8mm Forum: Storage of unexposed cine film

»	8mm Forum » 8mm Forum » Storage of unexposed cine film

UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!

Author

Topic: Storage of unexposed cine film

David Pannell
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1072
From: Horsham, West Sussex, UK
Registered: Nov 2004

posted January 19, 2005 11:32 AM

Hello again everyone.
I find myself in a dilemma regarding medium to long term film storage. Of the various film manufacturers' websites under their FAQs, about 50% say 'freeze' and 50% say either NO, or just 'refrigerate'.

Personally, I am currently storing unexposed film in a dedicated mini-freezer, and have also bought out of date film which has been stored frozen from new. Am I doing the right thing? 35mm colour and B&W slide and print film seem to be OK stored frozen. Any help, advice or suggestions gratefully received.

By-the-way, "Compliments of the Season" to all.

Best regards,

David.

--------------------
Dave.

Valves and celluloid - a great combination!
Early technology rules OK!

| IP: Logged

Kevin Faulkner
Film God

Posts: 4071
From: Essex UK
Registered: Jun 2003

posted January 21, 2005 03:26 AM

When I worked for Ilford Films we kept all our film in very cold fridges. I dont think however that we ever used freezers. I think that may be a tad over the top and could possibly cause problems with the emulsion crazing due to the differnt contraction/expansion properties between the base and emulsion.
Do make sure that you allow plenty of time for the film to reach room temp again.

Kev.

--------------------
GS1200 Xenon with Elmo 1.0...great combo along with a 16-CL Xenon for that super bright white light.

| IP: Logged

Mike Peckham
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1461
From: West Sussex, UK.
Registered: Jun 2003

posted January 21, 2005 12:35 PM

Hello David

On Kodaks web site there is a page about storing films; http://www.kodak.com/global/en/service/faqs/faq1631.shtml

With FAQs' including;

Would getting the temperature too low damage the film?
Although very low temperatures do not damage film, be sure to allow sufficient time for the film to come to room temperature before loading it into a camera. Conditioning times depend on the roll size and the ambient temperature and humidity of the surrounding air. A 100 ft.16 mm roll may take thirty minutes to come to room temperature, while a 1000 ft.35 mm roll may take up to 3 hours. Use gradual warming to reduce moisture spotting and to avoid condensation.

Kodak appear to agree with Kevin [Big Grin]

Mike

--------------------
Auntie Em must have stopped wondering where I am by now...

| IP: Logged

David Pannell
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1072
From: Horsham, West Sussex, UK
Registered: Nov 2004

posted January 21, 2005 01:18 PM

Dear Mike & Kev,

Many thanks for your responses. They do help to make things a little clearer, but it does still seem that it's a bit of a grey area, don't you think? I did read the Kodak FAQ (amongst others) as I said in my first posting on the subject, but haven't yet found a definitive answer, say, with recommended temperatures. I usually allow 12-24 hrs for the film to come to ambient temperature very gradually, as the freezer I am using is located in the garage, and I leave the films out there before bringing them indoors for loading. This obviously helps in avoiding condensation. I am specifically talking about the usual 25/50 ft Standard 8 reels and Super 8 cartridges, both colour and B&W. I guess that in the end, only time will tell. My small freezer holds steady at -20C, whereas a fridge would be around the +5 to +10C. Obviously, cold is good. "How cold" is the burning question. (Pun intended).

This whole question started when I bought some Kodachrome 40 and Ektachrome 160 Super 8 sound cartridges which had been stored frozen from new - so I continued to do the same. Although about 12 years out of date, they still yield good results, but I am just seeking confirmation that it's OK to continue in this vein.

Best to all,

Dave.

--------------------
Dave.

Valves and celluloid - a great combination!
Early technology rules OK!

| IP: Logged

Barry Johnson
Master Film Handler

Posts: 358
From: United Kingdom
Registered: Jul 2003

posted January 21, 2005 01:20 PM

I kept,and recently used,a 100ft roll of 16mm K40 that was just kept refrigerated and not frozen.
How far out of date??? Four years! [Eek!]

And yes,the results were very good too.
In a contradictory sort of way,the emulsions seemed to have 'warmed' with age.As its the same manufacture,Super8 would too be safe to use.

--------------------
Standard8 rules!!

| IP: Logged

David Pannell
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1072
From: Horsham, West Sussex, UK
Registered: Nov 2004

posted January 21, 2005 01:28 PM

P.S.

What I meant by not finding recommended temperatures, was that not every company recommends the same. Clearly, Kodak state -18C or lower for medium to long term storage, which is what I am currently doing, but it would be nice if everybody agreed. The secret definitely does seem to be in avoiding the condensation issue!

Dave.

--------------------
Dave.

Valves and celluloid - a great combination!
Early technology rules OK!

| IP: Logged

Maurizio Di Cintio
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 977
From: Ortona, Italy
Registered: Jan 2004

posted January 24, 2005 03:26 PM

I do, David.
Based on direct, personal experiences: I have several K40 Sound cartidges stored frozen since they were bought (not yet discontinued at the time): well they prove perfect every time I use them.
I'll tell you more, though I cannot completely vouch on this. I've recently acquired a Leicine Special which came with 5 K40 silent rolls sealed in tyhe original foil and one more in the cartridge compartment, ,partially used.
Well I finished shooting it and guess what: the part shot by the previous owner was highly desaturated and very poor in contrast: also it was sort of fogged. But the more recent footage I shot was a little better, though still far from being perfect. Upon inspection of edge codes for production tracking I discovered the film was sone 12 years outdated! In the mean while I kept the other rolls refrigerated (not forzen) for a few weeks. When I shot them they came out almost perfect.

--------------------
Maurizio

| IP: Logged

Kevin Faulkner
Film God

Posts: 4071
From: Essex UK
Registered: Jun 2003

posted January 24, 2005 04:55 PM

Maurizio, that effect is called latent image regression. All silver halide film suffers from this to some degree or another. The minute you actually expose a film the image starts to regress. This again can be halted by taking exposed material and then keeping it in a fridge till processing. The overall shift on the part you exposed was probably just casued by the age and storage conditions.

Kev.

--------------------
GS1200 Xenon with Elmo 1.0...great combo along with a 16-CL Xenon for that super bright white light.

| IP: Logged

David Pannell
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1072
From: Horsham, West Sussex, UK
Registered: Nov 2004

posted January 25, 2005 03:48 AM

What a lot I have learnt, and continue to learn, in the very short space of time that I have been a member of this Forum. Everyone seems really helpful, notwithstanding some of the humorous sarcasm and cynicism - excellent! It certainly adds to the lightheartedness and joy of our otherwise indulgent interest in things cinematic.

I was amused by Barry's end caption earlier in this subject - Barry, do you watch the reels and operation of the projector in preference to what is on the screen??

I should like to thank those contributors who have commented on the prolonged storage of film issue thus far, and am always pleased to hear further views and experiences.

Once again, best regards to all,

Dave.

--------------------
Dave.

Valves and celluloid - a great combination!
Early technology rules OK!

| IP: Logged

All times are Central

Printer-friendly view of this topic

UBB.classic^TM 6.3.1.2