NEW USER. 16mm Projector buyers guide

[Ted Bennett]

I have been a 8mm collector for a few years now, but I have decided to make the jump to 16mm. I'd love some recommendations on 16mm projectors. I've seen that B&H 1500 - 2500 machines are good, but what's the general views on a good projector. I don't need anything massive, it'll be for home use and the occasional movie night. I was a cinema projectionist for a few years so happy to get a manual laced up machine but autofeed would also be nice.

Thanks in advance, Ted

[Alan Paterson]

I'd try to avoid Bell & Howell TQ1 - TQ3 machines. They're quite nice but there is a nylon plastic worm gear buried in the internals that is prone to cracking with age or exposure to the wrong kind of grease. To replace it means taking everything out, so best to save yourself a lot of grief. Apart from that they're nice, robust machines - or they were in their day.

[Ted Bennett]

So if people are selling one with a new gear, that’s the one they are talking about, I am guessing. Thanks for the advice!

[Alan Paterson]

As long as there is some evidence that it really has a new worm gear fitted. I bought a TQ3 years ago that was supposed to have a new gear fitted. It cracked 3 months later. Not everyone out there is honest.

[Nantawat Kittiwarakul]

No idea about your situation, but for me I'd prioritize serviceability above anything else. It should be the one that all main components are easily accessible. No special tools/equipment/skills needed to do service work.

In that case the projector of my choice would be Eiki - any model of that. 😀

Comparing to B&H Eiki would have about half of parts count. You'll need no special tools for any assembly/disassembly/service work. Some simple task such as changing motor belt requires NO TOOLS at all. And since the worm gear is metal it won't crack, forever.😉

[Ken Finch]

Eiki or Elf is quite a good choice in many respects. There are quite a few around in the u k as many local authorities supplied them to schools instead of the Bell and Howells although many of those were also used. The plastic worm wheel was a big mistake. Personally I do not like self threading projectors. They are never 100% reliable. As you are an ex projectionist a slot loading or manual loading Eiki would probably be your best bet. Be careful with EBay though, prices are extortionate. My personal favourite is the Cine technic Debrie D16. The downside is its weight. For someone with some technical skills however it is so easy to maintain, being built on a modular system, has 24 tooth sprockets and triple claw. All mechanical parts are interchangeable irrespective of the model. There are also plenty of them about and also the original lamps as many of them were used by the R A F, Navy, and cruise ships as well as 16mm cinemas.😊

[Nantawat Kittiwarakul]

Ah, totally forgot about that auto loading issue.😅

My NT-2 auto loading simply sucks. Unless you have a few feet of totally damage-free leaders attached, it will just chew up everything you feed in. Even with good fresh leaders it would still sometimes chew it anyway. After fussing it around for ages I eventually gave up and have all auto loader guides/parts removed, then use it exclusively as a manual loading ones instead. Oh it works brilliantly that way.😆

IMHO other than Hokushin projector with its unique auto feeding arm system, I'm yet to see any auto loader projector with solid/reliable performance at all. So yes, go for slot-loader models.

[Martin Davey]

In reality you may need more than one projector. I have a number of B&H/ ELFs. The elf's are easy to maintain - the B&H are quite the opposite. However the ELFs are a bit unsophisticated in comparison to B&H.
Both types can play a good condition print well. Prints that have been through the mill however can be troublesome going through an ELF, mainly because they only have 2 claw pull down whereas the B&H have 3 claw. Of course a print should always be checked for bad splices/ torn perforations before shown on anything and repaired accordingly. Some prints during their life have received terrible damage to the sprockets and even when professionally repaired, ELFs don't like them, and can damage them further. The B&Hs are more torrent of worn prints and don't add further damage. This means in my collection some prints are for showing only on a B&H.
One thing I also like about ELFs is that quite a few models are manual load, whereas I've yet to see and manual load B&H TQ3. A good leader is a requirement for B&H.
16mm projectors are all large and heavy.

[Ted Bennett]

Thank you everyone! this has helped

[Simon Wyss]

One of the best 16-mm. film projectors is the Bell & Howell Filmo, model 57. Robust, with an open film path that can be kept clean, oil lubrication. Filmosound are of equal quality.

Very short contact surfaces between apparatus and film you have with an RCA-400.

The Ampro KS has good image steadiness, V belt, good access to clean everything.

From Germany we have the Siemens & Halske 2000 with V-belt drive, switchable shutter, stroboscope, perhaps a questionable motor speed control system. What concerns film guidance and maintenability a good projector.

Not to underestimate some Italian makes: Ducati, Riber-Ro-To, Microtecnica, Fumeo

From France we have the various Buisse-Bottazzi at the side of others that are acceptable.

Hard to find the Diksi-Tfp. (Tonfilmprojektor) from Switzerland, made in 1938. The Roice among the claw projectors, its only weakness is a thick-flat-belt variable drive. The Dixi (same company) Opéra was often used together with a Strong Junior carbon-arc lamp, a cinema COMOPT unit. Very good performance with the motor as weakest link in the chain. The motor is best swapped by a modern one. Else V-belt drive, three-blades shutter.

ALMO was a Czech licence product to the Ampro KS. Same for Oehmichen and OGCF. Cheaply available today Ukraina, a Soviet product for the rough rural service.

Paillard-Bolex-S series are nice but have plastic gears.

The S means Stay away from plastic.

[Terry Sills]

I have had many different 16mm projectors, but only one stands out as my favourite - the Debrie D16 with ‘V’ gate. Zero contact with the film emulsion as the unique’V’ gate grips just the edges of the film. Easy thread film path and modular construction so easy to work on. Some mention that the motor start windings sometimes burn out if not periodically examined and serviced, but I never experienced that and even if it does happen the motor can still be started with a quick spin of the inching knob at the rear. Only downside, three heavy units plus separate speaker.
Preferred by the UK armed forces, back in the day, which speaks volumes.

[Ken Finch]

Terry, we seem to be very much in agreement about the Debrie. See my post. I would add however that the original standard gate is also relieved over the picture and sound areas of the film. I have known the vee gate to have problems with bad splices. I would also add that the amplifiers were based on Mullard hi fi circuitry, both octal and the later valve versions. One other problem with them was oil leakage. This was usually caused by using the oil which was too fine. Easy to cure with gasket goo and a thicker grade oil. The oil leaks tended to find their way to the amplifier if not cured in time. There are plenty Debries on e bay but at highly inflated prices.😊

[Terry Sills]

Ken
Yes seems we are very much like minded. I never had a problem with splices though and as for oil leakage, easily curable as you say. Fabulous machines but unfortunately not easy to find a treasured, well looked after one at a sensible price.

[Ken Finch]

Ted, I still have the projectors I listed awhile ago. If you have basic engineering and electrical skills the 2 Debries in particular may be of interest to you. They are available with a number of spare lamps, probably enough to last a lifetime. Send me a private message if you are interested for contact details and further information.