8mm Forum: Which is Better?

This is topic Which is Better? in forum 16mm Forum at 8mm Forum.

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Posted by Scott Mallory (Member # 2393) on April 16, 2011, 06:43 PM:

Hi, I'm yet another Super 8 guy thinking about getting into 16mm. I was wondering which machine is better? The good the bad and the ugly. Also, I assume they're both autoload machines? Here's the contenders: Eiki Superload Slot 2 SL-01 vs. Elmo 16 A1.
Thanks for your help!

Posted by Barry Fritz (Member # 1865) on April 16, 2011, 10:54 PM:

Chevy or Ford? Smith & Wesson or Colt? You'll get answers based on personal preference, I think. I can't comment on the Elmo, but I really like my Eiki. Have no trouble with it. Some say it does not handle splices well, but I have not experienced that. You'll be getting a machine that is pretty old either way. Make certain it is in good condition.

Posted by Scott Mallory (Member # 2393) on April 17, 2011, 03:33 AM:

Thanks Barry.

Posted by Mitchell Dvoskin (Member # 1183) on April 21, 2011, 10:24 AM:

> Elmo 16 A1

That is a very old model, which means that parts are non-existent should it need repair. The Elmo CL and CX series are great projectors, and most parts are available for them. These are slot load projectors.

Both Elmo and Eiki are excellent projectors, and if they are in good condition, should give you years of trouble free use.

Bell & Howell 16mm projectors were the most commonly used projectors here in the USA. They were very good projectors, but all of them (500, 1500,2500 series) contain a nylon work gear that will eventually crack and fail, even without use, rendering the projector inoperable. This gear can be replaced, but it is an expensive repair that you will not want to attempt yourself. If you find one with a new worm gear, the projector will outlive you, otherwise I would stay away from B&H.

Posted by Scott Mallory (Member # 2393) on April 21, 2011, 12:43 PM:

Thanks a lot Mitchell.

Posted by Barry Fritz (Member # 1865) on April 21, 2011, 10:49 PM:

Mitchell is correct about the Elmo CL projectors. Just be aware that if you buy one, the rollers may very well need to be replaced if someone has not done it previously. Larry Urbanski sells them, but they'll cost you around 100 bucks. You can replace them yourself but it is not a stroll in the park to do so.

Posted by Wayne Tuell (Member # 1689) on April 22, 2011, 11:26 AM:

I owned an ELMO AL for years and used it almost as much as my EIKI's The only problems I had with it was that it does not like the cheap thin leader and would bunch it up at loading. "MY" machine never had an issue with splices. The rollers had not gone bad at the time of parting with it, and the only real issue I had was finding lenses for it easily or cheap as I can for the EIKI machines.

Posted by Dino Everette (Member # 1378) on April 22, 2011, 01:15 PM:

The only thing I would add, since either make is going to give you a good experience (provided you opt for the CL instead of the AL)but depending on what you watch, the only difference I have seen is the Eiki seems more sensitive to shrinkage, causing the relooping mechanism to constantly activate.. That being said it was exactly that issue that allowed the extra footage of Metropolis to be found, since it was last projected by a man in the 1960's or perhaps early 70's who, in order to combat this held the mechanism so it wouldn't keep bouncing and it was held in such a way that he was forced to look at his watch the whole show, so he knew exactly how long the film lasted...He told a student this and the student patiently waited over the years until he was able to get access to the print at the national archives to double check what the professor had told him..

One last suggestion if you plan to watch silent films, you might want to consider getting a Kodak Pageant 250 series which allows for both 18fps, and 24fps...Happy projecting whichever model you choose..I am currently looking for an Eiki because I think I can modify it for 9.5 sound...

Posted by Jeff Taylor (Member # 442) on May 13, 2011, 01:35 PM:

FWIW: If you do go with the Eiki, the model you want is the SSL (the last produced), which comes with various postscripts, such as 01. All the postscripts designate is whether it has speakers in the cover, whether it's magnetic sound as well as optical, etc. Nothing changes with the basic machine, and if you're showing films seriously you won't want the cheesy speaker in the cover. Regarding Kodaks, I won't knock the basic machine, but the 250s, which is widely viewed as the best of the line because it has a halogen lamp rather than the tungsten lamps of the 126 and 256tr models which preceeded it, has been the subject of some recent threads on another forum. Apparently the late models of this series have a motor which switched to sleeve bearings rather than ball bearings, and has a tendancy to wear, heat up, and stall. Apparently Kodak pinched pennies at the end. It is manual, has relatively open threading, has a sound focusing lever, and two speeds, but is relatively tough to find lenses for, has very limited parts availability, and may have the motor problem. Eiki and Elmo are both fine machines if well maintained, but Elmo just dumped all of their spare parts, has an issue with the rubber film transport rollers turning to goo which cost almost $100 to replace, and lenses are not very common. Finally, early Elmo 16-CL's had a take up problem which was later remedied by a toothed belt and new pulleys. Kits to retrofit this are available if you get one of the early ones. Eiki's have a focusing roller which acts like rack and pinion focusing utilizing a rubber like tire that also deteriorates, but this is easily remedied at home with a 3/4" piece of auto vacuum hose and I haven't found any other major faults. They have a very useful "flip up" lens holder for scope lenses, and also have a line out feature which is handy for connecting to a power amplifier for enhanced sound. I have two halogen and two xenon Eikis and haven't found an issue with the loop restorer.

Posted by Richard C Patchett (Member # 974) on May 13, 2011, 07:41 PM:

Greetings I also sell the rollers
Complete set of Elmo Rollers $97.90 + mailing
Please visit my web site to order if needed
( note theses are not sleeves this is the whole thing right from Elmo) I also sell these
Elmo 16-CL's had a take up problem which was later remedied by a toothed belt and new pulleys. Kits to retrofit this are available if you get one of the early ones. Eiki's have a focusing roller which acts like rack and pinion focusing utilizing a rubber like tire that also deterioratesRC

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