8mm Forum: How to clean/lubricate?

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Topic: How to clean/lubricate?

Sam James
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 114
From: London
Registered: Oct 2005

posted December 27, 2005 02:47 PM

Now, I'm trying to avoid being spoon fed and have looked back through the forum over the many posts regarding cleaning and lubrication, but there is so much information that ultimately it becomes impossible for a novice to differentiate his arse from his elbow.
Last week an Elmo ST 1200 arrived with a clunk on my doorstep as did my first two features - The African Queen and Jungle Book. Have watched the former and peeked at the latter prior to a showing for my best mates sprogs next weekend.
The projector appears to work beautifully but there are certain extraneous noises that could do with being sorted.
In order to limit spool changes I bought some Elmo 1200ft reels which appear to put some kind of excess load on the machine as when I use a smaller 400ft take up spool, a medium pitch whinning sound disappears. Equally, when the motor is set in motion, its hums away nicely and yet occasionally, when the lamp is turned on, there will be a high pitched whine-come-rattle as though something small is vibrating with the extra heat (?). A quick blast with compressed air seems to get rid of this, so I can only assume it's dust. The music in the opening minutes of the Jungle Book has the wow and flutter I would associate with mucky tape heads.
I digress. In looking through the forum to solutions to these noises, I discovered that the film, itself, needs to be both cleaned and lubricated. I've worked out what sort of products to use, but haven't seen how to actually do it. So here's my shopping list of questions that I'd be grateful for any help with:
1. Can I clean the sound head with a cotton wool bud and some cassette head cleaner? Bearing in mind that I don't have instructions for my machine and therefore don't actually know what the sound head looks like!
2. When I open the machine up, can I give it a good old squirt with WD40 (power off) or is will that cause damage to anything?
3. Do I sit with a bucket of "crestaclean" or whatever in my lap and simply smear it over the films?
4. How often should I do this?

Once again, I am trying to sift through all your comments myself, but given how expensive a hobby this potentially is, I would rather learn by your mistakes, if you see what I mean!
Thanks again, Sam

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Sam James
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 114
From: London
Registered: Oct 2005

posted December 28, 2005 04:17 AM

To all and sundry.
Please ignore the above post,as I think I've managed to piece together a plan of action based on the back catalogue of posts.
I do, however, have a headache from staring at this blasted computer screen for the last two hours.

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Tony Milman
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1336
From: United Kingdom
Registered: Jun 2003

posted December 28, 2005 02:19 PM

Sam,

\never be afraid of raising these questions -it is a friendly forum and you won't get shot down in flames becasue all of us who have found our elbows but are still looking for our arses will be happy to help (even those who have disappeared up our own arses!)

You raise a valid point and perhaps our moderators will consider a "sticky" or FAQ post on these most often asked questions?

Firstly, don't squirt WD40 into your projector. the nylon gears should never need lubricating (so I have been told). Mineral grease I believe can be harmful and from what I have read it seems a specialist grease is the best to be used.

Personally i use an alcohol based cleaner, such as Derann's, to clean the sound head and associated rollers. A cotton bud gently passed over the heads in a left to right direction only does the trick. I then tend to go over it with a little furniture polish and use this also on the guides and rollers. the head lies in the film path after the gate and just before the big brass roller and rubber pinch wheel. You will see that above it a guide moves up and down as the film is switched on and off. there are 4 black pads that need to be watched to make sure they don't wear and scratch the film.

Cresclean is from what I can tell basically a paraffin based solvent and someone I know and whom I would hold in high authority has suggested that if this is the case it can affect the claw of the projector if over applied. As you will have gathered there is a hot debate over what to apply to a film surface to ensure a smooth projection. The debate is as much around the risk of long term damage to the film itself but there must also be a risk of prolonged useage on the now more fragile plastic components of the projector itself.

You will have seen everything from WD40 to Armorall wipes to baby oil and the now legendary Thermofilm. WD40 is the most hotly contested of all. I think whatever you decide to use, do it sparingly and infrequently and be aware of what you might do to the film.

Apply with a soft cloth (lint free) and check the surface of the film to see that you are coating evenly as the film is wound slowly through rewinds.
Moreover, enjoy fiddling around and just sell the films on ebay before you damage them forever (that was a joke by the way)

--------------------
Tony

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Jan Bister
Darth 8mm

Posts: 2629
From: Ohio, USA
Registered: Jan 2005

posted December 29, 2005 07:57 AM

Just fill a bathtub with FilmRenew and dump your projector and films in there overnight.

Of course that was another joke. [Big Grin]

--------------------
Call me Phoenix. *dusts off the ashes*

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Mark Norton
Master Film Handler

Posts: 330
From: Hampton Hill, Middlesex, U.K.
Registered: Feb 2004

posted December 30, 2005 05:23 AM

I recently cleaned a feature with crestaclean and through a mix up of the reels ended up cleaning the first half of the feature twice. Now there were a few lines and minor scratches on this but after the accidental TWO trips through a spondon film cleaner and another to get some of the creataclean back off I was surprised at the result on projection, no lines or scratches. The only downfall was the strong smell of the crestaclean which was bad on projection and caused complaints from my audience.
Obviosly this print was well "overdone" and when some of the crestaclean evaporates off I expect some of the scratches to show through again.
Have not noticed any problems with the claw as yet, (or is this a long term thing?)
Used thermofilm in the past which I thought was the best, but as it is no longer available now use crestaclean allthough I am not happy with the strong smell. Does anybody else use a spondon film cleaner and if so what film cleaning solution?

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Kevin Faulkner
Film God

Posts: 4071
From: Essex UK
Registered: Jun 2003

posted December 30, 2005 09:05 PM

Get yourself a film editor or rewind arms and pass the film gently from reel to reel in a lint free cloth soaked with your favourite cleaner/lube. Cresclean from Classic Home Cinema is a good substance as is Filmrenew and Filmgaurd. I now use WD40 but use it liberally as a little goes a long way.
Never as Tony says, spray WD40 into the innards of your ST as you will do more harm than good.
Use some Isopropyl Alcohol which you can buy from most chemists to keep the film path clean. Make sure you pay attention to the rubber pinch roller and brass capstan when cleaning the film path.

Kev.

--------------------
GS1200 Xenon with Elmo 1.0...great combo along with a 16-CL Xenon for that super bright white light.

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Tony Milman
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1336
From: United Kingdom
Registered: Jun 2003

posted December 31, 2005 04:51 AM

Mark,

It is interesting about the removal of lines from the print albeit temporary. Originally I had a bottle of Cresclean that was not as pungent as the later batches and did a fantastic job at fine line removal. However, the more recent product has obviously had a formula change and in my opinion is no where near as good at holding back the lines except in a wet gate projection which caused an evacuation of the cinema (aka lounge) when I tried it recently.

I assume the claw issue (if I heard the gentleman correctly) is a long term use issue. I hope I understood him correctly! He is a mine of information and I believe he reads this forum but doesn't contribute. If you are reading this and would like to correct these urban myths I would be delighted to post on your behalf? It is a great shame that we are not benefiting from your experience

--------------------
Tony

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Kevin Faulkner
Film God

Posts: 4071
From: Essex UK
Registered: Jun 2003

posted December 31, 2005 06:42 AM

Tony, I have never heard of a claw issue with Elmo's on Lubed film [Eek!]

The only thing I can think of is the claw tip getting gummed up with a stcky mess?
You had better enlighten us on this one please.

Kev.

--------------------
GS1200 Xenon with Elmo 1.0...great combo along with a 16-CL Xenon for that super bright white light.

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Sam James
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 114
From: London
Registered: Oct 2005

posted December 31, 2005 12:17 PM

Thanks gentlemen, for your suggestions, as a result of which I've dipped my projector in a vat of alcohol. The head was indeed covered in what looked like rust and whilst I was rummaging around down there I discovered that the reason the film counter didn't work was that it's drive belt had slipped off. After much cursing and straining I managed to get the tiny bleedin' thing back on, but not before I came to the slightly contentious conclusion that since my sausage-shaped fingers were hopelessly inadequate, there is definitely a case for enforced child labour. Does anybody have a contact number for Head of Personnel at Nike???
Tony's dead right. If there were some way of setting up a Frequently Asked Questions page it would enable the Elders of the tribe to discuss matters of a higher nature without having to respond to the ramblings of idiots like me. 'Cos although you're all very helpful and friendly, it's not difficult to imagine a collective web-based sigh of indignation when I ask which end of the projector should be pointing at the screen?
Happy New Year!

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Douglas Meltzer
Moderator

Posts: 4554
From: New York, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted December 31, 2005 12:41 PM

Screen?

Doug

--------------------
I think there's room for just one more film.....

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Sam James
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 114
From: London
Registered: Oct 2005

posted December 31, 2005 12:43 PM

How very droll.
Sam

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Douglas Meltzer
Moderator

Posts: 4554
From: New York, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted December 31, 2005 01:18 PM

The FAQ suggestion makes perfect sense. I'll raise the subject at the next moderators' convention. (We'll need a bigger place than last year.....I've put on weight.)
This section might include links to previous discourse on such popular topics as film cleaning & lubrication, re-recording soundtracks from DVDs, using a 250w bulb in the GS-1200, and why isn't O'Reilly responding to my e-mails?......

Doug

--------------------
I think there's room for just one more film.....

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Kevin Faulkner
Film God

Posts: 4071
From: Essex UK
Registered: Jun 2003

posted January 01, 2006 07:08 PM

Its a good idea Doug but I do think that the O'Reilly one is a more serious problem.
Unfortunately he's been very busy destroying film for a UK TV company [Frown]

and no he cant get any out the door before anyone asks. I have asked him this myself.
The best thing is to call him on the phone about 6pm UK time.

Kev.

--------------------
GS1200 Xenon with Elmo 1.0...great combo along with a 16-CL Xenon for that super bright white light.

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