8mm Forum: Ancient prints VS. ancient projectors?

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Topic: Ancient prints VS. ancient projectors?

Osi Osgood
Film God

Posts: 10204
From: Mountian Home, ID.
Registered: Jul 2005

posted February 09, 2007 09:57 AM

I have found, that just because you have an ancient super 8/standard 8 print, it doesn't follow that it will run better on an older projector.

In fact, I find the older the print, the newer the projector should be used.

Take my old Thunderbird prints, for instance. These tend to age badly, black and white or otherwise. In some cases, almost brittle. The older projectors I have are actually a little rough on them. My stereo Eumig is about the most gentle projector I have ever had, and the film print runs much better, without "jitters" ect.

Your thoughts and comments?

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"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "

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Paul Adsett
Film God

Posts: 5003
From: USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted February 09, 2007 02:01 PM

I've had the same experience Osi. Prints which jitter and make a racket going through my Elmo GS1200 seem to be much steadier and quiter going thru the Eumig stereo projectors. I have a very high regard for Eumig projector designs, in my opinion, superior to Elmo's in some areas, particularly the claw/intermittent design, and the lens holder/location.

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The best of all worlds- 8mm, super 8mm, 9.5mm, and HD Digital Projection,
Elmo GS1200 f1.0 2-blade
Eumig S938 Stereo f1.0 Ektar
Panasonic PT-AE4000U digital pj

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Antonio Costa Mota
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 171
From: Portugal
Registered: Jun 2004

posted February 09, 2007 04:02 PM

Osi and Paul
You should try the Bauers T 600 or T610. They are really kind to
films, even those old ones. I have films which are noisy and
unsteady on the Elmo GS 1200 and Beaulieu, and yet they run
smoothly on the Bauer T 610.

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António C. Mota

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Douglas Meltzer
Moderator

Posts: 4554
From: New York, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted February 09, 2007 06:12 PM

Strangely enough, I've hardly ever had a film run badly through my GS-1200 (Of course now that I've written that, the next film I thread up will result in an earthquake like death rattle on the projector...). Maybe that's a result of always using FilmGuard before I screen. What I do notice about the Elmo is that it's very particular about threading up films that first haven't been trimmed with the built in film trimmer. Quite a finicky beast!

Doug

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I think there's room for just one more film.....

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Osi Osgood
Film God

Posts: 10204
From: Mountian Home, ID.
Registered: Jul 2005

posted February 09, 2007 07:28 PM

As The preceeding post stated, I think it also helps immensely if you lubricate an older film with a proper film cleaner.

Now that it's been mentioned again, I really want to try that "Film-Guard" product.

Where can I get that, stateside?

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"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "

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Paul Adsett
Film God

Posts: 5003
From: USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted February 09, 2007 07:30 PM

Hi Antonio,
Yes I have heard that the Bauer's are superb machines. Unfortunately they never penetrated the US market to the extent of Eumig and Elmo, so they are pretty rare on this side of the pond. I don't have any sales figures to back me up, but I suspect that Eumig sold more projectors in the USA than anybody else, with Elmo coming in a close second. And, when it comes to buying projectors it's kind of like buying a car, you get comfortable and familiar with , and trust in, a specific brand. I have purchased Honda cars for 20 years, and will not consider anything else, even though there are many other superb vehicles out there. Similarly, I know Mike Peckham swears by Sankyo's and I am sure they are a great machine, but I am reluctant to buy anything other than Elmo and Eumig because I do not want to have to learn how to fix a whole set of different problems!

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The best of all worlds- 8mm, super 8mm, 9.5mm, and HD Digital Projection,
Elmo GS1200 f1.0 2-blade
Eumig S938 Stereo f1.0 Ektar
Panasonic PT-AE4000U digital pj

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Douglas Meltzer
Moderator

Posts: 4554
From: New York, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted February 09, 2007 09:16 PM

Osi,

You can order FilmGuard from Steve Osborne at The Reel Image (24 hr voice mail 937-296-9036). I believe the cost is $42.50 including shipping.

Paul,

I have a Bauer 510 and a 610. They are absolutely incredible machines and so very quiet. Those models have many similarities to Eumig's stereo line.

Doug

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I think there's room for just one more film.....

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Osi Osgood
Film God

Posts: 10204
From: Mountian Home, ID.
Registered: Jul 2005

posted February 09, 2007 10:41 PM

Hey Meltzer!

How much of a supply is that for 42 bucks? I do need to get some stuff pretty soon, and while my ECCO 1500 has been pretty good for me, I must say that it does streak badly when applied (perhaps that is because of the cleaning rags I use.)

I have enjoyed my Eumig for quite a few years. I was stunned at how good my stereo prints sounded on it. I bought a print of "Magical Mystery Tour", which was faded, but was re-recorded in stereo, and the songs, (like "I am the Walrus") had an incredible sharpness to them, (tone, bottom)

But I also have an very good ELMO optical, so I guess I have been spoiled with two very good machines, though, I must say, if I can get ahold of a good 1200, I'll give it a go.

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"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "

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Brad Miller
Administrator

Posts: 525
From: Dallas, TX, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted February 09, 2007 11:59 PM

As a general guide when using FilmGuard, one OUNCE is enough to properly clean and lubricate a 2-2.5 hour 35mm feature. That's around 15,000 feet of 35mm film. The FilmGuard bottles are 32oz. Buy only one. It'll last you a LONG time with 8mm.

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Barry Johnson
Master Film Handler

Posts: 358
From: United Kingdom
Registered: Jul 2003

posted February 10, 2007 08:10 AM

Osi:
Disagree with your findings on projector/print ages etc.
Old standard 8 prints and old projectors works very well indeed.I have in my collection a 1952 Bell & Howell wich give a rock steady image and really runs well screening films much older than than the projector.They built them to high standards way back then.

As for Super8,then yes,I would concur.As some S8 machines really were crap and handled precious film (of any age) pretty awfully,due mainly to the poor self threading designs of the early models.
Now put an old super8 film on say Beulieu/Bauer or the ST /GS range of the Elmo brigade and you have a fine combination.
Barry

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Standard8 rules!!

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Douglas Meltzer
Moderator

Posts: 4554
From: New York, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted February 10, 2007 09:01 AM

"Hey Meltzer"? That's Hey Mr. Moderator to you........ [Big Grin]

Doug

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I think there's room for just one more film.....

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