8mm Forum: ELMO ST-600M sound problem

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Topic: ELMO ST-600M sound problem

Terry Lagler
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 525
From: Ontario, Canada
Registered: Apr 2008

posted September 04, 2008 09:30 AM

Hello all
I've recently got a hold of the above mentioned projector and after some major dusting, cleaning and replacing the upper drive belt she projects beautifully.
I put my first sound film through and lo and behold, no sound!
Now I've tried the obvious I think:
1. setting the track 1, 2 and mix button
2. silent/ sound switch

It seems like a hear a slight hum when the sound mode is chosen so something is going on I just don't get anything not even a low volume.

There are a couple of fuses inside that look fine and the sound heads look like they lower on to the film when the sound button is engaged.

I'm hoping an ELMO expert may be able to give me an idea as to what to look at next.

Cheers
Terry

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Martin Jones
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1269
From: Thetford , Norfolk,England
Registered: May 2008

posted September 04, 2008 10:45 AM

Terry,
What do you mean by "when the sound button is engaged"??? Also,
look at the posts from yesterday on the problem with an ST-180E,(ST-180 Motor speed control) it's the same machine. Towards the end there are posts on sound problems as well. If following those doesn't get you anywhere, post again or email me.

Martin Jones

--------------------
Retired TV Service Engineer
Ongoing interest in Telecine....

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Maurice Leakey
Film God

Posts: 5895
From: Bristol. United Kingdom
Registered: Oct 2007

posted September 04, 2008 11:17 AM

Terry

You haven't been pressing the RED button have you?

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Maurice

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

Posts: 7016
From: Long Island, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted September 04, 2008 11:31 AM

No!, not the RED button!

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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Martin Jones
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1269
From: Thetford , Norfolk,England
Registered: May 2008

posted September 04, 2008 12:22 PM

Please, not the RED button!

Martin

--------------------
Retired TV Service Engineer
Ongoing interest in Telecine....

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Terry Lagler
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 525
From: Ontario, Canada
Registered: Apr 2008

posted September 04, 2008 12:49 PM

Martin
There is a switch labeled "Silent" and "M" (with an icon of a film frame with soundtrack)This is what I was referring to when I said the sound button was engaged.

Haven't touched the dreaded RED button.
The REC embossed on it was a clear indication to what that does.ha ha

I'll take a look at the ST-180E post and see what I can come up with.

Cheers
Terry

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

Posts: 7016
From: Long Island, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted September 04, 2008 01:16 PM

OK, all fears of the red button aside, it may be just the time to push it.

(If it makes you feel any better, wear a welder’s mask!)

The red button is the record key. Since most machines spend 99% of their lives in playback mode this is rarely used, so the contacts build up oxides and the volume slowly dies out. It's an amazing thing: on my Elmo it kind of creeps up on me, until one day I realize I'm all the way up to full blast on the volume control and still not getting enough Watts in the speaker. If I let it go too far, there is no sound at all.

The thing to do is turn everything off (even better, unplug it), depress the record key about 10 times and then try it out.

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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Martin Jones
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1269
From: Thetford , Norfolk,England
Registered: May 2008

posted September 04, 2008 01:31 PM

Steve,
Good thought, and I agree with contact problem. But, on that machine there are two red buttons, or to be precise, one red BUTTON and one red KEY.
The red BUTTON gives instant record by operating microswitches which are not involved in playback, so their contacts can't affect playback. It also acts as a latch to:
1. allow the red KEY to be depressed; this is the one which operates the Rec/Play switch contacts when pessed down fully, and
2. to latch the KEY in the down position when the BUTTON is released.
Therefore, the required action is...
Press the red BUTTON in with the left hand AND HOLD IT IN.
Then press the red KEY down fully several times, its spring will return it up between presses. Say, 10 or 20 times?
Then release the red BUTTON.

Switch everything back on and see what happens.
Martin

--------------------
Retired TV Service Engineer
Ongoing interest in Telecine....

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Terry Lagler
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 525
From: Ontario, Canada
Registered: Apr 2008

posted September 04, 2008 01:35 PM

STEVE!!!

So simple yet so brilliant!!
I took your advice then threaded a film and had a crackle of sound.
I let the film run through did it again combined with a quick back and forth of the sound/silent switch and lo and behold I have a ELMO with booming sound.

Steve, you have done your good deed for the day.
My heartfelt THANKS.
Terry

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

Posts: 7016
From: Long Island, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted September 04, 2008 02:27 PM

Excellent!

Martin, I agree with what you are saying about the button/key. I'm able to get this result by pushing the key only (sorry for the confusion).

Terry, I like to do this fully powered down because:

1) With film in the machine, pushing the record key can put a blip on the sound track

2) Pushing the key when powered up and with the volume turned up, the machine makes this abrupt noise that makes my wife say "What on Earth are you doing down there?!!" and makes the cat run for the basement!

If you do it every time you happen to remember to, you won't see (or hear, or NOT hear) this problem again. It's kind of like checking your oil!

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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Terry Lagler
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 525
From: Ontario, Canada
Registered: Apr 2008

posted September 04, 2008 02:40 PM

Steve and Martin
I will be using both pieces of advice as they seem to do the trick. I love the simple solutions!

Thanks for the extra things to keep in mind also, Steve.

Funny, I hear similar comments from my wife also, luckily I'm the only one home right now as I did have the volume up a tad high.
Cheers
Tery

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Kevin Faulkner
Film God

Posts: 4071
From: Essex UK
Registered: Jun 2003

posted September 04, 2008 05:46 PM

Steve, I have to come in here and say "Why have film in the machine"? then you can put the machine in forward with the vol up and wait to hear the desired effects of the contacts cleaning as you will certainly hear some hum as the sound comes back.

On the GS1200 you have to have the machine running in forward with no film as all the switches are controlled with relays and wont operate without power.

I have said this many times before. Its a good idea to put all machines into the full record position every time they are used as it will keep the contacts clean. It only takes a second to do and doesnt need film threaded to do it. I would do this on all machines not just Elmo's.

Just a small but valuable tip...take it or leave it!

Kev.

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GS1200 Xenon with Elmo 1.0...great combo along with a 16-CL Xenon for that super bright white light.

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Steve Klare
Film Guy

Posts: 7016
From: Long Island, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted September 04, 2008 06:44 PM

Hi Kev,

Here and there I find myself without enough volume and realise that I need to clean the contacts, but I'm already threaded up and 30 seconds into a reel. Rather that risk putting a pop in the track I stop, power down, work the contacts and power up and roll film.

Doing it with film in it isn't my first choice, but then again I'd choose to have all my flat tires in my driveway if I could!

On my machine the record key is almost always the problem and I can work that powered down.

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All I ask is a wide screen and a projector to light her by...

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