8mm Forum: Elmo ST1200HD Service Manual

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Topic: Elmo ST1200HD Service Manual

John Staveley
Junior
Posts: 3
From: Norfolk, UK
Registered: Mar 2013

posted March 05, 2013 12:57 PM

Hello All,
Does anyone have a pdf of the Elmo Service manual they could email me - I need to replace the belts and I'm doing a show in ten days. I have an incomplete one for the earlier ST1200 but it doesn't help much.

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Joe Taffis
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1592
From: United States
Registered: Jun 2003

posted March 05, 2013 02:31 PM

Hi John, Welcome to the Forum! I could send you one . I just need your e-mail address. You can send me an e-mail or private message here. The service manual is for the ST1200, but the belts are the same, and easy to replace except for the tiny counter belt. On an ST1200 its no problem, but on the HD...forget it! Not worth the effort.

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Joe Taffis

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John Staveley
Junior
Posts: 3
From: Norfolk, UK
Registered: Mar 2013

posted August 30, 2013 10:39 AM

I am still looking for a pdf of the Elmo ST1200HD service manual since I need to change the rubber rim of the shutter wheel. I have a manual for the normal ST1200 but that doesn't help much.

John S

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

Posts: 7016
From: Long Island, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted August 30, 2013 01:19 PM

I've never heard of anybody replacing this rubber. The ST1200HD runs fine without it, although I think it would run quieter with it in place.

If you do figure out a way to replace it please let us know. I'd do it on mine if it was practical.

An old Film Friend of mine lived in North Walsham, are you nearby?

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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Bruce Wright
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 140
From: Denham Springs, La.
Registered: Oct 2011

posted August 30, 2013 07:58 PM

When I got my st 1200hd the shutter wheel rim had only goo.
After much and careful cleaning I never found a good way to replace the belt.I tried putting a few drops of glue on
the edge but this resulted in uneven pressure. Rolling the glue
on looked good, but the belt was impossible to install.
Results as of today: Cleaned the rim (nt times) and closed the projector. Been in use for about a year. Is it noisy ? Don,t
know, It's the only one I have. I kind of like the sounds.

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Bruce Wright

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

Posts: 7016
From: Long Island, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted August 30, 2013 09:24 PM

I've heard what I thought was the shutter wheel vibrating some times and always wondered if the rubber around the wheel would help dampen this out.

No big deal: the ST-1200 is pretty quiet anyway.

I've found that the contact between the roller and the shutter wheel is not very reliable. Mine is fine at 24 FPS but tends to slip at 18, so I use other machines for silents. I wonder if this would be better with the rubber too.

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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Lindsay Morris
Film Handler

Posts: 87
From: Darlington, WA, Australia
Registered: Jul 2013

posted August 30, 2013 11:38 PM

Having just tussled with both a Elmo ST1200 & ST1200HD I can offer the following.
The shutter rim drive rubber really needs to be there to ensure reliable running @18FPS and now I THINK I have found a suitable adhesive to make the rubber strip stay on the rim.
The supplier of the Elmo ST1200 rim drive belts on EBay (isellprojectorbelts) recommends using contact adhesive which normally one applies to BOTH surfaces and waits until almost dry and then bring the bits together for a good adhesion.
All well and good but unless you totally remove the shutter/claw assembly that cannot be done unless you are an octopus with very small, dexterous fingers [Mad]

Before that step make sure that you clean the shutter rim VERY thoroughly with Isopropyl Alcohol so that the rim is absolutely clean & free from oil or grease etc.

ANY gunk on there will prevent the glue doing it's job.

I tried Super Glue which lets go after a while and the belt gets mashed up.
Looks like a product called Bostix Multi Bond does the job once you have gotten the belt up onto the rim, lift it off in small sections with a small screw driver and carefully squeeze the adhesive in between the rubber & the rim & let go & then move on a small section at a time.
Let it sit without use for at least 24hrs and you are away again & now after having run the HD for many hours the belt is still firmly stuck on. [Smile]

I still check mine each time I go to use the machine by simply flipping open the lamphouse side cover & checking the belt is still stuck firmly by picking at it with my finger nail...(the shutter rim edge is fully visible once the cover is open).
So far so good & another one to go onto a ST1200 which came off & got munched so a new one is heading over by post right now from the EBay seller.

By far the easiest belt to replace IS the footage counter as one screw located just above the takeup holdback sprocket holds the counter unit in place.
Remove that & the unit pops out, clean all then goo off both the takeup sprocket AND the driven pulley on the counter.
Slip the new belt over the takeup sprocket & hold open the sprocket shoe so the belt can go right thru easily to the groove at the rear (tweezers are handy to do that) & then pop the belt over the counter unit drive slide back into position & insert the screw. Some BluTak on the Philips driver head will hold that screw in place while you slide things back into position.

As to a Service Manual..nothing on the FilmTech site but I bought mine from here...http://www.photobooksonline.com/books/manual29.html
Very detailed manual over 100 pages & absolutely invaluable when working on these machines.
Lots & lots of very good info but as usual some special tools needed.

The ST 1200 service manual is of very little use for working on the 1200HD as the belt drive assembly is totally different plus there are differences with the audio side as well...so be careful.

Good machines when correctly adjusted & have a VG feature to stop the drive pulleys for either 18 or 24FPS developing flat spots... When the machine is switched OFF the drive pulley is raised ever so slightly by the switch mechanism lifting the pulley OFF the shutter rim so that neither the rim rubber or the pulley develops flats that play havoc with sound quality.

The rim rubber certainly made my HD run a hell of a lot quieter once I fitted it AND it stayed in place with a good adhesive.
Dunno whether Bostix is available in US but it an acetone based adhesive & dries clear & sticks like hell. [Smile]

Another good thing about the Elmo is that the amp chips are pretty much ALL available via sellers on EBay. The output stage chip is the usual casualty when speaker lines get shorted etc.

The Sanken chips even though long since out of production are readily available. The ST1200 uses a 10W chip and the ST 1200HD uses a 15W chip..just a wee bit more rugged.

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Lindsay

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Roy Neil
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 203
From: Menlo Park, CA
Registered: Sep 2007

posted August 31, 2013 01:17 AM

Most ST1200's ( HD or otherwise ) are in dire need of cleaning and lubrication.

Provided the mechanics spin smoothly and without undue friction I have found the shutter rim belt is not mandatory. It will dampen the noise and increase friction/linkage to the drive wheels, so properly installed and in good condition it will improve performance.

After taking the projector apart and reassembling I usually have no problem getting 18fps. I recently serviced an ST1200 that was so stiff it stripped the rubber drive wheels. Turned out the friction adjustment on one gear had been tightened so severely it was nearly impossible to turn, so whenever the spinning wheels hit the shutter there would be a skidding noise, and lots of fine black rubber powder everywhere. There was no rubber belt on the shutter, and it had no problem with 'traction' as demonstrated by the stripped rubber drive wheels. After I finished cleaning/lubricating/adjusting the wheels actually worked without slipping/skidding, however I used some silicone to bond them to the axles as they were far too worn/loose.

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John Staveley
Junior
Posts: 3
From: Norfolk, UK
Registered: Mar 2013

posted August 31, 2013 05:50 AM

Thanks for all the advice, very useful and I might try the Bostik but I still need a manual to know how to get to the shutter wheel.
Yes, Steve, I am quite near North Walsham - about 15 miles. Some years ago I was Chairman of a group called the Norwich Movie Makers. They are still going but don't seem to do much film making anymore even though most changed from Super 8 or 16 mm to video. Seems that video members are more obsessed with the equipment than the end product!

John S

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Maurice Leakey
Film God

Posts: 5895
From: Bristol. United Kingdom
Registered: Oct 2007

posted August 31, 2013 06:57 AM

You can buy a manual here:-
http://www.oldtimercameras.com/stock/Model.asp?Model=3452&ModelPage=true

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Maurice

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

Posts: 7016
From: Long Island, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted August 31, 2013 07:13 AM

John,

Did you know Tim Christian? He was in Norwich Movies Makers and very active on this forum too. We corresponded daily for more than three years.

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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