WDHM 'The Jungle Book' extracts low fade reprints

[Adrian Winchester]

A few years ago, an ebay win of a number of 8mm releases included the two Walt Disney Home Movies 'Jungle Book' extracts on a 400' reel. Thinking they were almost bound to be faded, I was in no rush to look at this, but having now got round to it, I was pleasantly surprised to find both extracts are nice low fade polyester prints, with good sound. The stock markings are difficult to see clearly but look like LPP. It starts with about the first three minutes of 'Mowgli the Jungle Boy', then there's all of 'I Wanna Be Like You', then the rest of 'Mowgli'. I hope that's correct in terms of putting the scenes in sequence.

I don't recall these extracts being among the small number of Disney releases that Derann gained permission to reprint in the early 1980s, but I can't think of any other explanation, and the quality looks too good for them to be unauthorised dupes. I wondered whether anyone might be able to confirm that Derann reprinted them?

[Bill Phelps]

I saw a screening of this very thing at one of Steve Osborne's recent film shows...he has the same thing...I even commented how nice it looked. I don't know the history behind them so possibly you could contact him for details.

[Brian Fretwell]

I suppose it depended when Buck Labs went over to using LPP?Agfa stock. I have a couple in WDHM boxed 200ft reels on low fade stock.

[Osi Osgood]

I do to. I have an L.P.P. copy of Dumbo the Flying Elephant, one of best WDHM digests, just my opinion.

[Adrian Winchester]

Thanks for the replies, despite my post suffering from being half asleep, so I've now improved it!

Brian - I'd be interested to know what your WDHM releases are, and whether they are polyester. I ask because although I can't be 100% sure, I'd be very surprised if any British 8mm prints produced for Disney are on polyester stock, because I don't think this was used for British-made prints before 1983, and I think WDHM had more or less shut down by then.

Osi - I wondered whether your 'Dumbo the Flying Elephant' is polyester, and also is it a USA print?

[Lee Mannering]

BILL. Wonder if young Ste projected my S8 Derann film locations in the seasonal show?

Ade. Got Wanna be like you on LPP but colour was going so I sent it to Movie Magnetic for colour treatment and the colour is awesome again.

[Brian Fretwell]

The copy of Mickey's Trailer I have is on LPP is in a WDHM box and has the Buck Labs leader it feels like it has a polyester base. The other one is a silent version of Mary Poppins the Super Nanny which doesn't have the Buck Labs leader and is marked 2S it also feels like polyester. The other one I have is Island of Mystery, silent on 2S, but that has Spanish on the leader so may not be a UK print.

I know Walton used Agfa stock but can't remember when they actually stopped printing.

[Adrian Winchester]

This is an interesting mystery that may be impossible to solve!

Lee - I've heard of one or two instances of LPP fading, but it's bad luck that this happened to yours, in view of the no fading for 75 years expectation. The colour on both of my extracts is slightly 'cool', with greens being particularly prominent.

Brian - you may well have evidence that at least a few polyester prints were produced for WDHM, shortly before they completely shut down. But considering how many brand new WDHM prints were still being sold up to decades after they ceased trading, there would have been fairly exceptional circumstances in relation to the stock of certain titles running out. It would be interesting to know if all prints of the 'Popeye the Movie' 200' are faded, because I believe that was their last new release. IMDB indicates it was released in the USA in December 1980, so I expect the Super 8 extract first appeared in 1981.

I must check the stock of more of my WDHM prints as I have one or two acetate prints with a surprising lack of fade. I'm aware that Buck were known for sometimes producing large batches of prints in advance of a distributor actually ordering all of them, and this might have also happened with box production. If WDHM didn't round up all the British negatives, I wouldn't completely rule out any possibility of prints of certain scarce titles being produced beyond the end of WDHM, partly because there were original boxes available. Also, it's not unknown for films to change boxes. E.g. at a fairly recent Harpenden 9.5 event, I bought a faded 'The Old Mill' for only about £1, because it had a WDHM box in good condition. I'd always liked the idea of putting my Derann LPP/poly print in a WDHM box, but anyone buying such a print could imagine there were low fade/poly Disney prints.

What I'd definitely rule out - in terms of prints produced for WDHM - are any that are low fade/poly and sold in white boxes with colour WDHM labels on one side, because that applies to my 'A Walt Disney Christmas', which I'm certain is an unauthorised dupe.

I think Walton stopped printing about 1983. I have some Walton Agfa prints, although as far as I know there are no polyester Walton prints - although someone might think otherwise if they (e.g) obtained a Derann print of the 'Silver Dream Racer' 400', as this kept appearing in Derann catalogues, indicating that they must have acquired the master. Portland also appeared to obtain certain Walton masters - I have a low fade Pink Panther that they sold around 1984, and a scope 'The Lady Vanishes' (1979).

[Osi Osgood]

I will take a close look at my print of Dumbo later today and get back to you on it. On a slightly related point, I always thought that WDHM last releases were the three "Movie Milestones" cartoons, and the "Sorcerers Apprentice" release. Note: worst opportunity lost by WDHM .... Not releasing "Black Hole" 400ft digest in scope.

[Osi Osgood]

OK, I was wrong. I don't know what film stock it is. There are no markings whatsoever, but it was printed by Buck Film labs. I was thinking some kind of unmarked Fuji, but for all I know, it could be agfa or l.p.p., but it must be SOME kind of low fade!

[Adrian Winchester]

Osi - Thanks for checking, I'll keep a look out in case another such print turns up. I expect you could be right regarding the last WDHM releases. When referring to 'Popeye', I was primarily thinking in terms of it being their last Super 8 release of a brand new cinema release. I presume the "Movie Milestones" are 'The Old Mill' and two others?

[Osi Osgood]

Yes, "The Band Concert" and "The Ugly Duckling", strangely enough, "Ugly" was printed on some quick fade Eastman. I have never seen a good color print.

[Brian Fretwell]

I just looked and my copy of Popeye (My Big Fight) is on the usual Buck Fuji stock.

[Lee Mannering]

Ade. The Disney shorts I got very late in the day on a trip down south to the old photo shop I used to haunt every week talking to the manager. Hadn't been back for a couple of decades and popped in. To my amazement he still had the shop and remembered me whereupon I mentioned the super 8 scene and then he says I still have some films in the back no ones interested now! It was a small pile of Disneys which I purchased mainly out of sentimentality of course and all new. Probably 80% were on low fade but as we know all stock will go in the end largely depending on storage.
Nice memory that.

I recorded Wanna be like you into Stereo and it makes a great viewing experience.

[Brian Fretwell]

Gian Luca Mario Loncrini posted this on the Derann Vaults facebook page as part of the list of the Disney shorts he has

WALT DISNEY HOME MOVIES (reprinted by Buck Labs, Low Fade stock):
- Albatross Airlines
- Bambi and his Friends
- The Band Concert
- The Best of Friends
- Boat Builders
- Bone Trouble
- Brer Rabbit and the Tar Baby
- Chip 'n' Dale
- Cinderella's Surprise Dress
- Clock Cleaners
- Crazy Over Daisy
- The Dapper Dalmatian
- Duel of the Wizards
- The Dwarfs Dilemma
- Escape from Astragard
- I wanna be like You
- Island of Mistery
- Love Bug # 53
- The Mad Tea Party
- Match of the Century
- Mickey's Circus
- Monster from under the Sea
- Most Befuddling Thing
- Mowgli the Jungle Boy
- No Sail
- 101 Dalmatians Escape
- The Old Mill
- Peter Pan meets Captain Hook
- The Rescue
- Soup's On
- Test of Courage
- The Three Caballeros
- Three for Breakfast
- Whistle while you work
- Working for Peanuts
- Winnie the Pooh and Tigger too;