Rewind Overflow and Super-8

[Steve Klare]

So, I took out a film tonight and watched it. Then I rewound it. This one was maybe an even 200 Feet on a 200 Foot reel, and silent. It's been on the same reel since I bought it new about 40 years ago. When I took it out of the box, it fit there comfortably: plenty of flange left above the film surface.

-and then I rewound it, and it overflowed the reel.

It rewound loosely and as the rewind was getting closer and closer to the end, a bulge developed in the film which climbed over the top.

Getting it back in captivity took some time and a lot of patience! (I had Super Chief on Raton all over the dining room table at one point!)

I tried a different reel, I tried a different projector, nothing helped. I even tried dragging a fingertip on the take-up reel to increase the film tension.

It seems to me that as the film piled up, it also weaved side to side, and this extra width was helping it to climb the flanges.

I gave up and grabbed a 400 Foot reel, and it's now stashed in the delinquent film pile. (-BAD Film!)

This is not the first one I've had turn bad like this, and ideas what's going on here?

[Joseph Banfield]

Steve, I have a couple of films like you describe that do exactly the same. I hope someone here will have a solution because that drives me nuts too!

[Oliver Feld]

Steve, could it be, that the projector gave the film some dust/dirt? Then just try some film cleaning, just in case?
I had this problem with a 16mm film. It matched the reel perfectly, but the film was full of splices and made a rewind on the same reel impossible. After a soft cleaning everything worked fine again.

[Chip Gelmini]

Check for perforation damage hold the reel up to a light and look through the film itself between the flanges. If you see light leaks, then you have perforation damage, which was perhaps caused by improper auto loading. It may not be your situation, but I've seen it quite a few times also referred to as a "lumpy" print because it does not rewind tight and smooth during the Rewind process

[Steve Klare]

I got an e-mail from a Steve Osborne recommending FilmGuarding this one. It makes sense: friction between the layers of film will reduce the "slide" among them and keep them from winding tightly. Slippery film should naturally wind tighter. (Thanks, Steve!)

Tighter wind=room on the reel for more layers of film=more film on the reel before it spills off the edge.

Even the possibility that the edges of the film are being forced outward against the flanges and are climbing them can't gain the same traction without sufficient friction.

I have FilmGuard, which I've haven't gotten around to trying because I'm a little spooked about over-application.

These are Desperate Times: I'll give it a try!

[Shane C. Collins]

I got an e-mail from a Steve Osborne recommending FilmGuarding this one. It makes sense: friction between the layers of film will reduce the "slide" among them and keep them from winding tightly. Slippery film should naturally wind tighter. (Thanks, Steve!)

Tighter wind=room on the reel for more layers of film=more film on the reel before it spills off the edge.

Even the possibility that the edges of the film are being forced outward against the flanges and are climbing them can't gain the same traction without sufficient friction.

I have FilmGuard, which I've haven't gotten around to trying because I'm a little spooked about over-application.

These are Desperate Times: I'll give it a try!

I've used Filmguard many times over the years, and it's a great product! The key here is not to overdo it with your use of Filmguard. I usually apply a small dap to a piece of cloth. Then run the film on some rewinds, and between my index finger, and thumb. For an extra dirty or dried film I apply a bit more of the product on the cloth. I do one pass, as described, then a second pass with a dry cloth to absorb more product. I once had a film that was so dry it shuttered through the projector. The image was not steady or watchable. I applied some Filmguard, and the film has played like new ever since. The great thing about Filmguard is its ability to both clean, and lubricate film. I treat all my currently shot Ektachrome home movies with Filmguard once a year. I've noticed those films just glide through the projector, and have noticed film scratches are less visible. I think it even prevents scratches from occurring during a show!

[Steve Klare]

Hi Shane,

I'm more on the "dry" side between "dry" and "dirty" in this case: it looked nice up on screen.

I feel inclined to practice this somehow! Doug is a frequent applicator of FilmGuard at CineSea, and I've always wanted to ask for a tutorial, but that ship sailed a month ago!

It's either wait five months or just do my best!

[Shane C. Collins]

Hi Shane,

I'm more on the "dry" side between "dry" and "dirty" in this case: it looked nice up on screen.

I feel inclined to practice this somehow! Doug is a frequent applicator of FilmGuard at CineSea, and I've always wanted to ask for a tutorial, but that ship sailed a month ago!

It's either wait five months or just do my best!

Steve,

I think once you start to use Filmguard, you will get the hang of it in no time! after doing one or two reels, you'll be at the pro level...

I wanted to also mention it, Filmguard takes many months to fully dry. But, that's the beauty of this product. It's ability to stay wet on the film, and keeping the film lubricated. I have noticed my films pack better once they have been treated. This is especially true when I receive "green" prints back from the lab.

[Douglas Meltzer]

Steve,

Shane just gave you that tutorial! We both use the same method.

[Rob Young]

Steve, once you start using Filmguard I don't think you'll ever look back. Great advice from Shane about application. Obviously you'll need lint free cloths; I use 100% white cotton, washed a couple of times to remove any starch, but each to their own. I find its worth checking the cloth every 50ft or so for any potential dirt and changing to a clean area of cloth. Personally, I prefer to take my time and wind slowly. And, as has been said, definitely have a dry clean to remove excess and smooth out application.

Just don't over applicate, honestly a few drops will probably do a 200ft length. I've been using it now for...gulp...20 years (how did THAT happen?!) and I'm still on the same bottle. When you take out a print from years back that hasn't been run since, it still runs smoothy.

Oh and don't panic if you do see some discolouration on the cloth or signs of brown oxide from the mag stripes, depending on the print I'd say this is pretty normal within reason and won't do any harm.

You're gonna love this stuff!

[Matthieu van der Sluis]

Me too