8mm Forum: Elmo lens 1.1 blur

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Topic: Elmo lens 1.1 blur

Tom Photiou
Film God

Posts: 4837
From: Plymouth U.K
Registered: Dec 2003

posted June 18, 2004 04:00 PM

My brother and i both have these lenses fitted to our 1200HDs and up until now have never had any problems, my Bro noticed if he focused the film as normal the left or right side would be soft, focus that part and the rest is soft. Change the lens back to his original 1.3 and everything is fine suggesting his lens has developed a fault. If i hold it to light and look down the barral it doed seem to have a lot of muck within the inside.
My question bedore i take it to a photographic shop is this-
Has anyone else suffered with this before and has anyone ever taken one of these apart themselves and succsessfully re-assembled it without any problems, bit of a downer this as before we shipped the machine away to Stoke on Trent for a service this problem did not exist, when we got it back, dispite packing the machine to twice its size i noticed the front edge of the lens was slightly dinged, no matter how well you pack and label as fragile the twats that drive the vans still seem to play football with every parcel they take. As you guess i suspect this may have not helped matters, all the glass of the lens seems ok visualy. [Frown]

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Kevin Faulkner
Film God

Posts: 4071
From: Essex UK
Registered: Jun 2003

posted June 18, 2004 04:11 PM

Is it the same lens you sent I ask myself. The lenses can be stripped down very easily and cleaned but I wonder it that is the real cause. The 1.1 has a much lower depth of focus compared to the 1.3. If you can get a sharp image at the edges or the centre but not both then I would suggest the the lens holder position needs it's right to left position adjusting to correct the problem.
Tom, you will notice at the bottom of the lens holder and nearest to the machine body a very small cross head screw which is also used as the stop position for the lens holder. This can be adjusted for the best overall focus from side to side.
Its best to use non striped silent film and as new as possible. I use some recently exposed silent Kodachrome with a focus chart exposed on it. But dont worry about whats on it just make small adjustments to the screw untill the film grain is as sharp as possible accross the whole picture. It should only be a small adjustment and shouldnt have any effect on the f1.3
Give me a bell if you have any problems or email me at mrelmouk@tiscali.co.uk
Best of luck, Kev.

--------------------
GS1200 Xenon with Elmo 1.0...great combo along with a 16-CL Xenon for that super bright white light.

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John Whittle
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 791
From: Northridge, CA USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted June 18, 2004 04:55 PM

Tom

Since you and your brother both have the 1.1 lens, have you tried moving the lens from one projector to the other and noticed if the problem moved with the lens or stayed with the projector? That should let you know if it's the lens or the projector.

If you elect to disassemble and clean the lens, make sure you draw a diagram as you remove elements so that you reassemble it with everything in the proper direction. Lens elements will have different contours on different sides and if you put one in backwards == well you know == it won't work.

Since you report a "ding" in the lens, one might expect the lens holder adjustment would be off. Hopefully it's just an adjustment and not to do with the hinge.

John

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Tom Photiou
Film God

Posts: 4837
From: Plymouth U.K
Registered: Dec 2003

posted June 19, 2004 12:43 AM

Good points there Kev, My bro suggesested same thing about it being the same one! Seems odd it was only that tiny edge of the lens that was damaged as its almost impossible to bend this edge, i gently tried to sriaghten it and no way can i move it.
Good advise from John to, many thanks boy's, [Wink]

Be in touch.

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Kevin Faulkner
Film God

Posts: 4071
From: Essex UK
Registered: Jun 2003

posted June 19, 2004 04:09 PM

John, Good advice there. I was lucky to buy an f1.1 lens from a guy who was selling one on ebay here in the UK. He sold it as being faulty and giving a very unsharp picture.
Anyway I contacted him and asked some questions of him and he told me that a friend had stripped it down to clean it and it had never been the same since.
Well I bought it and as I susspected the front elememnt was the wrong way round. A clean and reassemble the correct way round and this lens is now the best of all my 1.1's except for my Schneider which outshines the lot. [Smile]

Kev

--------------------
GS1200 Xenon with Elmo 1.0...great combo along with a 16-CL Xenon for that super bright white light.

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David Roberts
Master Film Handler

Posts: 405
From: Suffolk. England
Registered: Apr 2004

posted June 22, 2004 01:30 PM

Kevin
Do you use your Schneider lens in the Elmo projectors and if so,have you modified the lens so that the Elmo focusing cam works .
I have a Schneider f1-1, 11-30 zoom, barrel size32.5.
Any comments about using this with an ST1200.
Thanks

David,

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Tom Photiou
Film God

Posts: 4837
From: Plymouth U.K
Registered: Dec 2003

posted June 22, 2004 01:57 PM

Dave, good one! i have that lens which was previously fitted to a Eumig 840 multiprocessor. We still have it and use it in a Eumig 822 sonomatic but i would love to be able to find someone who could sleeve it for use in a 1200HD. Its one of the best lenses around and in my opinion its wasted in a machine we rarley use.

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Ian John
Junior
Posts: 20
From: United Kingdom
Registered: Jun 2003

posted June 22, 2004 02:24 PM

Tom, I got a devious mind. You say that the lens didn't have a ding before you sent your projector to Stoke-on-Trent. How do you know that somone up there didn't swap their len's with the one out of your projector before it was returned to you. (and I don't know the company you sent your projector too)

I say this becuase you can't trust everyone out there who are involved with film/equipment, I have learned that personaly to my cost, there are a few crooks out there. I know now, if I have to send anything away to be looked at or serviced/repaired I write down all the serial numbers of lenses/equipment and also photograph all the items/numbers on equipment being sent away.

Ian.

--------------------
Keeping 16mm Christian Films Alive.

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Tom Photiou
Film God

Posts: 4837
From: Plymouth U.K
Registered: Dec 2003

posted June 22, 2004 05:01 PM

Hi Ian, normally i wouldnt hesitate in thinking the same on this, its what my Bro thinks to, however, i do know this chappie,(projection services), and he has been repairing projectors for at least 35-40 years. He repairs every make of machine as well as all gauges, his previous jobs included working as an engineer for Johnsons of Henden,(Eumig) and also with Elmo uk. but you are right, if i sent it away again to anyone i would replace the lens with the origianl 1.3

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Kevin Faulkner
Film God

Posts: 4071
From: Essex UK
Registered: Jun 2003

posted June 22, 2004 05:12 PM

Dave, The Schneider Xenovaron lens to get your hands on has a 28mm straight barrel. This allows the lens to be put into a sleeve which fits the Elmo.
As the majority of other Schneiders are 32.5 mm it doesnt leave much room for modification.
The particular lens I have in fact has a look about it that makes me think it came out of the Schneider factory in a black sleeve which matches the rest of the lens body made for the Elmo. The other thing about it is that the Schneider box the lens came in has the inside moulding shaped to the Elmo fitting.
Can anyone tell me if Schneider did a run of these lenses like this. If anyone wants to see a pic of this lens, I will happily email them a copy as I think it's rather interesting.
That all aside its a superb optic and gives an extra 80 lux light comparred to any Elmo 1.1 lens I have tried. I tested 4 elmo 1.1 lenses againd this Schneider on my Xenon GS and the results were consistant. If you see one snap it up especially if its got the smooth 28mm barrel. Phil at CHC keeps the sleeves in stock.
Kev.

--------------------
GS1200 Xenon with Elmo 1.0...great combo along with a 16-CL Xenon for that super bright white light.

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David Roberts
Master Film Handler

Posts: 405
From: Suffolk. England
Registered: Apr 2004

posted June 26, 2004 08:17 AM

Kev
Thanks for the info on Schneider lens. Mine is the 32.5 barrel and is ribbed,not smooth like yours. What I have done though is cut a small groove in the barrel as per Elmo and then drilled a tiny hole to take the pin from a spare Elmo f1.3 I have.This may seem a bit drastic but it works and Im now using the Schneider on my st1200D.
I dont know if Tom could undertake a similar mod on his?
My lens was wasted in its original form so I reckoned it worth the risk!

Regards
Dave R.

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Tom Photiou
Film God

Posts: 4837
From: Plymouth U.K
Registered: Dec 2003

posted June 26, 2004 08:38 AM

Dave thats excellent, i may try this but i'll need to check what i have to do it with as i am limited on my tools.
like you our lens is wasted on a machine we rarely use. Good input thanks. [Wink]

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