8mm Forum: Balance Strip Question

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Topic: Balance Strip Question

Brad Kimball
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1171
From: Highland Mills, NY USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted December 03, 2008 12:34 PM

What is the actual purpose of the balance strip? I have seen film without it - either from wear or it simply never existed, possibly. Does this help or hinder performance?

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

Posts: 7016
From: Long Island, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted December 03, 2008 01:19 PM

It's basic purpose is to keep the total thickness of the film the same on one edge as the other. For one thing this means when the film piles up on a reel a couple of hundred winds deep, each of those layers of stripe will add its thickness in to "steer" the whole mess into the opposite side reel flange and not wind very gracefully. It's also on there to assure the film sits flatter in the gate for better focus.

-then again there is that stereo thing too!

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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Alan Rik
Film God

Posts: 2211
From: New York City, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted December 03, 2008 01:20 PM

Too quick Steve! [Smile]

The purpose of the balance stripe as I have heard it was that it was designed to create an even wind when putting the film on a reel. If you don't have that stripe the film when wound would be higher on one side than the other and it wouldn't store correctly.
And as Steve has said for focusing issues as well. It would explain why most optical prints are so sharp compared to some mag prints.

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

Posts: 7016
From: Long Island, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted December 03, 2008 01:32 PM

I have to be quick: I'm supposed to be working right now!

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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Rob Young.
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1633
From: Cheshire, U.K.
Registered: Dec 2003

posted December 03, 2008 02:33 PM

As Steve and Alan rightly point out, the absence of a balance stripe does hinder performance.

During the mass production days of super 8 certain companies, like Walton Films in the UK, would produce package movies without a balance stripe in order to save on production costs...genious [Roll Eyes]

as if no one would notice; especially on their 'scope prints where focus across the image is even more critical!

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Osi Osgood
Film God

Posts: 10204
From: Mountian Home, ID.
Registered: Jul 2005

posted December 03, 2008 02:43 PM

With regards to optical sound super 8, the sharpness of the optical sound print is due to the studio negatives.

I had the "Dillinger" 400ft digest, and I then afterwards aquired the optical Super 8 feature of "Dillinger" and it was like night and day! The optical feature was like watching 16MM while the super 8 digest was grainy as all hell and it really was bad compared to the optical sound print.

The explanation for the original use of the balance stripe was always a question of mine as well! I just assumed it was for adding commentary on home movies and such as there were many "two track" or "twin track" super 8 projectors before official stereo projectors.

That stereo quality of Super 8 prints has always been great about them, and with the capabilities of recording restored tracks off of DVD's (for instance, I re-recorded my L.P.P. print of Popeye Meets Sinbad the Sailor from the restored print of the film on the restored Popeye collection on DVD), or laserdiscs with a higher fidelity than capable before, can REALLY give your super 8 films a boost!

I would also suggest taking mono classics and taking the balance stripe seperately, and recording off of DVD those audio commentaries that they often have.

I have now done that with my prints of Star Wars and Logan's Run and it, in some ways, doubles the fun!

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"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "

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Jean-Marc Toussaint
Film God

Posts: 2392
From: France
Registered: Oct 2004

posted December 03, 2008 02:50 PM

Or you may create a multi-lingual version. I've done that on a few prints. I've redone a lot of Derann Disneys for some collectors, who asked me to transfer the English sound on the balance track and add the French dub on the main track.

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The Grindcave Cinema Website

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

Posts: 7016
From: Long Island, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted December 03, 2008 02:52 PM

I've heard that it is a luxury on films 200 feet or less, but then again the couple of extra Pounds it cost when I had a few of my own striped seemed a pretty cheap luxury.

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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Douglas Meltzer
Moderator

Posts: 4554
From: New York, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted December 03, 2008 03:26 PM

It wasn't only Walton that tried to save money. I have a number of Castle prints without a balance stripe.

Doug

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I think there's room for just one more film.....

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Mike Tynus
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 135
From: Addison, IL, USA
Registered: Apr 2008

posted December 03, 2008 04:55 PM

I also have some Columbia's, Techno's and a Marketing print without a balance stripe. I always thought it was because they were older prints, but that money saving reason is quite interesting. And these prints never play quite right, always jumping around, even after a cleaning.

I also found it interesting that the first Beaulieu 708 was not a stereo projector because they didn't feel that the balance stripe offered "true stereo" from a frequency standpoint. They of course changed that!

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Osi Osgood
Film God

Posts: 10204
From: Mountian Home, ID.
Registered: Jul 2005

posted December 03, 2008 06:16 PM

Standard 8mm, however, has no choice but just one stripe, as the image goes right to the edge of the film.

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"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "

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Alan Rik
Film God

Posts: 2211
From: New York City, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted December 03, 2008 06:31 PM

I think I have a Godzilla film that has only one stripe from Germany. Its funny I was trying to re-record and then after 15 minutes of no audio I look down...no balance stripe!!

When I saw the title I thought it meant how do you balance when you are dancing for your loved one....

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Mike Tynus
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 135
From: Addison, IL, USA
Registered: Apr 2008

posted December 03, 2008 09:56 PM

Good one, Mr. Rik! [Smile]

It's funny how your print is a Godzilla film, as the Marketing print I have is ATRAGON, a Japanese Sci Fi flick from Toho studios which I would also like to record a second track to.

So now I'm wondering, is it possible to add just a balance stripe to a sound print that doesn't have one?

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

Posts: 7016
From: Long Island, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted December 03, 2008 10:09 PM

Yes it is. EVT magnetics would probably do it, and he is capable of doing a wider balance stripe that is better for stereo.

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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Mike Tynus
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 135
From: Addison, IL, USA
Registered: Apr 2008

posted December 03, 2008 11:43 PM

Wow! That's great news, Steve.
Thanks for that info.

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