in future but first i must to david then he must order by derann then they send the movie to Canada and from Canada to the Netherlands.
It cost me 30Euro extra to pay with bankdraft or pound sterling to them"good for the customers"NOT!!!
 

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Posted by Fabrizio Mosca (Member # 142) on July 02, 2009, 09:54 AM:
 
Here in Italy we have re-chargable credit cards, both from Visa or MC circuit. They're useful when you don't want to send cc data via the net and money availability is only the one you put on them.
I guess these kind of cc are available also in other countries. Have you ever tried with them?
 

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Posted by Osi Osgood (Member # 424) on July 02, 2009, 10:13 AM:
 
I know that Gary and the stalwart fellows at Derann can defend themselves quite well, but folks, don't let a lack of taking a paypal keep you from buying a lovely brand spanking new (or used) Derann print. Using a credit card has never caused me a problem with Derann, and I know that they are quite reliable with my number. I have never had a problem with them.

They're one of the best in the business and I can personally vouch for they're great accountability.
 

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Posted by Jeroen van Ooijen (Member # 1104) on July 02, 2009, 10:38 AM:
 
The movies are excellent really,but i find the reason a littlebit strange,one link to paypal is the only thing!
No i'am not happy with the service i'am sorry
 

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Posted by Winbert Hutahaean (Member # 58) on July 02, 2009, 10:52 AM:
 
Dan Lail wrote:

quote:

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When I contacted these two companies I offered to pay the Paypal transaction fees when purchasing films.

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quote:

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Why they do so difficult if you are a good shop and you have customers that buy a lot from you,then i find there must be a possibility that everyone can buy.

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Why are you so difficult to use Credit Card? You may be afraid someone will steal your CC numbers (details), but actually you can send multiple emails to Derann confirming your numbers (divide your 16 digits credit card via 4 mails for example) or calling them by phone. Derann will store your numbers for future purchases. So you don't need to submit your numbers every time you make a purchase.

Secondly, I am never afraid to use credit card for online shopping because if you look carefully in their terms and conditions (it is always in very, very fine prints) , i.e. if we are the card holders don't agree with the billing statement, we can avoid paying that. The CC company will do an investigation and if they found we are not using it, they will write it off from our statement.

Many people who their card have been cracked can avoid the payment because:

1. the CC company found the address for shipping is in different city/country

2. The unusual (numbers and nominal) of purchase.

Remember that CC company also have insurance to deal with this fraud transaction and so no one will loose in this fraud transaction (neither the buyer or seller). Insurance company will cover it.

Another benefit in using CC (at least here in Canada), if you purchase something with CC and found the items is not satisfying you as described, you can make a claim and CC will give a refund. I believe this also involve insurance company and nor buyer and seller is loosing money.

So do contact your CC company about this and if this happen, you can make a claim if there is lost in mail and get a full refund from CC Company and Derann also will not loose any money.

Lastly, which I am not really sure about this. I am afraid if you are using paypal, it will go to a personal account (eg. Gary email/account) and this will result you are not getting the VAT off from the item price (if you are buying from outside UK). I am thinking this because Derann must be registered as a company account to Visa/Master Card and by having this Derann can claim the VAT issue to the government and get VAT off for overseas purchases. Which the issue may not be applied if you are using paypal.

That is another possibility.

thanks,

winbert
 

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Posted by Jeroen van Ooijen (Member # 1104) on July 02, 2009, 11:10 AM:
 
Thanks for your comment
 

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Posted by Bart Smith (Member # 780) on July 02, 2009, 12:30 PM:
 

quote:

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Dan, in correct term of business, seller is not allowed to charge more than the item's price itself for the sake of fees (eg Credit Card fees). This has also been underlined by Paypal (and Ebay) that we cannot do that. The fees have to be absorbed in total price...

...In case you and Derann, you don't mind to pay more for the item to compensate such fees, but mind you, that if Derann allows you to do that then other will ask the same and finally Derann ends up in breaching regulations.

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quote:

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Lastly, which I am not really sure about this. I am afraid if you are using paypal, it will go to a personal account (eg. Gary email/account) and this will result you are not getting the VAT off from the item price (if you are buying from outside UK). I am thinking this because Derann must be registered as a company account to Visa/Master Card and by having this Derann can claim the VAT issue to the government and get VAT off for overseas purchases. Which the issue may not be applied if you are using paypal.

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This would not be the case either.
 

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Posted by Keith Ashfield (Member # 741) on July 02, 2009, 01:19 PM:
 
I don't wish to take sides, or biased opinions on the comments above, especially when the original thread topic was an announcement by Gary from Derann about their updated website - BUT you must bare in mind that Derann have been in the business for over 45 years.

In that time they have more than accomodated the film collectors with excellent products, customer care and service, second to none, so they must be doing something right.It is not about them "having their traditions".

You will go a long way to find a more heplful company. The fact that they choose to use a specific postal carrier and specific payment systems is THEIR choice. You do whatever makes YOUR business a success and when you find a formula that works, you stick to it.

I am sure they would like to accomodate everyone they can, but as old Abe Lincoln said -

"You can please some of the people all of the time and all of the people some of the time but you can't please all of the people all of the time?"

So come on guys, cut the lads at Derann a bit of slack - after all, without their commitment to the hobby we wouldn't be having this discussion on this forum.

We would all "like to have our cake and eat it" but sometimes we have to cook it first! Meet them halfway - they have the product you want, they ship it the most secure way they can, at a price that is fair. They do not quibble if there is a problem - If you want the films, at least attempt to find a method that suits both parties - not only one.

The one thing we must all remember here is that they have the product - there is probably more than one of us who would like it, so they are not worried. As Gary said they sell most of the titles on the list. If you going to go out "fishing" then take more than one kind of bait and hook and you will have a bigger chance of coming home with the fish
 

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Posted by Bart Smith (Member # 780) on July 02, 2009, 02:52 PM:
 
Keith is absolutely right about Derann choosing to do business they way that they want to, it is clearly their prerogative.

Nevertheless as someone who trades online my advice (should they choose to listen) would be to accept PayPal, and surcharge. You have to bear in mind that although they will pay a very small fee for a UK debit card payment, they will pay a percentage for a credit card payment (could be anywhere between 1.5-2.5% at a guess). If the order is big this could be a significant amount of money. PayPal is not much different, but IS more expensive. Surcharge accordingly.

As for the argument that they sell everything anyway, accepting PayPal would at very least be better in terms of cashflow.

My 2p's worth...
 

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Posted by Winbert Hutahaean (Member # 58) on July 02, 2009, 03:37 PM:
 
Bart thanks for the explanation and please read the regulations taken from Paypal UK page, which I quote:

quote:

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No Surcharges. Under Visa, MasterCard and American Express regulations and the laws of several states, including California, merchants may not apply a fee to the buyer for accepting credit card payments (often called a 'surcharge'). You agree that you will not impose a surcharge or any other fee for accepting PayPal as payment. This restriction does not prevent you from imposing a handling fee in connection with the sale of goods or services, as long as the handling fee does not operate as a surcharge (in other words, the packing fee for transactions paid through PayPal may not be higher than the handling fee for transactions paid through other payment methods). Nor does this restriction apply to Pound-denominated transactions by sellers residing in the United Kingdom listing items for sale on a UK-based website.

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quote:

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PayPal is not much different, but IS more expensive

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quote:

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4.5 No Surcharges. You agree that you will not impose a surcharge or any other fee for accepting PayPal as a payment method. You may charge a handling fee in connection with the sale of goods or services, as long as the handling fee does not operate as a surcharge and is not higher than the handling fee you charge for non-PayPal transactions. Nothing in this Agreement is intended to affect the legal right of a merchant in the UK to impose a surcharge for a debit or credit card transaction under the Credit Cards (Price Discrimination) Order 1990.

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quote:

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From US agreement that Winbert quoted: Nor does this restriction apply to Pound-denominated transactions by sellers residing in the United Kingdom listing items for sale on a UK-based website.

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quote:

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You forgot to account that when we are going to cash our balance, AGAIN we will loose some money apart from the paypal fees. We are mostly act as buyers here, so when we sometimes receive money we usually use it for another transaction (as paypal balance). So we hardly feel those fees. But Derann is going to cash-in the money for their future business.

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Winbert, I don't understand this point at all. When I have money in my PayPal business account (having paid the fees as already discussed), there is no extra charge whatsoever to transfer it to my business account either from PayPal or from my receiving bank. Maybe this is not the case in other countries, but it is here in the UK for nearly all business bank accounts! So the 'balance' in my PayPal account is the same amount of money that lands in my account. Clearly as with any form of income it is subject to taxation, but that is a separate issue.

Personally I don't surcharge for PayPal on my site, but that is my choice and decision.

Bart

[ July 03, 2009, 02:11 AM: Message edited by: Bart Smith ]
 

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Posted by Jeroen van Ooijen (Member # 1104) on July 03, 2009, 05:27 AM:
 
Okay enough,maby an advise for Derann to think about more dealers on the net where you can pay your film in not a difficult way,so in every state a dealer.
And now end of the discussion!
 

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