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Bolex and Eumig introduction...

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  • Bolex and Eumig introduction...

    Hi
    I am sorting out some ideas for showing 8mm films taken by my Father in the late 1950's through to the late 1970's mostly of the family growing up, and looking at ways to project and archive to digital medium for my children. Earliest memories are of Dad using a Bell and Howell Sundial camera, later changing to an Eumig C3M. I remember visiting the camera shop in the local town and viewing the Eumig and an Admira 8F​ to choose a replacement for the Bell and Howell around 1960. At this time an Eumig P8 projector was acquired, and I remember the film shows of the returned film in the yellow envelopes, and being trusted sometimes with the hand crank for the rewinding of the film to the spool.

    The P8 projector is still with me, along with a collection of film, at sometime spliced into long 400ft lengths, which are waiting to be shown to the family again, and also to be archived to a digital medium - advice sought for this last task.

    The P8 has been pressed beck into service, the gooey belt replaced, the machine oiled and cleaned, and tested without film.

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    Investigating local on-line markets, I found a Bolex 18-5 for a sensible price, and I have realised it was converted to include the sound synchronizer, which was an optional extra (£25) at the time of purchase, (or I guess as a factory service after purchase), which included the conversion work on the projector and the 18-5 Synchronizer Unit to attach to a tape recorder. The projector is listed at £60 in a 1964 Wallace Heaton Blue Book.​

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    This is the view inside the back cover. I have not come across this before in my search for pictures of the Bolex 18-5.
    I have more detailed pictures, and will show if anyone is interested.

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    Some time ago I collected an early Leitz Cinovid projector which is very compact and runs very smoothly and quietly, and takes the large 400ft spools.
    Browsing through the new forum posts I have not found much talk here for the Cinovid. I have looked at the old forum bet have not found a way to search.

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    Perhaps I should add I have a Eumig Mark 502D, which I forget how or why came to me, but this also uses the 'spaceman' bulbs

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    The Bolex and the Cinovid use the 8v 50w so called 'spaceman' or 'divers' lamp which as many of you will know are very expensive in the UK, and I would be interested in a conversion unit.

    Has anyone tried to use a LED conversion for their projectors?
    Has anyone a cheaper source of the 'spaceman' bulbs for these projectors?


    Thanks, I will think of more to add I am sure, as I explore.

    Thanks



  • #2
    Chris,

    Thank you for your post. To search our old site, please click on the "Forum Archive" link at top left on this page. On the GOF (Grand Old Forum) you'll find the search link at top of the page.

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    After clicking on that, you'll be taken to the search page where you can enter search terms.

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    I did not find any posts about the Leitz Cinovid​ projector. For transferring to digital, please check out our
    Film to Digital Conversion​ sub forum.

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    • #3
      Thank you Douglass, my previous route was via duckduck...
      Now I have a task ahead....
      And I have now found the Film to Digital Conversion topics, another task...

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      • #4
        Hi Chris, welcome to the forum. Whereabouts in Kent are you? As a 90+ year old “cine maniac “ I am not as mobile as I used to be but may be able to advise you.😉

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        • #5
          Oh, that beautiful Eumig P8, which was my introduction, as a child, into standard 8mm!🥰

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          • #6
            My first 6mm projector too Osi! I remember the P8 being a ground breaking projector at the time. It used a low voltage, compact filament, 100w lamp which was as bright or brighter than most 500w lamp projectors of the time. The sliding gate design ensured precision alignment of the lens to the film, and the two reel front and back design resulted in a very modern appearance compared with most 8mm projectors that had two reels at the front. Eumig advertised it " as bright as a cars headlight", which it was, although not nearly as bright as the later Halogen lamps ( which incidentally Eumig were the first to use in their projectors).
            I had many happy hours showing off films to my friends and family on the little P8. It was onlu a few months after purchasing the P8 that I had scraped up a few quid to be able to buy the bolt-on Phonomat adaptor so that I could synchronize the projector to a Phillips tape recorder for music, commentary, and sound effects.
            Just a wonderful little machine that put Eumig squarely on the map as the Worlds largest manufacturer of home movie projectors.

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            • #7
              If one doesn’​t need faster speed than 18 fps, the Eumig P 8 is one of the best 8-mm. projectors. It has a strictly straight pulling two-prongs claw (register to optical axis +3/4), the light-dark ratio of 2.6 to 1, a lens receptacle of 24 mm in diameter that can be enlarged to 25 or an inch, and it loads really fast. Lateral film guidance is positive and geometrically in accordance with the ANSI norm. You have excellent image steadiness and a lot of light from it.

              The P 8 also has a few disadvantages such as that the condenser lenses are rigidly mounted, buried under a mass of other things, or a rather inefficient blower. The gear train can’t be lubricated from outside contrary to the main group which has oil holes. For the use of a P 8 today a thorough overhaul is indicated, I should like to say.

              The Phonomat accessory or the Phonomatic models feature a simple rheostat setup that keeps the motor around some speed but is far from a lip-synch capable system. I have made a few shorts of ten to fifteen minutes and must say that image and sound have drifted apart from each other by five seconds after ten minutes. Up to three or four minutes it can work satisfactorily but never over a 400-foot reel.

              The fixed focal length lenses of Eumig are good although not better than a Wollensak or a Kodak. The Eumig zoom projection lens distorts in cushion form.

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              • #8
                Simon, thanks for your comments. The P8 was the projector my Father purchased I think in 1960, and the family spent many hours watching the family movies. At some time later my Father spliced many of the reels into long (up to 400 feet) lengths on spools, and it is these that I am revisiting (before it is too late!).

                Have you some information that might guide me in a proper overhaul to re-lubricate the main gear train please?

                I have attended to the routine and accessible red marked oil ports, but will need some guidance to go further in any dismantling for access to the main drive chain.

                It was knowing the P8 had never been used since the late 1960's that prompted me to buy the Bolex 18-5 a year or two ago to show the spools of film again understanding the rather simpler mechanism might be more easily serviced, and it was a surprise for me to find it was equipped for tape recorder Synchronizer Unit which is no use for me as it happens. I long since sold on my tape recorders, indeed having has a very nice Ferrograph at one time.

                Maybe it is better to find a new home for this Synchronised Bolex 18-5 where the Synchronizer Unit will be properly used.

                Would you say the Bolex Synchronizer Unit a better solution to the Eumig Phonomat (which I do not have anyway).

                My P8 has the fixed focus Eumig Eupronar f1.4 20 mm lens.

                I have not tested any of the large spools yet, as I do not want to ruin the precious footage with my impatience. I have run a 50 foot reel as received from Kodak in the Bolex, but I was just watching the film through the gate to check smooth safe running, - no screen and in bright conditions, so I cannot say anything about the image quality of the Bolex.

                Thanks, look forward to further comments...

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Ken Finch View Post
                  Hi Chris, welcome to the forum. Whereabouts in Kent are you? As a 90+ year old “cine maniac “ I am not as mobile as I used to be but may be able to advise you.😉
                  Thank you Ken, I am on the Kent Sussex boarder, so a bit of a way the other side of the county, and also I am not as mobile as I once was. Grateful of any suggestions please, and if I could make my across Kent, I would be pleased to meet for a chat.

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                  • #10
                    The Philips-Paillard-Bolex Synchronizer to the 18-5 contains a three-lobes cam that actuates an electrical contact, that’s all. The projector has a brushless asynchronous motor being switched on and off three times a second (the coupling wheel driven by the magnetic tape has one second equivalent circumference). Time and again the current can be interrupted in the moment the advance claw reaches the end of its trajectory. This results in jerks on the screen, image steadiness is seriously compromised. One of the worst sound coupler systems there ever was

                    About the P. 8 I have to explain that it takes a complete dismantling for access to the gears, no afternoon pleasure. I do such service, cost is considerable. I am planning to collocate the material for a modernisation. That would include a new brushless synchronous motor, timing belt on toothed discs, a larger fan, and oil wicks for the drive. The projector would run at 16 fps at the accuracy of the grid frequency. Transformer would be removed, motor and lamp fed directly from mains. Price towards about CHF 500.

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                    • #11
                      Hi, Chris, sounds as if you may be located around the Tenterden/ Bodiam area. I had a fellow film enthusiast friend who lived near there for many years, so know that area well. Also the Kent and East Sussex, and “Bluebell” line railways. I use a Eumig 810d for film to dvd transfers. The projector speed is controlled by an electronic circuit supplied by a fellow forum member many years ago. If you care to send me Private Message with your cotta details we could at least have a chat.

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                      • #12
                        Sorry Chris! I miss typed the word “contact”. Should have checked before hitting Send! 😳

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