8mm Forum: Abbott & Costello Meet Frankenstein U/8

This is topic Abbott & Costello Meet Frankenstein U/8 in forum 8mm Print Reviews at 8mm Forum.

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Posted by Brad Kimball (Member # 5) on June 14, 2005, 11:44 PM:

Ok....Universal 8 could have and should have been able to do a bang-up job with this digest, but instead they gave collectors horrific editing and a bad source print. As I understand it, Castle used 35mm materials and when they became U/8 the new echilon of management decided to use 16mm (probably from their rental stock). The digest begins at the costume party with Chick and Wilbur talking with Talbot in the locker room. Then we have Wilbur in the stock in Dracula's basement being readied for the operation. The rest is the 8 minute Castle version that we all know and love sans the scene where Dracula and Sandra are outside the cave discussing how Dracula doesn't want "the monster to have no will of his own - no fiendish intellect to oppose is mas-tor". It's such a bad digest. I actually bought 2 of them originally thinking that the first one I bought was defective in some way, but nope, they both look like garbage. The only nice thing is that U/8 used the original animated credits that were done by Walter Lantz of Woody woodpecker fame who was a contract animator when "Meet Frankenstein" was released back in 1948. I'd love to see reviews of the other A&C 400'ers being that I purposely avoided buying them after I saw the fiasco with this one. O'h and my "Bride of Frankenstein" 400'er has an audio drop-out that lasts for about 12 seconds. Some real crud U/8 was churning out. Did they do anything right or were they all on LSD? Word has it that some members of U/8 management were real druggies. How else do you explain a digest of "Electric Horseman" or "Nude Bomb"? I mean, C'MON?!

Posted by Jan Bister (Member # 332) on June 15, 2005, 12:23 AM:

Wow, sounds bad. [Frown]

I have two Universal 8 prints myself, one is A&C in "Who's On First" and it's actually quite good, no problem with the picture or sound quality there. Then I have a 2x400ft. digest of Steve Martin's "The Jerk" which is also of excellent quality. Surprisingly sharp print, too, and while the color is just beginning to fade, blues and greens are still very strong. They seem to have done their job on these two releases. Wonder if anyone else has had experiences with U-8, either good or bad, that they can comment on?

Posted by James N. Savage 3 (Member # 83) on June 15, 2005, 10:19 AM:

Thanks for that review Brad!

Jan- in reference to Universal 8, I did purchase several digests from them in the late 70's. As far as quality goes, I always thought they were the absolute best at the time. The films always played consistantly smooth in my cheap Eumig 802 back then. And the sound and colors were always perfect. On the 800 foot digests I bought, the editing was usually VERY GOOD! (with the exception of "Xanadu"). I also have the digest for "The Jerk", and it is a good example of very professional editing.

I think probably one of the problems with the 400 foot black and white U-8 horror classics, was that at the time, there probably wasn't much of a demand for the older B/W movies. U-8 was putting much more concentration and money into the newer movies, as was the trend during that year or two. Even though now, it is the black and white classics that are much more collectable and have not gone out of style, but aged quite well and stood the test of time.

As far as U-8's selections, I very much agree- What were they thinking?? Movies like "Incredible Shrinking Woman" and "Nude Bomb" were box office duds, so why did they think collectors would want to put out $120.00 to own a 30 minute version of these.

Of course, they also did made some good choices-"Jaws", "Hindenburg", to name a few.

It's a shame that the U-8's seem to be fading (color) the worst after all these years.

They are still very watchable though.

I think I'll do a review on "The Jerk" (coming soon) [Wink]

Nick.

Posted by Tom Photiou (Member # 130) on June 15, 2005, 02:30 PM:

I'll do a couple of U8 reviews a little later,Must admit "generaly" the cut downs are pretty well done, Picture quality is either very very good or soft-grain, two example of the later are Nothsea hijack,and Xanadu, both are ok but not outstanding in picture. Cant say ive come across duff sound on a U8 film. Editing, again, i find generally good, examples being Jaws 2x400, The island, National Lampoons animal house,Smokey & the bandit etc.
I do have the 400fts of A&C meet Dr Jekyl and A&C go to mars, Quality and editing is very good, sound is top notch.
the big downer is that quite a few U8 films are now prone to colour fade due to the crabby stocks used. A shame.
I do wonder why so few of there titles wern't released in scope. As far as i know only a few 400footers were done. [Wink]

Posted by Gary Crawford (Member # 67) on June 17, 2005, 07:59 AM:

Yes...many of the 400 foot black and white versions looked like dupes of the old Castles spliced together....none looked very good compared to their Castle ancestors. I was extremely pleased, however, with the two reelers of JAWS and Smokey and the Bandit. Both beautifully edited and the picture quality on my prints was good. Later, however, even the print quality of the later films was poor. I got a copy of the Incredible Shrinking Woman in a deal with some other films..and it was so soft and grainy that I only watched the first 400 feet ..and never saw the rest. It's still sitting up on the shelf. Hindenberg I have and it was edited well....a little on the soft side, but I prefer the two reeler to the entire long feature.

It's interesting about the extremely negative review of A & C Meet Frankenstein on this forum..... I just happend to read the review of the same release in last year's reel image publication...which was a glowing review.

Posted by Alan Gouger (Member # 31) on June 17, 2005, 11:12 AM:

Wow this was just on in Hi Definition on satellite on the HD Monster ch. It was broadcast in 4x3 ratio and it included the original trailer. A real treat. One of my favorites.
As much as the movie has some humor thrown in from A&C I found it more scary then most of todays horrors. I think it being in B&W makes it all the more scary.

Posted by Joe Taffis (Member # 4) on June 17, 2005, 04:05 PM:

I agree with Brad's review of U8's A&C Meet Frankenstein 400 footer 100%. I was really disappointed by it; not just the editing but the off frame stuff. The Castle 200' was much better. The publicity photo on the cover was great though....

Posted by Michael De Angelis (Member # 91) on June 17, 2005, 11:40 PM:

I once owned the 400' version of 'If I had a Million' with W.C. Fields.
Picture quality seemed grainey. Perhaps it was the gray contrast that made it appear soft. The editing of the story was not significant to the previous 200' extract. In fact, scenes with a millionaire acting wacky or hysterical as to what to do with his money was not edited very well. [Frown]

The only additional scene with Fields and Allison Skipworth, has Fields walking on camera with a chef's hat and wooden spoon to have dialog with Skipworth.
It's cute, but a throw away scene if anything at all.

The Castle versions of Pigskin Capers is poorly edited, with football plays that are reversed out of sequence. [Mad]

The digest also lacks humor, especially when Groucho speaks to the crowd in the grand stand. It's a brief moment, completely edited, which would have been fun. Instead we are left with repetitive action shots of football plays.

The Incredible Jewel Robbery was originally a half hour television special, hosted by Ronald Reagan. It would have been wonderful if this was released full length. The final Groucho one liner of the program was edited by too.
I just don't get it? [Confused]

Speaking of the Universal 8 Features, has anyone owned a print of Howard Huges' Scarface or Hells Angels?
How do those full length features compare.

Posted by Brad Kimball (Member # 5) on June 18, 2005, 12:58 AM:

Castle 200'ers, hmmmmmm? Without a doubt, Castle did the best job scaling down a 70+minute feature to 8.15 minutes. However, there were a few exceptions to the rule....I also was stunned to discover Groucho's (not to mention the entire episode's) only line of dialogue in "Jewel Robbery" removed. Castle's "The Wolf Man" is pretty cruddy. It's way too dark (at least my print is) and the narrative impossible to follow for anyone who has never seen "Wolf Man" full-length. Is the 400'er any better? The 2 extracts from "Ghost of Frankenstein" are fine up until the final 3 minutes and then it's all down hill from there. The "Trial of Frankenstein" ends with mish-mush editing resulting from Castle's intent to end the digest with the film's fiery finale. Instead, Castle should have just picked a relevant moment to fade to black and let the collector pick up the story with "Frankenstein's New Brain". The second extract, "New Brain" is only better in that the climax fits the digest. Both of these cullings suffer from choppy editing hampered by over-use of fades and wipes and the picture on both is very dark. The "House of Dracula" extracts weren't much better. In "The Wolfman's Cure", once again, the quick cropping to get us to the film's close and "House Of Dracula" suffers from poor scene selection save for Dracula's demise. For my next submission, I'll let you know how I feel about Ken Films' 200 product and what titles you should stay clear from which unfortunately is most of the entire catalog.

Posted by Brad Kimball (Member # 5) on June 18, 2005, 11:37 PM:

Ken can't hold a candle to Castle as far as cut-downs are concerned. The editing is simply awful and, like Columbia, they felt this necessity to have narration added to the mix. "The Raven" is pobably the best of the 200'ers I have seen. Oddly enough, the color has held up. "Planet Of The Apes" is ok, but not nearly as bad as "The Crimson Cult" which is dreadful. The story is completely destroyed and even the narration is wrong. In fact, the narration is so frequent that you hardly hear what any of the actors are saying. Karloff is in it for seconds and OMG it hurts to even discuss it. "Bucket Of Blood" is not bad. "Screaming Skull"... Well, all I can say is that I can't even make sense of it full-length so forget trying to understand a 7.5 minute digest of it. "Frankenstein Conquers The World" just plain sucks - again mish-mush. The silent cut-downs like "Taste The Blood Of Dracula" and "Frankenstein Must Be Destroyed" are actually not terrible - probably because there's no narration to drown out the dialogue. "Robin Hood" and "The Odd Couple" are only fair in that the editing and scene selection leave alot to be desired.

Posted by Tom Photiou (Member # 130) on June 20, 2005, 03:11 PM:

& the award to the worst ever castle 200footer without doubt goes to.............
High plains drifter, the mother of all balls ups, good quality though [Big Grin]

Changing the dialouge to remove the words of "your goin to look awfully scilly with that knife sticking up your your ass" to stickin in your ear is pretty much the hieght of feeble. I can only assume that Castle wanted to release it for nursery school audiences.
I hate censors advising adults what they should and shouldnt be allowed to see. The ones who watch it and decide are probably faggots with a nervous diposition [Big Grin]

oops, am i oversteppin my bowels? Anyway, Castle films 200footers, the editing generally sucks but i will give U8 a big hand for making up with there 2 x 400footers, especially the improved H P Drifter. (pity bout the colour fade [Big Grin]

)

Posted by Andrew Wilson (Member # 538) on February 21, 2006, 11:43 AM:

hi there,so universal8 suffers from poor editing.well they got it right with jaws 1x200ft.possibly the best cut down ever released on 8.the poorest editing jobs ive ever seen are fox/ken reguardless of lenght.andy.

Posted by John Hourigan (Member # 111) on February 25, 2006, 10:44 AM:

The U8 digests I own are primarily the Universal horror 400' digests and I think they are generally of very good quality, both in terms of the print and editing. They are certainly heads and tails above Ken and, thank goodness, minus the ignorant narration of the Columbia digests (which I avoid).

The later U8 releases (such as the BLUES BROTHERS) suffered from choppy editing (such as Ken) and didn't employ dissolves, wipes, etc. While I also have some Castle 200 footers, which are excellent condensations by and large, the 400' digests are more satisfying -- and sometimes more satisfying than the feature version!

Posted by Tony Stucchio (Member # 519) on February 25, 2006, 08:01 PM:

Back to the original topic of this thread...

Every time I watch my 400 foot A&C MEET FRANKENSTEIN, I'll be darned if I can remember 10 minutes of scenes not in the 200 footer from Castle. I have edited the "cave" scene into the 400 footer right after the main titles on my copy.

If I had been the editor for Universal 8 back in the late 70's, I would have started with the "House of Horrors" scene intact, with no cuts, and then finished with the scenes from the Castle extract. I am not sure, however, if that would have fit onto a 400 foot reel though.

Another possibility would be to start with the scenes where the boys explore the basement and only Costello sees the monster, then follow with the Castle scenes. Another option would be to use both new scenes that I have mentioned, and then call it a 2-reeler -- and continue to sell the Castle shorter version.

Or maybe start with the scene where Costello just misses seeing the Wolfman in the apartment, followed by... Oh heck! anything would have been better than what they came up with at Universal 8 back then.

And if Universal 8 really wanted to release full-length features, who advised them to release HELL'S ANGELS, THE CONQUEROR, and SCRARFACE, instead of A&C MEET FRANKENSTEIN, FRANKENSTEIN, and THE BRIDE OF FRANKENSTEIN? And did any one ever actually buy all (or any) of the chapters of PIRATE TREASURE?

Posted by Andrew Wilson (Member # 538) on March 07, 2006, 12:38 PM:

no i dont think many of those universal features were sold.andy.

Posted by Andrew Wilson (Member # 538) on May 03, 2006, 01:01 PM:

the wolfman 1x400footer is edited very well indeed.andy.

Posted by Joe Caruso (Member # 11) on May 04, 2006, 08:40 AM:

When I started buying these about 1963, it was the box-art first, then the flickering images on the tiny hand-viewer that sold me - Editing flaws or not, this was standard and sometimes ONLY fare that we kids had until the Super 8 days and even then we laughed at the way some of the scenes were arranged - I think I'm the longest-time old timer from CASTLE FILMS days, and I still buy them - Shorty

Posted by Kevin Wardle (Member # 1680) on August 12, 2009, 03:23 PM:

Well, my Wolfman (and I have 2 copies) are very good indeed. Nice prints with good sound! The 400ft is good too. I like the 200ft better though. FRANKENSTEIN'S NEW BRAIN is also good IMO, and I think all of my Castle/U8 200ft's are really good. As for Castle prints being dark, the only one I have that is dark is the 16mm print of FRANKENSTEIN'S MEETS THE WOLFMAN!

Best Kevin.

Posted by Marshall Crist (Member # 1312) on April 26, 2014, 07:36 PM:

I recently obtained a copy of the shorter Castle Films edit of A&CMF, having purposely avoided the longer U8 cut due to the negative comments here. It is great, but upon second viewing, I was surprised to notice several cuts I had failed to detect the first time around: Frankenstein's monster punching through the door, the boys barricading the door only to have it swing open in the other direction, "He thinks I'm Dracula," etc. Amazing that they cut this stuff--should have just had the last 8 minutes of the movie and be done with it. What's more, it doesn't sound like the 400' digest restores any of this material. (Or does it?)

Posted by Brad Kimball (Member # 5) on April 27, 2014, 10:23 PM:

Nope.....There's absolutely none of the scenes that film buffs, A&C fans or film critics love about this movie. No wax museum stuff (moving candle routine) Glenn Strange punching the door or Lon Chaney's near misses in the hotel room with Costello. Instead we get a digest that is a lazy patchwork of scenes that were sloppily strung together until we get to the final half which is basically the Castle 200'er just tacked on. O'h how I could go on and on about how miffed I was and still am to this day about what a bad digest U/8 gave film collectors.

Posted by Panayotis A. Carayannis (Member # 1220) on April 28, 2014, 02:08 AM:

Remember,the time U8 released the features (pre-video),was the time all companies tried for "something new",(i.e. Niles,with the Sherlock Holmes features and the Benedict Bogeaus color adventures,Columbia with Bye Bye Birdie and On the Waterfront).U8 released the Howard Hughes features.I have Scarface and Hell's Angels in excellent copies.As for Pirate's Treasure,which I also have in its entirety,it was a "recently found,lost serial" and the quality is tops.It was also a special treatment with transparent plastic boxes with a different cover for each episode (different photo and exact running time),plus a booklet with the episode synopses.

Posted by Joe Caruso (Member # 11) on April 28, 2014, 06:06 AM:

Always wondered why nothing was selected from either HOLD THAT GHOST or MEET INVISIBLE MAN - Shorty

Posted by Lee Mannering (Member # 728) on April 28, 2014, 06:40 AM:

For me it’s a wonderful 400ft watch on super 8 sound having obtained 50ft Std 8 silent reel in the 70’s and working on from that over the years. I find the 400ft Son of Frankenstein complements the programme nicely as well with UK showmen possibly slipping in Old Mother Riley Meets the Vampire for good measure.

Posted by David Ollerearnshaw (Member # 3296) on April 28, 2014, 02:46 PM:

Didn't Clint Eastwood stop any more digests of his films after seeing High Plains Drifter from Universal?

I don't recall any others from Universal, only from MGM and Paramount. Super 8 is sadly lacking Clint's films.

Also glad I'm not the only one to have Pirates Treasure, I find it quite fun to watch and the fights are great.

At least like has been mentioned no narrators on them.

I have a few Universal 8 titles and some were quite well edited, but the choice of titles was sometimes a little silly.

Abbott & Costello would be ideal for a 30 minute digest properly edited though. I always thought that 400ft 16 - 18 minutes was too rushed on most releases.

Posted by Brad Kimball (Member # 5) on April 28, 2014, 04:53 PM:

I will agree that not all the U/8 digests are bad. Son of Frankenstein was, I agree done well with good image quality and so was Buck Privates Come Home, but A&CMF surely deserved better treatment than what we got. Yes, Mr. Eastwood did hate what Castle did with the dubbing over the curse used in the line that Tom references and apparently refused to allow any more of his spaghetti westerns to be released to the home movie market. I actually think the Hitchcock digests were pretty good considering the brief running times, but certainly would have been better as 2-400'ers.

Posted by Marshall Crist (Member # 1312) on April 11, 2016, 10:27 PM:

Finally picked up a reasonably-priced and well-maintained copy of the 400' version of ABBOTT & COSTELLO MEET FRANKENSTEIN. I had seen the 200' version once when I was a kid, and was a little disappointed when I obtained a copy as an adult and realized that some of the gags were missing from the end sequence with all the monsters running around. While the 400' release is indeed not well-edited, at least those bits are included. Didn't think the picture quality was particularly bad, either.

Posted by Joe Caruso (Member # 11) on April 13, 2016, 04:32 PM:

Next, finding a gorgeous 16mm original

Posted by Joseph Randall (Member # 4906) on April 15, 2016, 07:52 PM:

Castle did more with the 200 footer than U8 did with their 400 footer.

Posted by James N. Savage 3 (Member # 83) on April 16, 2016, 10:00 PM:

I have always been very satisfied with the 200 foot version of this movie. Castle did such a great job with the editing and it flows well and makes for a great short. Ends nicely with the little Invisible Man cameo.

Posted by David Skillern (Member # 607) on April 17, 2016, 04:57 AM:

I know this thread was about a specific U8 release - I have quite a large selection of their 2x400 footers in my collection and one that I recently purchased from Ealing at £14 in its original packaging was the 2x 400ft of "The Nude Bomb" - now I know this release is like Marmite - you either love it or hate it - but having no preconceptions of this release - I watched it and for what it was - I found it to have some really good slapstick moments and good one liners - and the quality was good - I will post a review later.

Posted by Marshall Crist (Member # 1312) on April 17, 2016, 11:19 AM:

Excellent. I look forward to reading it.

Posted by Joseph Randall (Member # 4906) on April 17, 2016, 07:28 PM:

Would you believe that I look forward to reading it, too?

Posted by Ron Gerber (Member # 5396) on May 11, 2016, 02:37 PM:

The lack of Clint movies on Super 8 was mentioned. I've got a 3x400 Where Eagles Dare that is a great cut down of a movie that was over-long in the first place.
I still have a silent 200ft Castle digest of A&C Meet Frankenstein I've had since I was a kid. Image is sharp and I think it was extremely well edited.

Posted by Ricky Daniels (Member # 95) on May 12, 2016, 04:31 AM:

Hi Ron,
I too still have my 200' B/W Silent Std 8mm print purchased from Capitol Films in London. I'm surprised it survived my constant projection on a Kodak Brownie 8mm projector but my mates loved watching it over and over, and I would go over the Dracula transformation again and again to workout how it was made possible! I even recreated the transformation for myself, painstakingly drawing the animation frames, pinning them to a board one on top of the other and filming each, one frame at a time, on my 8mm clockwork camera... to my surprise (and a week after filming it!) I projected the film and it worked!!
Golden days.
Best,
Rick

Posted by Joe Caruso (Member # 11) on May 12, 2016, 02:45 PM:

Speaking of CAPITOL, I just bought 3 Sennett Keystones - All my years of collecting, have never seen the style-hinged box and nice covers - Says on each; #36, 37 and 38 - If anyone can post a list of the first 35 editions, and if any came after #38, I'll then know what to search for - Cheers, Shorty

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