8mm Forum: 2 Bladed mod Elmo GS1200?

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Topic: 2 Bladed mod Elmo GS1200?

Alan Rik
Film God

Posts: 2211
From: New York City, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted July 24, 2004 10:11 AM

How many of you here have your Elmo's modded with 2 blades? And do you remember if the improvement was worth the mod? And last but not least, how hard would it be for one to do it themselves?

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Paul Adsett
Film God

Posts: 5003
From: USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted July 24, 2004 01:09 PM

Hi Alan,
Yes I have installed a 2-bladed shutter on my GS1200 about 4 months ago, and the increase in screen brightness is very noticeable, and well worth the effort of doing the retrofit. I intend to do the same thing on my second GS when I can get around to it. Before I did it I e-mailed Kevin, and he pointed out a couple of things that I was unsure about. You will need to download a couple of pages of the GS1200 Service Manual. It's a little nerve wracking the first time you do it, as the whole "Engine Block" has to be pulled out to get at the shutter. Be prepared to devote the best part of a day doing it the first time. As you remove parts, lay them out on a table, and label them if necessary, so you reinstall in the correct sequence. While you have it apart, it's well worth the extra time to clean off the old grease and oil, and regrease , your projector will then run like a swiss watch for another 20 years!
Be aware that you will get very noticeable flicker at the 18fps setting, so if you are planning to show home movies or old 18fps silents, you should not do this mod. At 24 fps the flicker is not noticeable except when there is no film in the gate or if you project a very light print on a very small screen.
As I said the 2-blade makes a huge difference, particularly when projecting Scope prints.

--------------------
The best of all worlds- 8mm, super 8mm, 9.5mm, and HD Digital Projection,
Elmo GS1200 f1.0 2-blade
Eumig S938 Stereo f1.0 Ektar
Panasonic PT-AE4000U digital pj

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Tony Milman
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1336
From: United Kingdom
Registered: Jun 2003

posted July 25, 2004 03:17 AM

Alan

I had no problem in changing mine to a 2 balde and yes the difference is worth the effort.

Tony [Wink]

(well actually, Mr Elmo had no trouble!) [Big Grin]

--------------------
Tony

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Alan Rik
Film God

Posts: 2211
From: New York City, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted July 25, 2004 08:19 AM

Ok! I might be convinced. Where can i get the 2 Blades and Paul, where can i download the instructions? I am pretty good with my hands and things so I might give it a whirl.

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Paul Adsett
Film God

Posts: 5003
From: USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted July 25, 2004 09:14 AM

Hi Alan,
I believe you can download the GS1200 Manual from this web page:
ftp://ftp.filmshooting.com/upload/servicemanuals/
I have not tried this download as I have a copy of the manual, which you can buy from Old Timer Cameras in the UK for about $35.00. I strongly recommend that you buy the complete manual- it is loaded with exploded views, circuit diagrams, and instructions for complete servicing of the GS1200.
You can buy a 2-bladed shutter from Steve Osbourne at Reel Images at (937)-296-9036. What you get is just the flat 2-blade shutter, not the shutter already attached to the pulley. Be prepared for a shock- these shutters look like thay have been cut out of a tin can with a pair of metal cutters -they are hardly a precision mechanical part -but they work. You will have to file down the three rivet heads which attach the existing shutter to the existing pulley, remove the old shutter, and then epoxy the new shutter onto the pulley with an industrial strength epoxy such as Scotchweld 2216.
If you have any questions at all, I would contact Kevin, he can lead you thru the whole operation.

--------------------
The best of all worlds- 8mm, super 8mm, 9.5mm, and HD Digital Projection,
Elmo GS1200 f1.0 2-blade
Eumig S938 Stereo f1.0 Ektar
Panasonic PT-AE4000U digital pj

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Alan Rik
Film God

Posts: 2211
From: New York City, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted July 25, 2004 12:17 PM

Tin Can pieces? Ugggh. Is that the piece that everyone else is using? I would prefer to use something nicer if it is available. Have you seen the guy on Ebay who has the GS1200 with the 2 blade shutter but now the threading mechanism doesn't pop out?
I wonder if that will be me? [Frown]

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Kevin Faulkner
Film God

Posts: 4071
From: Essex UK
Registered: Jun 2003

posted July 25, 2004 04:11 PM

Hi Alan,
I buy the ones I use from Wittners in germany and they are specially manufactured for them. There are 3 studs that fix the original blade to the pulley and I simply file the heads off the studs untill the old shutter balde pulls off and then use superglue to put the new one on and hold it in place. Once the job is done its hard to tell it from the original factory fitted 3 blade shutter.
Yes it's really worth it as it gives an increase of 1/3 light output.
Paul's right though about the 18 fps speed. If you have film you want to use at 18 fps the flicker will be very noticeable.
Anymore questions then email me direct.

Kev.

--------------------
GS1200 Xenon with Elmo 1.0...great combo along with a 16-CL Xenon for that super bright white light.

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John Clancy
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1954
From: Cornwall
Registered: Jun 2003

posted July 26, 2004 10:00 AM

Don't be such a wimp!!! Just get an old corned beef can and cut out the shutter yourself. Remember to take the key off first though as this can come loose and thrash around inside the GS making a bit of a mess. It's also worthwhile cleaning off any jelly or excess fat before installing otherwise your fingers can become a bit slippy.

With 18fps, the bigger the screen, the less likely you are to pick up flicker.

--------------------
British Film Collectors Convention home page www.bfcc.biz. The site is for the whole of the film collecting hobby and not just the BFCC.

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Paul Adsett
Film God

Posts: 5003
From: USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted July 26, 2004 10:14 AM

Hi Alan,
Yes I agree with you that a precision 2-blade shutter would definately be preferable to Steve Osbournes "Tin Can" shutter, but remember that all the shutter has to do is block light, so a crude 2-blade can work just as well as a precision machined job, assuming it is reasonably well balanced. Perhaps Kevin can tell us about the quality of the Wittner's shutter- is it a hand cut job or a precision machined piece?

--------------------
The best of all worlds- 8mm, super 8mm, 9.5mm, and HD Digital Projection,
Elmo GS1200 f1.0 2-blade
Eumig S938 Stereo f1.0 Ektar
Panasonic PT-AE4000U digital pj

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Tony Milman
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1336
From: United Kingdom
Registered: Jun 2003

posted July 26, 2004 12:12 PM

Hi

I can confirm that the W's shutter is a well made precision piece which appears to have been pressed out rather than cut. It has the holes pre-drilled and is very balanced. Well worth a couple of extra euros

Tony

--------------------
Tony

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Kevin Faulkner
Film God

Posts: 4071
From: Essex UK
Registered: Jun 2003

posted July 26, 2004 03:25 PM

Thanks Tony, you got there before me. Yes Tony is right. It's a proper machined part as I said in my earlier post.

John, I would probably cut my fingers off if let loose with corned beef can. BTW havent you had a thread like this before?

Kev.

--------------------
GS1200 Xenon with Elmo 1.0...great combo along with a 16-CL Xenon for that super bright white light.

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John Clancy
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1954
From: Cornwall
Registered: Jun 2003

posted July 27, 2004 01:50 AM

Absolutely right Kevin, we have had a thread all about this. I don't think we ever got around to posting the engineering diagrams detailing the precision plans to manufacture aforementioned corned beef can into a two-bladed shutter.

By the way, Fray Bentos are the best.

--------------------
British Film Collectors Convention home page www.bfcc.biz. The site is for the whole of the film collecting hobby and not just the BFCC.

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Kevin Faulkner
Film God

Posts: 4071
From: Essex UK
Registered: Jun 2003

posted July 27, 2004 02:40 PM

Hee,Hee!

Actually you can get 2 shutters out of the "Ye Old Oak ham" tins. [Wink]

Kev.

--------------------
GS1200 Xenon with Elmo 1.0...great combo along with a 16-CL Xenon for that super bright white light.

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Brad Miller
Administrator

Posts: 525
From: Dallas, TX, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted July 27, 2004 03:02 PM

If anyone would like to send in pdf files of 8mm equipment manuals, feel free to email them to me. If you will go to my main site www.film-tech.com and click on MANUALS you will see there is quite a collection there for the 35mm and 70mm world and it has proven itself to be quite useful.

A 2 bladed shutter is well worth the trouble, by the way. [Cool]

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Ugo Grassi
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 506
From: Avellino (Italy)
Registered: Dec 2003

posted August 02, 2004 01:36 PM

I use these shutters:
http://cgi.ebay.it/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3320&item=5711751109&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW
It comes from one of my friends. He has a laser cutter machine, so the job is very well made!
Kevin, about the way (superglue) you use to put the shutter in place, I prefer to extract the original nails (by a hammer and others nails with the same diameter) and to hold the new shutter replacing them to their place.

--------------------
Bye
Ugo

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Kevin Faulkner
Film God

Posts: 4071
From: Essex UK
Registered: Jun 2003

posted August 02, 2004 06:36 PM

Ugo, Industrial grade Super Glue works very well and means that you dont have to belt the life out of the pulley to remove the original pins.

Kev.

--------------------
GS1200 Xenon with Elmo 1.0...great combo along with a 16-CL Xenon for that super bright white light.

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