8mm Forum: American in Paris

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Topic: American in Paris

Mike Peckham
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1461
From: West Sussex, UK.
Registered: Jun 2003

posted January 20, 2005 12:16 PM

I have several full feature Ken Releases and most of them are excellant prints that still have beautiful colours. However, American In Paris is very red, so much so that it is not pleasant to watch.

My question is two fold;

1/ are they all like this

2/ were there different film stocks used and if so which one should I look out for in order to stand a good chance of replacing my existing print with something with better colours?

Thanks

Mike [Cool]

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Auntie Em must have stopped wondering where I am by now...

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Trevor Adams
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 763
From: Auckland,New Zealand
Registered: Jun 2003

posted January 22, 2005 03:10 PM

I've had a couple of AinP prints,"fade" was evident but no pink.Bit of a mystery eh?trev

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Trevor

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Paul Adsett
Film God

Posts: 5003
From: USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted January 22, 2005 06:21 PM

Hi Mike,
I have the 400ft MGM digest of American in Paris. The colors are still there but it has definately pinked up over the years. Other MGM digests that I have also are showing a definite warming trend. I think probably the hot humid weather in Florida hastens color fade on the old Eastman prints. No problems at all though with Derann Agfa and Kodak color prints which seem unchanged after a decade or two.

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Mike Peckham
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1461
From: West Sussex, UK.
Registered: Jun 2003

posted February 09, 2005 12:36 PM

Thanks Chaps

Paul, I also have a 400fter of AinP which has good colours and it remains thoroughly watchable, I always think it is odd how some of those digests retain their original colours over two decades on and some are so pink that they are barely watchable.

I think somebody mentioned in an earlier thread that when these were being produced in large numbers MGM were using several different labs, with the result that some were processed and presumably 'fixed' better than others.

Trev', my full feature has definately turned pink which is a terrible shame as it remains one of my favourite MGM films, the good thing is though that the high spot of the whole film - that extended ballet sequence towards the end with the Gershwin score - is almost complete on the 400fter.

Mike [Cool]

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Auntie Em must have stopped wondering where I am by now...

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Trevor Adams
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 763
From: Auckland,New Zealand
Registered: Jun 2003

posted February 09, 2005 01:45 PM

This colour thing seems infinitly variable!Just been looking at VIVA LAS VEGAS.The first reels colour is stunning,the second reel is so-so,then the third reel is back to very good.All have been stored and used in exactly the same way. [Confused]

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Trevor

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Kevin Faulkner
Film God

Posts: 4071
From: Essex UK
Registered: Jun 2003

posted February 09, 2005 02:40 PM

Kodak I think were making tweaks to this print stock "on the run".
A lot of Photographic manufacturers did this. They would try something in the lab to get a better result and then slip them into production. I think this could be the reason why some reels of SP look better that others. It's been noted that some very later batches of SP prior to the release of LPP are also holding up very well and that is probably because the later batches of SP have the same Emulsion tweaks as used in the LPP.
Dont forget that Kodak probably didnt really expect film on these materials to be kept so long. Those print stocks were made mainly for release prints which were probably only going to have a relatively short life before being junked. Agfa, Fuji and Kodak all have their own types of Colour Couplers (Dyes) and it's obvious which companies had the better technology in that respect.

Kev.

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